Wot, no Daleks?

Due to a dispute between the BBC and the estate of the late Terry Nation over editorial control, the Daleks will not feature in the new series of Dr Who:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertain...io/3859651.stm

Let me guess, in the years since we last saw the Doctor, there has been a peace treaty between the Daleks and every other species in the known universe, and in fact a Dalek now serves aboard the Tardis as tactical officer. I can see why Mrs Nation didn't fancy it.

It begs the question though, if they don't let the Daeks appear in Dr Who, what else are they going to do with them? Sounds like the Nation estate has cut off its nose to spite its face to me.

[dilli-theclaw]

They've changed the text of that report....

Originally it had a part that said the family were worried that the Daleks would be portrayed as too evil.

I mean - what do they want - fluffy Daleks?

Originally Posted by dilligaf1701

They've changed the text of that report....

Originally it had a part that said the family were worried that the Daleks would be portrayed as too evil.

I mean - what do they want - fluffy Daleks?

Well, you know, it's the fashion. Evil old Darth Vader was revealed to be a fundamentally damaged teenager with freudian issues over the kidnap of his mother, and not the pure evil baddy we once loved to hate. Perhaps Mrs Nation wanted the Beeb to suggest the Daleks aren't bad really, they just have low self esteem due to being genetically modified and locked in a metal cabinet from birth.

Originally Posted by towny

It begs the question though, if they don't let the Daeks appear in Dr Who, what else are they going to do with them? Sounds like the Nation estate has cut off its nose to spite its face to me.

Perhaps the estate will try and do their own production with them. There were Dalek comic strips in the 80s that didn`t feature the Doctor at all, rather a Dalek hunter called Absolom Daak.

I`m more concerned about whether this is going to have a knock-on effect when they have to negotiate for the rights to other aspects of the show. Are we going to lose all the other classics such as Cybermen, Sea Devils, Silurians, etc.?

[SMHarman]

The BBC and others involved have not been very clever in their negotiations with Nation and then his estate over this. I think there was a running dispute before his death over merchandising, Dr Who rerun fees, DVD production, the works.

B7, another Nation classic, and Survivors, have not had such problems, the negotiaitons were handled properly.

Maybe this is the estate performing rhinoplasty, but I strongly believe it is also carrying out the late Mr Nations wishes.

Originally Posted by dr wadd

Perhaps the estate will try and do their own production with them. There were Dalek comic strips in the 80s that didn`t feature the Doctor at all, rather a Dalek hunter called Absolom Daak.

I`m more concerned about whether this is going to have a knock-on effect when they have to negotiate for the rights to other aspects of the show. Are we going to lose all the other classics such as Cybermen, Sea Devils, Silurians, etc.?

I've heard it mentioned a few times over the years that Terry Nation retained the rights to the Daleks. He actually withdrew permission to use them once, in the late 60s, leading to a storyline which concluded with the Doctor (Patrick Troughton) declaring the Daleks to be finally destroyed. Nation then went off and tried to get together a Daleks TV series, which never went anywhere, and then came crawling back to the BBC. I expect if this new series proves to be a success - and therefore the only viable vehicle for Nation's estate to make any more money out of the Daleks - the same will happen again.

I don't know whether Nation's rights deal with the BBC over the Daleks was unique due to his already being an established fantasy/sci fi writer or common, in which case a lot of other people could make claims on their own monsters. Somehow I doubt they would be so stupid, however. Where exactly are they going to earn royalties off the cybermen or the sea devils if not in Dr Who?

Originally Posted by towny

I don't know whether Nation's rights deal with the BBC over the Daleks was unique due to his already being an established fantasy/sci fi writer or common, in which case a lot of other people could make claims on their own monsters. Somehow I doubt they would be so stupid, however. Where exactly are they going to earn royalties off the cybermen or the sea devils if not in Dr Who?

One of the strange things about Doctor Who is that for at least a very long period of time (and perhaps the entire run, I`m not sure) the creators of any creatures or enemies actually retained all rights to those creations, irrespective of whether they were an established writer or not.

It would be very easy to do a spin-off with any of the creatures without featuring any of the established Who continuity. There would be plenty of scope to do Cybermen stories with a different protagonist.

Originally Posted by dr wadd

One of the strange things about Doctor Who is that for at least a very long period of time (and perhaps the entire run, I`m not sure) the creators of any creatures or enemies actually retained all rights to those creations, irrespective of whether they were an established writer or not.

It would be very easy to do a spin-off with any of the creatures without featuring any of the established Who continuity. There would be plenty of scope to do Cybermen stories with a different protagonist.

What, like Starfleet? I always said the Borg were cybermen done properly.

[Nemesis]

Originally Posted by towny

What, like Starfleet? I always said the Borg were cybermen done properly.

Where's Lufty's when you need him ???

[SMHarman]

Interesting news snippet.

No Daleks for Dr Who revival
The Dr Who revival may have to go ahead without the Timelord's most notorious enemies - the Daleks.

The wheeled would-be galactic tyrants may have to sit out the new series of the cult sci-fi TV show, because of a dispute between the BBC and the Daleks' creator's estate.

The rights to the Daleks are jointly owned by the BBC and Terry Nation, who died in 1997 - and Mr Nation's estate is refusing the BBC permission to use the shrill-voiced aliens.

Ananova quotes an insider, who explained, 'He told the executors never to let the BBC use the Daleks again. Fans want to see the Daleks return, but they may be disappointed.'

The BBC has acknowledged that talks are continuing.

http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=cac...dispute+&hl=en

>> Just out of interest - what was this dispute about Daleks? Are we
talking about a
>> similarity to the one suggestion for Star One - that the Andromedans be
replaced by
>> Daleks?
>
>I don't know if this is the specific reason but there has always been a
hazy area
>about who actually owns the rights to the Daleks.

There's never been any haze - Terry Nation has always been the guy with the
rights! Because he was not a member of BBC staff when he created the concept
of the Daleks he was able to copyright them, just in time for the Dalekmania
merchandising boom of the 1960s. Raymond Cusick, the BBC staff designer who
actually came up with the visual form of the Dalek we all know and love, was
paid something like 100 pounds (quite a lot of money at the time) as a
goodwill gesture, but has since received nothing, because it's BBC policy
that all work created by staff members automatically becomes the property of
the Corporation.

>If Nation was supprised by the end of Blakes 7, then he may not have been
that
>cooperative with the Beeb over future Dalek stories. Back in the mid 80's
there were
>rumours rattling around that Nation intended to produce American shows
based on the
>seven and/or the Daleks after some bust up with the Beeb.

There was never a bust-up as such. Back in the late 60s, with Dalekmania
apparently beginning to wane in the UK, Nation decided that there was
potential to exploit the Daleks in their own series on the American market.
The BBC agreed that they'd reached the end of their shelf-life and seemed
happy to lose them from Dr.Who, so they were seen to be killed off once and
for all in a Patrick Troughton story (I think it was Evil of the Daleks) and
Nation took himself off to Los Angeles, where he singularly failed to sell
the idea to the Americans!

Obviously, when the BBC asked to use them in Dr.Who again in the 70s he
agreed, and everything carried on as before. Nation still needs to give
permission for any use of the Daleks, and is required to be given first
refusal as scriptwriter for Dalek stories.

And I'm *so* glad they never turned up in B7... =;-)

Gareth

http://b7.cyberpomo.com/id/14027

[scrotnig]

I'm a big WHO fan, but the daleks were totally unconvincing and boring...as were the bloody cybermen.

The only Dalek story that works is the excellent Genesis of the Daleks, written by Nation himself, however this story couldn have worked equally well with purpose-created monsters, the Daleks just fitted the jigsaw nicely.

Doctor Who will manage ok without them. Some of my fave stories were in early to mid eighties, when the Daleks were not even used at all.

[MetaWraith]

I'm wondering if The Master will make an appearance, and if so who will play him.

[scrotnig]

Well sadly not Anthony Ainley since he's dead.

[MetaWraith]

exactly, hence the question