underage sex - Page 4

Russ · 22-08-2003, 09:24

Coggy that's hardly fair. As Lord Nik says, some of these kids dress to look older and manage it pull it off quite successfully. I have a 16 year old neice who for the last year or so has been dressing 'older' and it certainly is effective, to the point that it causes great concern for her parents.

cjll3 · 22-08-2003, 09:46

Quote:

Originally posted by Russ D
Do you think a girl should be punished too if the situation was reversed?

A girl is highly unlikely to want casual sex at that age. So a direct comparisum is very unfair.

zoombini · 22-08-2003, 09:47

I have a 13 year old son.
He looks 13.
His classmate who is also 13 is 6 foot and looks 16.

The difference between 14 & 16 is so small that it can be almost impossible to tell.

Not an excuse for her though.

Lord Nikon · 22-08-2003, 09:48

With respect to this, I also think the Law should be changed.
As it stands an adult who has sex with an underage person is charged and the child isn't named for legal reasons.

If however they met in a club, as a result of the child dressing and passing through club security as someone over 18, and therefore over the age of consent then they should also name the child and lay some of the blame for the incident on them. After all, had they not deceived the management of the club, the staff of the club and with it, the patrons of the club, then the situation would never have arisen.

If someone takes these steps to deceive so many people into thinking they are of legal age for alcohol, then they also should take responsibility for their actions.

Currently when you meet someone in a club you have to attempt to be relatively certain that they are old enough, and if the door staff couldn't tell while sober, then how are you supposed to tell when you have been drinking? Yet as the law stands you are responsible even in this circumstance, which, in my opinion is ludicrous.

Not that I am saying that alcohol is a viable excuse for underage sex, merely that responsibility has to lie on the shoulders of the person who initially set out to deceive. In this case it would also be the person we normally see as a victim, at least in the current eyes of a blinkered legal system.

22-08-2003, 10:17

Thats a tangled issue, I am pretty sure the law states that whilst under the influence of alcohol you actually are not responsible for your actions. (mainly referring to minor indescretions but this is always overlooked as the fact you allowed yourself to get into such a state of intoxication in the first place. But even then you are under the influence

) . I am fairly certain this has been used in drink driving cases.
How ever as you rightly pointed out in this scenario the adult would be hounded by the police and placed on the sex offenders register. The youngster would be told off.

Lord Nikon · 22-08-2003, 10:41

My point is more one of INTENT.

When someone underage goes into a club, they set out with the intent to deceive people into thinking they are older than they are.

A person in the club, has reason to believe that the people in there are over the age of consent, given that on the door of the club it says over 18s only, or 21, or 25 in some cases.

That person has no reason therefore to assume that the person they are talking to is anything other than a minimum of 2 years over the age of consent.

Should they then discover that the person they slept with is younger than the age of consent they are then in a position where they can be charged with anything from indecent assault, assault through to statutory rape. This is wrong, they had no intent to seduce a minor, they had valid reason to assume they were of legal age, and met them in an environment where they should have been legally old enough in the first place.

The underage party in this case is the one who is to blame.

They set out with the intent of deceiving people into thinking they were over 18 (and, given that they were in the club they had achieved it)

It should therefore fall on the underage person to be named and shamed as they were the only person who was less than honest in the situation, and the person of legal age in this case becomes the victim, yet in this circumstance the law is reversed, the victim becomes the criminal, and the criminal becomes the victim....

Russ · 22-08-2003, 10:51

Quote:

Originally posted by cjll3
A girl is highly unlikely to want casual sex at that age. So a direct comparisum is very unfair.

What a load of sexist claptrap! A girls in her mid teens is likely to find the attentions of an older man to be very attractive.

**Maggy** · 22-08-2003, 11:15

Quote:

Originally posted by Russ D
Coggy that's hardly fair. As Lord Nik says, some of these kids dress to look older and manage it pull it off quite successfully. I have a 16 year old neice who for the last year or so has been dressing 'older' and it certainly is effective, to the point that it causes great concern for her parents.

However she IS 16 and considered capable of consent by the law.

My suggestion is that if you can't be certain be very careful.After all does one go straight to bed with anyone in this day of AIDS?Surely you try to get to know a person before having sex with them?Not just go off with ANYONE after meeting them in a nightclub?
If the answer to any of the above is no then you are truly heading for some trouble.The onus is on the individual to beware.After all saying after wards that you didn't know is no defence in the eyes of the law and the defence of drunkeness won't protect you either.
However this complaint about not knowing how old a girl is is a very common one.I would have thought that by now men would have heard enough scare stories in the media to be concerned enough to check beyond a doubt.

This woman was supposedly a middle age mother with children of her own.She DID know how old that child was.She was a b*tch.

Incog.

Lord Nikon · 22-08-2003, 11:17

Incognitas, in this particular case I agree, the woman was to blame, but if you read my post (51) then there are circumstances where the lines are not so clear cut.

zoombini · 22-08-2003, 11:21

Not wanting to be rude about the woman in this case but..

Being a fat minger she might be a bit less likely to be too careful...

The lad would have though his boat had come in & it was xmas, the 2nd time he would have thought he was onto such a good thing having been there before & not knowing any different.

Maybe he got some stick off of his mates when he told them & they knew who she was.

"?? sh@66ed a fat minger!" type stick..

Perhaps he then got shamed into telling his dad.
"dad, whats wrong with sh@66ing a fat minger?"..

Lord Nikon · 22-08-2003, 11:23

She Does look like a bulldog licking p***s off a nettle though lol

even at 14 I am sure I would have had better taste in women than he had lol

zoombini · 22-08-2003, 11:33

You have to wonder if perhaps he was her childs classmate & if they are mates any more...

& if he used and mates...

Russ · 22-08-2003, 12:31

Moving away from whether or not you feel she's attractive, it still stands that society does not seem to view this crime as serious as the reversed situation.

Can she expect to have a brick through her window, or graffiti on her walls?

Lord Nikon · 22-08-2003, 12:33

Its those old dual standards again Russ...

People are more willing to lay the blame on the man than the woman, no matter what.

cjll3 · 22-08-2003, 13:24

Quote:

Originally posted by Russ D
What a load of sexist claptrap! A girls in her mid teens is likely to find the attentions of an older man to be very attractive.

Older men are more like to know how to treat a girl, so yes they are more attractive. However girls are less likely to want casual sex then boys, and are more interested in the relationship and being loved.

You try suggesting to Kink, Debsy or Incog that you only talk to them because you want to screw them and see what kind of reaction you get .... but stand well back!

Quote:

Moving away from whether or not you feel she's attractive, it still stands that society does not seem to view this crime as serious as the reversed situation.

This is a totally different situation to say a care worker forcing himself on a child. Yes she's wrong for not rejecting his attentions, but he is not entirely without blame.