Junior Doctors Prepare For First Full Walk-Out

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by martyh

Yes they did ,this letter dated 12th feb 2016 superseded the links you provided with updated negotiations between NHS Employers and the BMA with AGREED terms.

http://www.nhsemployers.org/~/media/...M%20120216.pdf

Thanks for the update

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

Nomad, I am talking in context about Pasrking Fees here for NHS staff.

The Junior Drs took full legal advice on the strike action. This is why there was a full walk out.

It appears some members don't believe that the action behind the strike, is worthwile and wrong.

I have seen through my work what these Drs have to go through in hospitals, its no joke I would not like to be a Drs, they work hard for many years to be a Dr, and get treated like dirt by the Government.

The Government cannot treat Public Sector workers, as if they don't exist. They get 1% pay rise. While, the Government keep giving themselves pay rise.

Irs not right

Routine parking is a matter for the individual hospitals. There is nothing new in the contract about routine parking, so why wasn't it an issue prior to 2010?

Treated like dirt? 13.5% increase, reduced hours, limits on long or weekend or night shifts improved. Nasty stuff indeed.

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

Nomad, I am talking in context about Pasrking Fees here for NHS staff.

The Junior Drs took full legal advice on the strike action. This is why there was a full walk out.

It appears some members don't believe that the action behind the strike, is worthwile and wrong.

I have seen through my work what these Drs have to go through in hospitals, its no joke I would not like to be a Drs, they work hard for many years to be a Dr, and get treated like dirt by the Government.

The Government cannot treat Public Sector workers, as if they don't exist. They get 1% pay rise. While, the Government keep giving themselves pay rise.

Irs not right

Arthur, do you have a link showing the legal advice Doctors obtained about the walk-out, please?

All I could find was this...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/nhs/...r-doctors.html

The British Medical Association ignored the advice of its own lawyers before launching a judicial review over new contracts for junior doctors, it has emerged.

Although lawyers said the planned legal action had a better than even chance of success, they added that the Government could easily overcome this challenge and continue with the imposition.

And they warned the union that its review will “definitely not” prevent the health secretary from imposing a contract on England’s 37,000 junior doctors.

The lawyers advised that there was nothing “inherently unlawful” about the Government’s proposed contract.

They concluded that the judicial review should instead be seen as a “last throw of the dice” – with its main potential benefit being a new window of opportunity for the junior doctors’ committee to secure further improvements to the contract about to Be imposed.

[Osem]

Don't be holding your breath...

[dave6x]

Surprise, surprise, it looks like the "Junior Doctor" wheeled out to defend the government's position to the media is a fake!

http://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/20...ctor-isnt.html

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by dave6x

Surprise, surprise, it looks like the "Junior Doctor" wheeled out to defend the government's position to the media is a fake!

http://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/20...ctor-isnt.html

He still technically a junior doctor. Just as much as one on maternity leave. In fact under the current contract taking time out would still count as training. That wouldn't happen under the new contract and is one of the things they are bleating about. They are happy with the situation where a person who has been off work/training for 3 out of the last 6 years is ahead of somebody continuously working for 5 years. Doesn't sound fair or equal.

[dave6x]

Originally Posted by nomadking

He still technically a junior doctor. Just as much as one on maternity leave. In fact under the current contract taking time out would still count as training. That wouldn't happen under the new contract and is one of the things they are bleating about. They are happy with the situation where a person who has been off work/training for 3 out of the last 6 years is ahead of somebody continuously working for 5 years. Doesn't sound fair or equal.

To Quote from the link: His blog, once again, provides an answer: “I’m an FY1 doctor, with a huge interest in politics and healthcare policy”. What is “FY1”? Ah well. “FY” stands for Foundation Year: Adam Dalby is in his first year after graduating, but has not yet acquired sufficient experience to be let loose on his own. He’s the kind of doctor you might find “sitting in” with registrars or consultants when you visit the local hospital’s outpatients’ department.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by dave6x

To Quote from the link: His blog, once again, provides an answer: “I’m an FY1 doctor, with a huge interest in politics and healthcare policy”. What is “FY1”? Ah well. “FY” stands for Foundation Year: Adam Dalby is in his first year after graduating, but has not yet acquired sufficient experience to be let loose on his own. He’s the kind of doctor you might find “sitting in” with registrars or consultants when you visit the local hospital’s outpatients’ department.

What's your point?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-34798215

There are more than 50,000 junior doctors in England. The term covers those who are fresh out of medical school through to others who have a decade of experience behind them.

The new recruit

Who: Melody Redman, 25, from York
Job: Second year of foundation training

The first was spent in Scunthorpe Hospital, doing three four-month stints in different specialities, known as rotations. She worked in A&E, general surgery and gastroenterology.

At the moment, she is based at a GP practice, in the first of three rotations in her second year.

[Arthurgray50@blu]

Hugh. When the news was on ITV London, l believe the first day of the strike. It was said by the reporter, that Legal Advice had been sought, before striking on full walk out.

There is NO Link to that.

I think that deep down that the Drs, would not put patients at risk. If they knew it was wrong. Remember, they have made an oath.

The present problem is caused by Jeremy Hunt trying to enforce a new contract on them.

Does anyone know or have seen what is in the contract to cause the problem.

But, what l still cannot understand is why Hunt wont sit down and sort this out

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by dave6x

To Quote from the link: His blog, once again, provides an answer: “I’m an FY1 doctor, with a huge interest in politics and healthcare policy”. What is “FY1”? Ah well. “FY” stands for Foundation Year: Adam Dalby is in his first year after graduating, but has not yet acquired sufficient experience to be let loose on his own. He’s the kind of doctor you might find “sitting in” with registrars or consultants when you visit the local hospital’s outpatients’ department.

And if you go onto the official website to use the pay calculator for the new contract for JUNIOR DOCTORS, FY1 is an option and therefore they are affected by the new contract.

From 3 August 2016, the 2016 contract will start to be introduced in England for GP trainees and trainees in hospital posts approved for postgraduate medical/dental education.

From actual new contract

5. The agreed minimum period of notice by both sides for doctors employed under these terms and conditions of service, unless the statutory minimum periods of notice as set out above, are longer, shall be as follows: F1 F2 StR (Core Training) (CT) StR (Fixed Term Specialty Training Appointment) Dental Foundation Trainee (LDFT or DFT) Dental Core Trainee (DCT)
...
3. The following doctors will be granted transitional pay protection under the arrangements described in this Schedule 14 at paragraphs 4 to 20 with effect from 3 August 2016:
a. All doctors remaining on F1 or remaining on F2 as at 3 August 2016
...
34. Study leave for Foundation Year 1 doctors will take the form of a regular scheduled teaching/training session (or similar arrangement) as agreed locally.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by nomadking

And if you go onto the official website to use the pay calculator for the new contract for JUNIOR DOCTORS, FY1 is an option and therefore they are affected by the new contract.



From actual new contract

Source please.

[dave6x]

Originally Posted by nomadking

And if you go onto the official website to use the pay calculator for the new contract for JUNIOR DOCTORS, FY1 is an option and therefore they are affected by the new contract.



From actual new contract

I bow to your greater knowledge, Thanks for researching that, unfortunately I have a life and have been out doing charity work this evening

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by pip08456

Source please.

I found it very easily, so why don't you? If you're going to post a claim of X, is it unreasonable to try and check it out first? I asked myself "are FY1/F1, junior doctors" and sought the truth rather than relying on others.

Originally Posted by pip08456

Source please.

http://www.nhsemployers.org/~/media/...ing%202016.pdf

---------- Post added at 09:39 ---------- Previous post was at 09:37 ----------

Originally Posted by Arthurgray50@blu

Hugh. When the news was on ITV London, l believe the first day of the strike. It was said by the reporter, that Legal Advice had been sought, before striking on full walk out.

There is NO Link to that.

I think that deep down that the Drs, would not put patients at risk. If they knew it was wrong. Remember, they have made an oath.

The present problem is caused by Jeremy Hunt trying to enforce a new contract on them.

Does anyone know or have seen what is in the contract to cause the problem.

But, what l still cannot understand is why Hunt wont sit down and sort this out

It has been stated a number of times that they have been discussing this since 2012...

Here is the contract

http://www.nhsemployers.org/~/media/...ing%202016.pdf

---------- Post added at 09:44 ---------- Previous post was at 09:39 ----------

Originally Posted by dave6x

I bow to your greater knowledge, Thanks for researching that, unfortunately I have a life and have been out doing charity work this evening

I googled 'new junior doctors contract', and it was in the first (non-advert) link - took me around 20 seconds in total...

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=ne...obile&ie=UTF-8

Then 4 click-thru's

http://www.nhsemployers.org/your-wor...ctors-contract

http://www.nhsemployers.org/your-wor...junior-doctors

http://www.nhsemployers.org/case-stu...ons-of-service

http://www.nhsemployers.org/~/media/...ing%202016.pdf