VERY VERY worrying - Page 6

kronas · 29-06-2003, 21:27

Quote:

Originally posted by Russ D
I believe the problem with that way of thinking is the (IMO) foolish notion that just because we are the technologically dominant species, this give us the right to make up the rules as we go along.

The world is not ours. We are just tenants. Neither is the right to manipulate life. We do not control life, it is bigger than we ever will be. Whatever you believe in which created life, that is who/what makes such decisions.

in escense i believe that and agree with you i may think it was all nature and not god related but i am certainly against the tampering/modification of this type

paulyoung666 · 29-06-2003, 21:28

but it is human nature to want to control life , as long as it is tempered with caution i dont see what the problem is

kronas · 29-06-2003, 21:30

Quote:

Originally posted by paulyoung666
but it is human nature to want to control life , as long as it is tempered with caution i dont see what the problem is

it wont through will it the ethical thing is let nature take its course you tamper you will pay the price maybe the death of whatever you tampered with but ultimately we have evolved through various species by nature taking its course and so the cycle should progress naturally

paulyoung666 · 29-06-2003, 21:32

Quote:

Originally posted by kronas
it wont through will it the ethical thing is let nature take its course you tamper you will pay the price maybe the death of whatever you tampered with but ultimately we have evolved through various species by nature taking its course and so the cycle should progress naturally

back to the old argument then , say for instance you have a child with a problem and you are offered the chance to save its life by a tampered with baby are you going to take the offer or not , i know i would

kronas · 29-06-2003, 21:34

Quote:

Originally posted by paulyoung666
back to the old argument then , say for instance you have a child with a problem and you are offered the chance to save its life by a tampered with baby are you going to take the offer or not , i know i would

yeah but it depends how the problem can be solved

paulyoung666 · 29-06-2003, 21:39

Quote:

Originally posted by kronas
yeah but it depends how the problem can be solved

by which you mean what , i am saying to you that the only way to save your child is to genetically engineer another one to save the first , how would you react to that ????? , this is of course nothing personal and i hope it never happens to anyone here

kronas · 29-06-2003, 21:42

Quote:

Originally posted by paulyoung666
by which you mean what , i am saying to you that the only way to save your child is to genetically engineer another one to save the first , how would you react to that ????? , this is of course nothing personal and i hope it never happens to anyone here

to create another to GE it no i would not also financal implications would be a major factor i understand your point but im afraid im deadset against the tampering of nature especially human nature it will lead to more unethical woes in the future

King Blimp · 29-06-2003, 21:50

Quote:

Originally posted by kronas
im afraid im deadset against the tampering of nature especially human nature it will lead to more unethical woes in the future

Russ and Kronas, I understand your concerns but this brings us back to something Nogger brought up earlier:

Quote:

Originally posted by nogger
But God didn't create modern cows, sheep, horses, roses, wheat and lots of other stuff. We did.

The "traditional" British landscape is largely man-made and not natural at all. We've been messing with nature for a few thousand years.

If you are against any tampering of genetics you would have to live a pretty spartan life... The truth is our lives are full of examples of genetic manipulation

paulyoung666 · 29-06-2003, 21:54

Quote:

Originally posted by kronas
to create another to GE it no i would not also financal implications would be a major factor i understand your point but im afraid im deadset against the tampering of nature especially human nature it will lead to more unethical woes in the future

so you would let your child die , and not even attempt to help it , forget about the money for a mo , dont forget this is nothing personal , i dont want or need a flame war

kronas · 29-06-2003, 22:37

Quote:

Originally posted by King Blimp
Russ and Kronas, I understand your concerns but this brings us back to something Nogger brought up earlier:

If you are against any tampering of genetics you would have to live a pretty spartan life... The truth is our lives are full of examples of genetic manipulation

i dont know the ins and outs of evoloution but im sure nature played its part in those instances btw i am talking about human modification as the mmain focal point for my objection

Quote:

Originally posted by paulyoung666
so you would let your child die , and not even attempt to help it , forget about the money for a mo , dont forget this is nothing personal , i dont want or need a flame war

ofcourse i would do anything to protect my child even though i refuse to have any until i see fit interms of something to change my mind but i would not use GE

paulyoung666 · 29-06-2003, 23:11

sorry mate but i cannot see how you can say you would not use ge if you had the option to

kronas · 29-06-2003, 23:29

Quote:

Originally posted by paulyoung666
sorry mate but i cannot see how you can say you would not use ge if you had the option to

i just did didnt i things happen for a reason i will do anything almost to protect the child except that

patrickp · 30-06-2003, 00:20

Quote:

Originally posted by kronas
i dont know the ins and outs of evoloution but im sure nature played its part in those instances btw i am talking about human modification as the mmain focal point for my objection

Few if any of the domestic animals (dogs, cats, horses, cows, pigs, sheep, chickens etc etc) or domestic plants (eg most crops, garden flowers etc) would exist in anything like their current forms if humans had not bred them to it.

And, while humans may not be doing much in the way of deliberately altering themselves yet, we've already been considerably changed because we're a social animal. And we're still in the middle of it - the fact that humans are so prone to circulatory problems, back problems, hernia problems etc is because we're still adapting to being bipeds.

Our society and technology are changing us whether we want it or not. So, if it's going to happen to us anyway, why not try to direct it to some extent?

And, since it's something that people are going to start doing anyway, it would be wise to start developing ways to deal with it rather than deluding ourselves that it can't happen here.

30-06-2003, 14:47

If these people have their way it will be like going into a supermarket, what sort of baby do you want? Boy or a Girl, how high would you like it to grow? What colour would you like it's hair to be? It ought to be stopped before it gets out of hand.

30-06-2003, 14:58

I dont disagree with any of this, genetics happens, the more we learn the more help we can give other people.
Look at the stem cell technology being investigated atm. Look how that branch of genetics is going to benefit amputies, people with severed spinal cords etc. Who are we to deny that choice to these people?

Ok so maybe it is slightly worrying to know that people can have the child they always wanted, but hang on, why is that actually bad? surely giving someone the chance to fullfill their dreams is one of the best things humans can actually do for each other.
The only time a situation like this could become horrific is if it was not guided and controled by a select panel of experts.

To put it quite simply it will not be like walking into a supermarket etc. What it will do, is eliminate things like cystic fibrosis, downs syndrome, spina bifida and a whole other range of genetic defects that DESTROY the life of the child.