Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

haha i'm not saying that i use 5GB a day! it was just an example

the suposed cap... say if I go over it will my net cut? Or can i continue to use it.

I suppose if we can still use it, and then they warn only the people who keep going over then its ok

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

You will not be cut (off). You will have the choice of having your speed reduced, or buying extra allowance (or if applicable, upgrade your service). :D

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Would there be any chance of NTL offering an extra Tier for the power users, that have to download 24/7. But i would still like to know what people are downloading to necessitate the need for over 1gig a day.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Upgrade to what?

Origianly the rumours had 2 mb as 30gig a month and 3mb as 40gig a month but it's been released with the one cap fits all mentality again. If on 2mb you upgrade to 3mb and presto you are downloading more.

Infect NTL have nowhere for you to upgrade to at present, The 1 gig a day is a problem as it can be broken yet if it was listed as 30gig a month you would know after a heavy session to slow down for the rest of the month.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

erm, like I said, if applicable (i.e from the 1M to the 2M).

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

that is all they can upgrade the 2mb can't upgrade like I orignally planned if 30gig wasn't enough with 4 sharing the connection.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

It's called a leased line. No-one short of a pretty large business needs to be downloading 24/7, infact a lot of the business usage graphs I've seen pale in comparison to a lot of the heavier residential users, although that's what having to use a connection for business purposes rather than warez does.

Considering these guys are paying hundreds of pounds a month for their services, the only advantage they have is the service level guarantee really.

Didn't this thread die a very long time ago?

Don't we already have an *all* cap related thread open?!?!

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

:LOL:

Dont spoil it

I have had my deck chair out waiting for the normal anti cap members to turn up :D

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Eh???

Your logic makes NO sense...

so if theyre on 1mb, and they are constantly downloading more than 1Gb per day..... if they upgrade to 2Mb what happens??? oh thats right... they're still only aloud 1Gb per day so will get to it faster... why on earth would ntl make this an option???

NTL : Hi, you have been going over your 1Gb per day bandwidth allowance too often

Customer : Im ever so sorry, what should i do?

NTL : Well you can upgrade if you, this will mean you can download even more

Customer : Yeah ok, sounds like a good idea....



:rolleyes:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

1mb from now looks to be hard capped, 2mb/3mb are 'guideline usage'.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Err, the 1Mb service is capped at 3 Gig per month. I believe the customer also has the option of reducing their speed to 56K or paying extra to download more.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

ahhhh.... my bad...

but still... are NTL really gonna recommend that people upgrade to 3mb from 2mb?? that would be ludicrous... they must have some sort of "over usage purchase" option.... rather than charging per Gb :S

And also, is this about them looking after all their clients? or charging the heavy users more? i.e. if i paid the overusage, im still gonna do as much damage to the other people... but ntl would pocket more

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

really?

can i have an opinion please
if i upgrade for free (on 300k atm) will i recieve a cap at all, or is the cap already in place?

I don't want 3GB a month, if i stay on 300k will i still have the current/no cap?

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Apology accepted. :cool:

There is no difference in the 2M/3M service as far as usage is concerned, so no, it wouldn't be a sensible option, and as far as I know, no one said it would be. (hence the words if applicable)

As far as I can see, it's a way to discourage heavy users, people will think twice when it's going to cost them more. I'm 100% sure that ntl would like the heavy users to leave for other ISP's.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I think the current 300K service will stay around for the forseeable future and will have a 30 Gig a month cap. The 1Mb service has a 3 Gig cap for the same price. You could say it's Swings and Roundabouts. Each has an advantage and disadvantage.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Hmmm i suppose, but then surely in the long run, they would lose that money...

I wonder how much of their BB network is built up of "heavy" users..... :confused:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Upgrade to business lite, where its unmetered for parts of the day, get a paper contract which shows them allowing you to use for home purposes so if later someone decides to boot you off for not using for business purposes then you have something legal to make that invalid.

Downside is high install fee and 2 year contract, but it is an option that doesnt cost an arm and a leg for those who cant get ADSL.

Ignition I have to ask if this question if you could possibly answer it please as I have seen others ask but with no response, what would NTL do in a situation where AOL cable users who of course have no cap are saturating a ubr, and an upgrade is very expensive.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

:shrug:

I can't actually do corporate policy, customer support, engineering, etc, etc, all at once. There is fair use in the AOL T+Cs though, draw from that what you will.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Hopefully all you big users and moaners will leave Ntl and we will all benefit then. There is a download cap to make it fair for all. Anyone whose teenage children are downloading all the time are probably breaking the law anyway - it is illegal to download movies etc from a lot of the sites the kids use. (I know not all is illegal, but I doubt many kids pay for it). Ntl speeds are far superior to any others, and if you go to Bt or other I hope you live nice and close to the (hee hee). Can't wait to see Bt's results from their ADSL 2+ trials!!!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technolog...665.stmxchange

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Who is moaning. NTL are increasing the speeds but starting to impose caps. Other companies are also increasing the speed but no caps, I do not see the point in this. Also if reports are true NTL are also testing ADSL2 so take from that what you will. NTL also have 95% of customers connected to copper where as BT only have 90%.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I know someone who works for one of the cable companies (and in a position to be informed on these things) and their view is that if someone is hitting the cap then they don't really want them as a customer. The companies would rather have 2 customers on the small packages using for 'normal' internet/email use than 1 power user, who is file-sharing/running servers etc.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Erm everyone's view is that way, every ISP would rather have every user pay their subs and use like 1MB a year with it, don't need to be an 'insider' to know this :)

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I think the technology we are talking about is ADSL2+. Did you read the article? Also other companies are increasing speeds with no caps but the price is not even close to Ntl. If you are a normal user and download amounts which are to be honest already fair, then you can't beat this. If you are downloading excessive amounts, then you should pay more. That is how things work in this world.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

If NTLs speeds are so great (and i think they are good), then how will you benefit from other customers leaving???

Are you saying big downloaders are affecting you, therefore meaning you dont have great speeds??

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

ep ADSL2+ is what I was talking about as well. it was a news item on http://www.adslguide.org.uk/newsarchive.asp?item=2154

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

If NTL start getting arsey then theres alwasy 4mbit no cap cable and wireless:

www.bulldogdsl.com

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Oh no, I have 3Mb which is great don't you think? No, I mean we would benefit from the moaners going, and those who give downloading a bad name. I read these sites out of interest and find it so amusing that people moan so much, but at the end of the day they know they won't get better or cheaper!!
__________________

But look at the price! It is cheap for the first couple of months, then goes up to nearly £30 a month. Plus you have to buy all the equipment at the beginning. Not all areas can have the 4Mb either...

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Everyone should lodge a complaint with the Trading Standards about the problems experienced with Ntl. On their website you can fill in a complaint form and send it immediately. Their response is excellent, the website is Hi Ronnie
Please report Ntl to the Trading Standards, the responded immediately to my complaint this morning and are investigating the matter. Their website is: http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/t...elservices.cfm:) click on Telephone & Mail Preferences then click on If you have a complaint which you would like trading standards to investigate or advise, please click here and follow the thread.
Goods Luck!

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Could it be any bigger? Just out of interest what do you suggest that people report NTL to trading standards for?

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Boy they are all coming out from under the bridge. Quick throw some food under there they might go back under :LOL:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Good luck with trading standards, NTL are doing nothing wrong.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

What on earth have the trading standards got to do with this??

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

:waving:Hi, can i just ask, the 3gb a month cap on the 1 meg speed, is it for downloading only or downloading and uploading. I ask because i have netmeter and if it is UL and DL then i'm screwed!
:LOL:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

The last word you used, It's upload and download the total used. :) well thats what I was told when I upgraded a few friends who are on the 1Mb service. I connect via remote assistance to their computers so I donââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t know how this will eat into their 3Gb limit and my 1Gb per day

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Hmm, i'm not bothered about the changes, however would it be bad to overuse the limit one day, say if i was just downloading linux?

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

It doesn't matter if you go overthe limit one day, so long as you don't do it consistently. Also, if you are on a 1 gb a day cap, then NTL say it doesn't matter as long as you don't go over 30gb in the whole month.

Hmmm now i wonder if they do the same for anyone on the 3gb a month cap......somehow i doubt it! :mis:


btw, what is linux?! lol sorry if that makes me sound daft!!:dunce:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I have been confused recently as to the inclusion of uploads in the limit.
This is a quote from the AUP, my underlining btw. (found here http://www.home.ntl.com/page/userpolicy&source=ntlworld)

"Normal use" of the service is defined as up to 1 gigabyte downstream of data transfer daily (which equates to approximately 200 music tracks, 650 short videos, 10,000 pictures or around 100 large software programmes downloaded per day).

To me, it clearly only states downloads and I would feel anyone would have a good argument if uploads were included. I would have thought the word traffic would be used if both were included.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

So by countering the download whores who pump 8gb+ a day, they offer the customers faster connections, so they can leech even faster. In my opinion, I'd be happy with a 1Mb connection being the maximum available if there was no download cap limit. How much bandwidth is available to each UBR then? I wonder how that compares with Telewest's UBR bandwidth setup...

It's strange really, because we got on NTL's 512k connection a few years ago as it was advertised for being better for people with more than one computer in their house. Having three computers in the house which all have access, this looked the best option. Couple of years later, they slap this download limit on us (after making a 1Mb service available which then went to 1.5Mb and now at 3Mb).
I was on the 1.5Mb connection (£37.99 pm) as I liked being able to get software/game updates quick and easy and I went through a phase of wanting to try different linux distros (this was shortly after all that with msblast etc came about :p). I've now "dropped" to a 2Mb service (£24.99 pm) because I don't see the extra speed worthwhile for what I use the internet for. It's still very quick getting my updates and the odd visit to the news-server.

NTL want to rephrase their caps in my opinion. Instead of 1Gb a day, it should be 50Gb a month maybe - I can often go over 1Gb a day over the period of a week (this I would imagine would earn me a cap letter?) but for the remainder of the month I may barely use the internet.

Like I said before... I signed up to an unlimited service. Had I wanted a cap, I would go to JJB and buy one or use "Wanadont" broadband. No, I have never downloaded over 200Gb a month... to be fair, I dont think I've ever done over 100Gb a month. To blame this on the people who use it a lot is a little unfair in my eyes. If NTL really want to teach these people a lesson, they should put all the persistant offenders onto the same UBR... let them fight for bandwidth between themselves - it'll be amazing to see the influx of calls to disconnections!

But like many other people have probably mentioned... we dont see Telewest incurring download limits on their connections, and their flagship package is 4Mb download with 384Kb upload - talk about a "download whore's" fantasy (well... apart from the huge pipes they appear to have in Japan and such places!)


It's like an alternative to Windows... because its mainly "Open Source" (i.e. the code that the program is made of is easily obtained), its highly customisable to a user's requirements. Its a lot more common these days after the vulnerabilities that Windows have (or had - depending on when updates come out and what they fix) have been greatly publicised and making people more aware about security.
However, Linux wont give you instant security - its like your house in a way... leave the window open and someone could try to get in. Computer security is similar - has lots of "windows" which open/close to allow traffic through them.

Errr... back to the 1Gb cap subject anyway :)

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Its a sad reality, alot of isps started by offering broadband as the type of service for heavy users, who have home networks, download all day etc. Few years later its now marketed as a web browsing solution.

Classic example of moving goalposts.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

very true... its a shame really, because otherwise I would speak of NTL's broadband in the same sentence as Blueyonder (which I had the pleasure of using for a few years when I lived at my parents house... my Mum still uses it now) as it has actually been very good for me - but this could have a lot to do with my location rather than NTL themselves...

edit: just had a 2nd thought... My comment about BY and NTL in the same breath? I wasn't including the supplied email service ;)

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

They probably thought in those days that customers would be law abiding citizens who would not be tied to their machines for more than a few hours each day, would watch video on their TVs and listen to radio on their radio. :)

In the beginning ISPs were more interested in building up a customer base than what customers were doing with their connections. Now they are thinking in terms of making a profit from broadband not having it as a loss maker.

The vast majority of customers will have no problem staying within the caps and they do far more than just a bit of web browsing and emailing.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Although, If all I wanted was browsing and emailing, I'd use dialup or a 256k type package from an ADSL company. I got NTL broadband installed because the possibilities were endless. Seems they aren't endless anymore... well, as far as 1Gb anyway.

I know its all about money - they cant operate on a loss. If thats such a problem, like I said a few posts up - stick all the leechers onto 1 UBR and let them fight for connectivity. If its them that have induced NTL to bring the cap in, let them live the situation that other "law abiding" users are apparently put in by their "selfish" download sprees.

Quickest way of making people vote with their feet (or bb connection!)

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Nobody in their right mind would choose a dialup connection over a broadband one. Dialup is not much cheaper, ties up the phoneline, is open to premium number scams, has to wait for connection and probably has a two hour cut off. Even people who only do a bit of surfing and emailing download the odd large (in dialup terms) file and would prefer to get it in seconds rather than half the evening. Having a 1Mb broadband service doesn't mean that you have to max it out 24/7.

Sticking all the really heavy users onto the same UBR is a great idea but I think most customers will not want to pay significantly higher charges to pay for their relocation to that UBRs area. The heavy users wouldn't like it either as they may not want to move house especially if they are put in the same area as all the other leechers and all have to compete for sales of their warez at the same boot sale. :D

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Im a heavy user, id be more than happy to pay a premium, for a more realistic cap level.... I certinaly dont think its fairof us to sit here and moan about it, if we want something you have to pay for it, bandwith costs money..

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I love the way you assume everyone is a warez monkey....pathetic.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I don't assume that at all, I know most of the very heavy users are only sharing linux distros. :D

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Groan, change the record willya :dozey:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

not starting to get to you is it ;) :D :D :D

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I'll change my record when all those heavy users have the balls to own up to what they actually use their connections for. :upyours:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Well virtually every one of his posts says the same thing so yeah, just a tad :p:
__________________

Charming :D

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Well I am a heavy user, I d/l stuff to preview them (music/vid/apps) and if I like them enough I will purchase them. If I don't like them enough I bin them, and feel satisfied that I did not waste money by buying things that don't live up to the PR/advertising hype that fills the mags/posters/flyer's and other advertising media.
If the makers/producers actually gave proper, detailed, truthful information then I/we would not feel this way.

so :2up: pal. :mad:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

tis getting a bit heated , i will open a window methinks :D :D :D

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Wasup guys :shrug:
He just got to me with that comment. :D

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

If all I was doing was checking email and so on, dialup would be fine. I know how to use a computer and am not a fool so therefore would not be open to premium number scams. My brother in law has 256k ADSL. Checks email, chats a little on MSN and does a little surfing. He only changed from dialup as it worked out about the same cost. If you have read what I wrote, I said I would pick one or the other.

Well, to be honest, you dont need to relocate to change UBR. That is something NTL can do their end I'm sure. Intercept the connections and route them through a different router. If BT can change it, I'm sure NTL can.

I'm not being funny or anything but if you dont mind me saying... it seems you have issues ian@huth... every one of these type of threads, you come in with your "My way or the highway" theories. There is ALWAYS 2 sides to every story.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Absolutely spot on, if people didnt produce rubbish then the punter wouldnt be at risk of wasting their hard earned cash. Previewing is the only reliable way of ensuring you will get value for money.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

The heavy users I am talking about are mainly the ones that think downloading less than 5Gb per day every day is not using broadband as it should be used. I get rather p****d off with members who quote all the legal uses of their connection such as downloading linux distros, downloading paid for films and music, etc then post a complaint about poor speeds and back this up with evidence that they are ripping off films that have only just been released in the cinemas. I'm sorry that I may offend some people but the blunt fact is that leass than 10% of users consume more than half the bandwidth in this country and most of this is mostly pirated material. These users are the main reason for caps. There is no justification for breaking the law but many otherwise law abiding people seem to think that as there is no physical object involved then it isn't stealing.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

You have a point, but you cant overprice things and expect people to pay it. Everything goes up x% each year, yet people's salaries go up y% which isnt as high as x%. People are basically coming out with less money that they can spend on such things as going to the cinema etc. That is why piracy is as big as it is and it aint gonna change until the people who price things realise they're pricing themselves out of a huge amount of business.

I have very little disposable income that we can use on such trips out so I admit, I do watch some copied films. I dont download them as it takes too damn long (yes, I did try once - gave up after about 1hr and ~300Mb) and the internet is much better being put to use on genuine things like the kids on Miniclip.com etc (which is where 90% of our used bandwidth goes I'm sure).

1Gb is unrealistic for everyone. 2Gb is more like it. People need a damn good excuse for breaking 2Gb. We frequently do over 1Gb (albeit not much over) but we've never passed 2Gb which makes it more realistic for people with more than 1 PC in the house or people who have 1 PC thats never out of use by family etc).

They need to monitor areas with no advance warning and those found to be excessively passing the limits over a period of time should be dropped from the service or offered a slower service as the maximum available to them.

As for stealing things which have no physical object... you're illegally obtaining the right to watch/listen/use the film/song/program. You're not stealing it as the original owner can still use it too. "Stealing" is a word used to cover a large area of actions... the majority of which are not what the word ACTUALLY means.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I always thought that the speed cap controlled how much you can download in any 24hr period, lets face it you cant go ant faster than that.

Now it seems that they want us to be capped both ways.

If its a 1GB per day cap the speed should be unlimited.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I hate do gooders, who are so full of their own self importance that they fail to realise that the average chap on the street, who goes to work, doing a **** low paid job, who does not drink, smoke, nor goes out much, so he can have his broadband connection @ £40.00 per month, as an ALWAYS ON - with a capped speed 'for the old reason of quality' - should not be then told - you cant use it as much for the same reason we make it go slow in the first place e.g. it slows the network down.



They moan about how much bandwidth costs - then bugger me double the speed for free.



Fact is, we are being punished twice - if they want to enforce a daily limit then give us unlimited speed.

remember - without users NTL is finished.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I would agree, *if* ntl enforced the cap and made it physically impossible to go over it. At the moment the 'cap' is more a guideline, and they aren't stopping people going over it yet. I used over 70gig in March for example, and will continue using the service as I see fit until/unless told otherwise :)

ian@huth, your argument gets increasingly tedious I'm afraid. The only time people like me have listed lots of legal ways of using over 1gig a day, one of which yes, does include downloading Linux distros, is that people like you have stated the only way to exceed a gig a day regularly is by downloading warez and moviez. If you keep stating this untruth then expect others to keep correcting you.

As the poster above said, some of us download stuff to preview it before buying. I downloaded a few full episodes of Ally McBeal to see if I liked it.. I did, so I went ahead and purchased the DVD of the series. Without the preview I wouldn't have taken the chance that I might not like it.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I have never said that there aren't perfectly legal ways of exceeding the cap, there are. What I am saying though is that most of the heavy users are not using their connection legally which is a different ball game altogether.

People may be being capped two ways, by speed and volume, but that is the way that NTL want to market their product. It is their product and they have the right to stipulate how it should be used. You have the right to decide not to use the service if you don't like the terms and conditions.

I can understand someone who never downloads anything illegally complaining about my posts but for someone who does and admits it in the same post is beyond belief. No amount of trying to justify why you do it alters tha fact that you are doing something illegal and in breach of NTLs terms and conditions.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Do you work for the MPAA or something? Why do you care so much?

How many internet users do you think have never downloaded anything illegal, not so much as one mp3? I suppose you never have then?

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Our friend Ian thinks he can change human nature while holding back the tide. He'll probably go on to prove that black is white and get himself killed on the next zebra crossing.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

You lot just can't take it when someone tries to point out that downloading things is sometimes illegal....
He is trying to prove a point, yes, but as usual anyone who tries to do the right thing in this world is put down by the majority who can't see that a) business is business and companies will increase prices to survive and b) will also have to impose caps and limits to those who abuse the system. As usual, it is a few inconsiderate people who spoil it for the majority who do obey the law and follow rules...

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

It might have escaped your notice but anyone who can download at full speed for a period of time is proving that their local network is not congested.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

never thought of that!

At home, if I'm downloading anything and the kids go on miniclip at the same time, the download speed decreases slightly for the time that the page loads on their screen.
I would imagine (my thoughts induced by the comment by "obvious" above) as UBRs will only have a certain amount of bandwidth available to them that the same thing would happen.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

True - when a UBR is saturated then every user will receive a proportionately degraded service. If user x is not getting a degraded download speed then neither is anybody else.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I agree with what you are saying to an extent though individual users may have tweaked their systems to cope better with the situation. NTL have been quite good at making sure that users do not suffer the effects of contention. There are quite a number of users who think that if they are not getting the full speed of their connection that there is a problem that must be fixed. Any contended service is bound to have periods when degradation of speed starts to occur. The problem is that as speeds get higher and higher it is more difficult and costly to prevent this degradation in speed. BT have made this point several times during the run up to their 8Mbps trials. They say that customers who are lucky enough to get the full 8Mbps during quiet times will be lucky to get above 2Mbps peak time.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

So ian@huth are you gonna tell us whether you've ever downloaded an mp3?

Fwiw my bandwidth is very rarely maxed out and it's highly doubtful that my average 2gig a day usage, spread throughout 24 hours, has any negative impact on local ntl users.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

No, I never have downloaded a mp3 legal or illegal. All my software is fully legal and I was going to say paid for but a lot of it was donated by companies I have worked in conjunction with and suppliers I have dealt with. I have a lot of friends whose livliehoods have been affected by internet piracy which is why I am so against it. I am not alone in my stance on the subject but am probably one of the few who has continued to express their views. Many have given up trying as the same things have been said time and time again over the years on here. We all know the score on usage patterns and we all know that nothing said on here is going to significantly alter NTLs (and other ISPs) thinking on the subject.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Look NTL are in this for the money, to be honest they have rear ended themselves:

I'm on the 2mb service and here my daily stats:

Uploaded(1.83 GB/Day)Downloaded(8.75 GB/Day)


Now according to NTL if i abuse the service i'll be asked to upgrade (or do one of the alternatives) now if i was to upgrade i'd be download 1/3 more than im currently downloading now. NTL purposely put the speeds up to make them look better in the eyes of the competition. As more people are joining the network there congesting it further. The increased speed and increased users is the ultimate reason why the NTL network is congested (not because people abusing the network).

If NTL wernt so greedy to get new customers they'd of realised that decreasing the prices of broadband and keeping the speeds the same would of been a much more logical solution. Yet in this day and age its figures which count and users want to have the best (the fastest) service. NTL have take advantage of this... if anyone is to blaim for the congestion (which there doesnt appear to be any) then its NTL themselves.

The best example of this greed is NTLs 1mb upgrade which is less of a service than the 300k service. By offering 1MB for a low price NTL can stay in the competition however by offering 1MB they have limited it. However NTL make this out to be the better deal when in fact NTL are saving money on people upgrading to 1mb because over all they'll be using less bandwidth from the network (yet paying the same price.)

We've been with NTL since day one (in wales) and we pay a large sum a month for digital, broadband and a phone service of which we've been greatly happy with. Unfortunately the only service keeping us with NTL is the broadband and if it need be and we ever get any crap off NTL of course its going to be bye bye NTL and we'll go back to Sky + BT and find an ADSL (something i really dont want to do).

I could use stronger words to describe what NTL are doing to its customers on broadband its ultimately a sly tactic to make more money off new customers tempting by what looks like a good broadband offer... :td:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

:clap:

Internet related piracy is an issue (illegal distribution of copyright protected material), and it can directly affect ISP's, and also impact on the livelyhood of honest, hard working people.

Whether we download the odd mp3, or whole software packages, there is no argument that can justify such actions, and we only have ourselves to blame when those who mimic our own bad habits spoil the services for other people.

:erm:
__________________


I'd get your self ready for a stern letter from ntl with those kind of stats, if they are to be believed. :Yikes:

To be honest, if you did leave ntl, the other folks in your region would probably see an improvement in their broadband service. :p:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

(sorry if i get the capitalisation wrong on the following measurements im sure you can understand it)

Look 1gb a day is 1024000 kbytes which is 1024mbytes which is 1gb

24hrs in a day x 60 minutes an hour x 60seconds a minute... = 86400 secs/day

1024000 divided by 86400 = 11.8kb/s

So to use our 1gb cap a day we might as well have a 150k connection and if we were to use this 150k 24/7 we'd still go over our 1gb a day limit.

LOL find this ironic? you still want to believe the crap NTL feed you. There broadband speed is a gimik to introduce new customers there cap is an insult to exsisting customers. The last letter i had from NTL was to tell me i was abusing the 56k service and that i should upgrade to the new broadband service that will be introduced soon...

Anyway as stated before if my network was congested the speed would be evenly spread... heres some more maths for you

If my street has a limit of 10mb for the whole street and there are 20 2mb users. If all 20 users were downloading at a max speed at one time we'd all suffer the same congestion limit of 0.5mb (512k) there would be no one downloading faster than anyone else. Yet again your arguement is flawed.

Thanks for your response anyway...

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Although you have all three services from NTL and are threatening to move them all elsewhere if they limit your excessive use they will probably be pleased if you do so. It probably costs them more to supply your services than you are paying them so it will be seen as a gain inprofit rather than the loss of a customer.

What NTL are doing to their customers is providing them with a faster service at no extra cost which most of them will greatly appreciate. It is a very good offer if you are a user but maybe not if you are an abuser.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Whether the network is congested or not, your stats would show up on ntl's monitoring systems, and regardless of bandwidth utilisation by your whole street your use is excesive, and in breach of ntl's own usage guidelines.

Math has nothing to do with this, you are exceeding the 1Gb per day usage guideline, by your own admission. You should therefore not be surprised if you do receive a letter from ntl's abuse team............oh, and try convincing them that you will move your services elsewhere, I'd imagine that wouldn't cut any ice with them.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Shocking behaviour! You'd think they'd put the speeds down to make them look worse in the eyes of the competition, wouldn't you? Though I do agree with you that it looks suspiciously like the speeds went up on purpose. Last time the speeds went up it was because someone dropped a mug of coffee into one of the UBRs and it accidentally and unexpectedly caused the bandwidth to double.

So is there congestion or isn't there? Or haven't you got a clue?

They want new customers? Who do they think they are? Some kind of business?


How dare they! Here you are, using a service you're happy with, then evil old NTL say 'you can have this alternative service if you want - but just in case the new one isn't right for you we'll keep you on the existing one unless you ask us to change'. I demand that next time NTL add any new service they guarantee it'll be better for every single last customer, without exception, then force them to take the service without asking.

So you're saying that the service NTL provides is better than the alternatives, but if you decide that it's not you'll switch to another provider? Can you hang on a minute while I put my eyeballs back into their sockets? They popped out at the thought of such a radical notion as weighing up the alternatives and choosing the one that suited you best.

Well, doesn't that take the biscuit! Tempting new customers with what looks like a good offer! Don't let any of their competitors find out about this; you never know, they may even start making offers to get new customers themselves. And I love this wacky idea that NTL have of adding terms and conditions to their services, that you can read before signing up. Good job they're the only company on the planet that do this, or we'll be in a right pickle.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

lol i didnt realise how f***ed some of you guys really are lol. Your getting a second rate service and your happy to take the **** you get just like that huh?

Yes i know im abusing the service im not denying i shouldnt get everything i deserve but your looking at it in the wrong sense. I own the 2mb service but with the current cap i'd be better off owning the 150k service does this fact not GET IN YOUR HEAD AT ALL??? do you even understand the extend NTL are doing over there customers with this issue...

IM PAYING FOR A SERVICE WHICH SHOULD COST ME THE SAME AS THE OLD 150k SERVICE AND THATS AN INCREDIBLE FACT.

Basically i'll abuse the speeds NTL have given me until i here further from them. There ****ing me over i might as well **** them over until the end...

if you wanna be blind to the truth thats fine let NTL do whatever to you. By all means continue taking **** until the day you die its just funny that every come back all anyone can say is "your abusing the network" ... its funny because im downloading at 240kb/s and uploading at 15kb/s (20kb/s just kills my download speed) so why shouldnt i be taking advantage of that my network obviously isnt congested otherwise my download speed would be crap.
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i guess your one of these guys that likes to make a joke out of bad situations just to feel good ? you can hide behind the sarcasm and continue to take what NTL deal out... party on by all means :dunce:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I'm not sure what you mean by 'believe the crap' - whatever the rights & wrongs, in this instance NTL has given a clear indication of what will be enforced as acceptable use for the three tiers available.

- it may not be to your liking, but I can't see any evidence they are trying to mislead customers - the limits are clearly laid out.

Your description of the contention for any one area ignores the effect of the upstream path - a few heavy users can affect the performance of several others, the bandwith isn't shared as equally as your example suggests.

But we are all in the same boat, after years of being vague about what is 'acceptable use' NTL are putting pegs in the ground - as customers we have the choice of accepting the limits, or taking our business elsewhere. As I see it, the situation really is as simple as that.:shrug:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Look for most people they see 1mb, 2mb and 3mb as fast connections, they dont realise that the caps actually enforce there connection down to what might as well be a 150k speed. NTL tell you its a good deal, i was already on NTL when they announced the upgraded speed... being a 512k and then 750k customer i didnt have a choice if i upgraded to 2mb. I knew that i would be using my connection to download huge files, NTL already knwe this i'd been a customer abusing there 750k system for over 2 years... NTL uprgraded me even though they knew i used more than 1gb a day even on the 750k (more like 2gb - 3gb a day) so by upgrading me to a faster speed do they really believe this would stop me using my bandwidth... heck no im going to continue doing so at a faster pace than before. If they cut me off then whos fault is it...? mine - of course its mine... but who the hell upgraded me in the first place KNOWING that i was already an abuser - NTL... now tell me which service was better value for OUR money (not NTLs) like i said if you wanna get ****ed thats fine but the fact is you got ****ed its your decision whether you take that or not... telling me im an abuser has got nothing to do with my argument. Look if i was a new user NTL would have everyright to do what they want, but NTL took the risk of upgrading me knowing the consequences...

Imagine a serial killer whos been killing for two years and gets put in jail... but the prision decide to free him and equip him with a larger weapon so he can kill more people WHO THE HELL IS TO BLAME> the killer or the prision???

i rest my case.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

No, I'm just one of those people who's looked at the BB offers that are on the table and decided that the one from NTL suits me best.

I was a touch sarcastic, wasn't I? Maybe you should give me a little less to play with next time.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

read my previous post, NTL upgraded me... and others im not a new customer

Of course if i was NTL wouldnt of had a clue of how much usage i would use and it would be my full responsibility to adhere to the restrictions.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Just because NTL are increasing the speeds doesn't mean that you have to download twice as much. Why not download the same as before?

I have chosen to go on the new 1Mb service because my normal usage pattern is achievable within the 3Gb per month cap with some to spare. If I want more than that when the caps are firmly in place I will either pay for the extra or upgrade to a higher tier for a month and then drop back down again.

You are looking at it the wrong way if you look at the volume that someone wants to download in a month and then works out what speed they have to be on to spread that download evenly over the month. The other day I reformatted one of my daughters PCs, reinstalled the operating system and then downloaded antivirus, firewall, windows updates, drivers and a few more things. I wanted them much faster than a dialup would get them and ideally would have preferred a 3Mb connection in order to save time that day.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Most webpages wont load any quicker if u have a faster connection without tweaks to internet explorer or other browsers. I have broadband to download faster, NTL upgraded my speed therefore im going to download more , faster...

the internet is a lovely play im sorry you dont see the many uses i do...

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I must be honest - it's hard to know if you're serious or on a wind up?

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

how about a serious wind up ;) , several trollish features spring to mind :disturbd:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Now now - we can't assume that ;):D

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Duh - you can't be serious?!? Who is to blame?!?!?
The jail doesn't make him kill people. What a stupid stupid comment. The serial killer who kills people is to blame. If I left my computer in my house and left my door open then yes I am asking to be burgled, BUT it is not me who is at fault. I didn't ask someone to enter my house and take my things. That is against the law regardless of how they did it.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I agree with morgan - of course the prison would be responsible- the killer is just doing what he does, just as people who download are doing what they do. If the network is congested then it will be NTL's 'fault' for upping the speed so much lately.
But at the same time, in my opinion, i don't think ntl really care as long as they are getting plenty of money off us. Which they are, and they will, no matter what anyone says.
Ntl is a hugely successful company- apparently just signed their 3 millionth household up in britain- they can't please everyone can they?
Also, you will probably find that most people do use the service for 'normal' usage, eg; surfing, emails, and playing some games....
Those people might not spend enough time on their pc's to read forums like this- which might be why a lot of the higher users are responding to this thread. If that makes sense. :scratch:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

[QUOTE=piaswales]I agree with morgan - of course the prison would be responsible- the killer is just doing what he does, just as people who download are doing what they do.


Oh, that's alright then. We'll just blame everyone but ourselves.....
Same old story. It's not their fault, so and so told them to do it....
GROW UP EVERYONE. This is the sort of comments that happen in the primary school playground.
So the killer does what he does, and it must of course be someone else's fault - couldn't possibly be his own could it? (probably Ntl's fault then)

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

NTL make a lot of money doing what they do, and as a hugely successful company, indeed, doing what they do, they also know better than most about how to make money. My point being that NTL know exactly what they are doing, like in morgans point- the prison knew the killer would go and kill again- and yet they gave him a bigger weapon to go and do it. Just the same with NTL.
If ntl complain about network congestion then they must take some responsibility, as they have given us the tools to do so.
I have heard many times the old metaphor of " It's like giving you a car that you can drive 300mph in, but only letting you drive to the end of the street".
Those bigwigs at ntl know exactly what they are doing, they aren't in this to be overly concerned over what people are downloading or how much- at the end of the day they are in it primarily make money out of us. If their system didn't work then they would have no custom and no money.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

Precisely this was a carefully thought out plan by NTL. If samuel had been kind enough to actually read my posts carefully he would of realised YES i blame my self for the downloading/uploading i do but ultimately NTL knew what amount users were downloading and they decided to take new customers over old ones...

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

But some users are saying that if you give them a 300mph car then they should be able to drive it at that speed and not 1mph slower 24/7/365. Ever thought along the lines of having a faster speed enables you to do what you want quicker rather than exploiting it to the max for just as long. It's a bit like in the days of Concorde you chose to fly on it because you got there a lot quicker. You didn't travel twice as far because the faster speed allowed you to do so in the same time.

As for NTL being in it to make money, what a fantastic idea it is for a business to actually want to make a profit. Most ISPs have not made any money out of broadband and are desperately looking for ways to change this situation. They cannot do this if they are allowing some customers to pay £38 per month for a service that should cost £2-£300 per month for the usage levels they have.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

There are others services in the UK but not in Wales that offer much more competitive prices than NTL. The service were getting is the shoody uk service we'd expect from our broadband network , dont give me any bull**** about it should be costing us £300 stop having a laugh.

The problem is the only people arguing against are the people that do jack **** on the internet except probably come on this forum. It's people like you who are stupid enough to pay £35 a month for a speed of which they'll never get any use. So you download this forum 0.5 seconds faster... the only real winners here are the people so called "abusing" the service who are actually just using broadband for its intended use and you know it... :dozey:

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

woah....! Lose the attitude!!

What about people who download from itunes? If i download a song then i would much prefer it to take 30seconds rather than 3 minutes... or an hour and a half on dial up.

I don't use all of the speed all of the time, but it is nice to have it there sometimes.

Going back to ians car analogy- i might buy a car which can do 0-60 in 6 seconds, doesn't mean that i am going to that every time i accelerate, but if i am late, it might come in handy once in a while. This car would cost me alot more than a model that takes 20 seconds to do 0-60 but if i am willing to pay extra, then that is my choice.

The "uk broadband network" you refer to is a privately owned cable network- ntl paid for it and pay to maintain it. The ADSL network has been funded partially by public money, so yes you could moan about lack of development on this, but ntl's private network is not as relevant to the discussion of poor broadband in the UK as ADSL is. As a private entity ntl can invest what they like in the network and in return they will gain subscribers- which incidentally they seem to be doing quite well, with 1.3m customers- more than any other ISP in the UK.

And as for their being no other competitive ISPs in Wales... i can have 2meg from any ADSL provider so i don't think that your comment is quite justified- it may be the case that in some areas ADSL is not available, but you need to be more specific with your comments.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

please don't presume you can download the internet 24/7 and then insult those that choose not to - they are not 'stupid', they are using the connection as they see fit - 'none of your business' works both ways :(

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

The £300 doesn't come from me or NTL is has been quoted by more than one ADSL ISP. NTL on the whole give a good service to its users at a reasonable price. Email may have its problems at times but NTL are not alone with this and I can honestly say I have not experienced that much trouble with it. What NTL offer is a broadband service for residential use aimed at the normal internet user. over 90% of users have very few problems and have a usage pattern that falls within the usage limits NTL will be putting in place.

You have no idea how I use the internet so how can you criticise my use and views. I may not use that much bandwidth these days on a regular basis but there are times when I need the advantage of a high speed connection for a short time and I am willing to pay the full cost of having that speed. Many years ago I used to have an internet bill at home that never dropped below £100 per month.

Most of the abusers are not using the internet as it is intended to be used but kid themselves into thinking that their use is normal and acceptable. It isn't normal and it isn't acceptable and before too long you will find out that you have to obey the rules or go elsewhere. You don't get too many regulars bothering to comment these days as all has been said so many times before.

You have made quite an impression with your first few posts on here but not for the right reasons.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

I download 5+gigs per day on occasions and if NTL impose this 1gig per day Cap on 3meg I will be on the phone to complain, its not suitable for my usage.

I would be quite happy to pay £70 per month as long as I could download what I wanted when I wanted!!

Or I also wouldnt mind paying so much for every gig over the cap i download, as long as its REASONABLE and REALISTIC.

I download lots of stuff and dont mind paying for it, whether or not its legal or illegal is nothing to do with anyone else apart NTL and myself.

Re: 1GB Cap Letter!!!!
 

But i had a car that did 512k and it now does 2048k i used to go over the speed limit but they still did the upgrade to my car knowing that i'd go over the limit quicker with my upgraded car

:td: pull another one on me mate... and yeah i could get Nildrem for an extra £2 but its still the same speed. In england you can expect alot more for your money i only have to shop around and i've found 8mb for only £39.99 with a 33:1 ratio and a 500gb cap, but of course NTL are in it for the money, nevermind about the customers...

you know why telewest offer unlimited and NTL dont, because telewest havent got the market held... ntl are the only real competition here in wales... whereas telewest have hundreds of ISP's to compete with. Telewest can do it but NTL cant, yet the two use the exact same type of network...

So why do NTL offer a cap at the current moment in time, because as it is, they can... theres no one who can beat them, theres no one to offer cable at a cheaper price, theres no one to offer a no cap connection or a faster service...

So if you want to be apart of that system and not voice your opinion fine, continue driving your car at the basic speed, ignore the pumping engine under the hood. I guess your one of these people that drive a 30k car yet you drive slow - just so everyone can see you...:cool:
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then when did it become your business that i download as i see fit...

perhaps if we have speed restrictions we should have a minimum speed limit... oh i forgot NTL wouldnt like that :o

Its up to you if you want to pay £35 for a service you could get for £15 etc... however as i pay £35 i try and get my £35 worth.
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now see your getting me wrong,
I have no quibble with ntls service, customer support, television package, phone line etc...

I've only ever had a 100% positive response to say about NTL. However they always and i have always been let down with the broadband. The speeds are great however theres no way i should pay £25 when i litteraly download 24/7... for which i could get away with using a 150k service and still get everything i paid for. But NTL saw it fit to upgrade me, therefore i'll download to the specification of the line i was given.
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and im sorry if im leaving a bad impression, i have an opinion and its going to stick. if you dont like it, dont listen... if you want to voice your own you know where the reply button is and im sure you know how this works.