Cable Forum - Election 2019

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Hugh	15-11-2019 09:39

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Not sure how someone stating some services aren’t creating genuine competition makes them a Marxist/Communist - according to that logic, Adam Smith is a Marxist...

Or....

You could just be smearing someone?

Mick	15-11-2019 09:43

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 36017158)

But you consistently claim that the Labour Party is primarily responsible for austerity in this country when they are are not.

Yes they are!

They racked up the deficit considerably in the 13 years in power. Who else is to blame FFS?

They sold Gold reserves at rock bottom prices. Labour were a total economic mess, as they always are and always requires a Tory government to clean up their disgusting spending spree.

Just look at the disaster waiting to happen with Corbyn and McDonnell at the helm. Unions getting more power, there will be strikes galore, bankrupting companies being squeezed to pay their staff more and more.

They’re now promising handing out free broadband for every home in UK, that they would run and own the network. I would not use their freebie service if they paid me, talk about spying on everyone en masse. No thank you. But what about the cost to the internet industry itself, ISP firms could collapse, leading to significant job losses.

Labour is not the answer and never has been.

denphone

15-11-2019 09:46

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36017206)

Heres some research the government itself has published...

https://assets.publishing.service.go..._FE_Report.pdf

jfman

15-11-2019 10:10

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 36017204)

I'm sure Tony Benn said the same about the British Car Industry in the 70's.....................................

Rather than giving choice, you want to give everyone vanilla broadband.

Typical Marxist/Communist, you'll have us all driving state manufactured Ladas/ Polski Fiats. Watching only a few state owned tv channels and radio, that show continual programmes about our dear Leader Father Corbyn.
It will, whilst I disagree, I can understand the argument for Nationalisation of the rail, water and to a lesser extent power.

But the communications sector is not something that needs buggering about with. Communications are not like when the Post Office ran it. The speed of change and level of continual investment required would far outstrip anything a state owned vehicle could keep on top of, especially if they're giving it away for free.

It may have appeared to him as a great soundbite, but people will see it for what it is, pie in the sky election promises.

Except it's not comparable with the car industry at all - the most obvious being that cars exist in a worldwide market. I can import a German car, a Japanese car, etc.

I can't import broadband from literally thousands of like for like comparable products. I can buy BT, or a BT wholesale product through a third party. I'm lucky enough to have Virgin as an option.

However there isn't enough competition in the market to drive prices down due to the high fixed costs of installing being a barrier to entry.

While I'm sure many in the telecommunications sector would rightly be terrified of their cushy jobs and massive profits coming under threat. However to the average household saving £300 to £600 a year and finding broadband through taxation would be beneficial.

The state is already having to massively subside areas that aren't "cost effective" anyway - might as well bring the profitable parts into the fold to benefit the taxpayer.

---------- Post added at 10:10 ---------- Previous post was at 10:08 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36017206)

It's just right wing propaganda because they know their time is coming. Tick tock.

Pierre

15-11-2019 10:30

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 36017206)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36017212)

Except it's not comparable with the car industry at all - the most obvious being that cars exist in a worldwide market. I can import a German car, a Japanese car, etc.

But killing the British car market by bringing in all the British car manufacturers into one single govt owned vehicle was fine was it?

Quote:

I can't import broadband from literally thousands of like for like comparable products. I can buy BT, or a BT wholesale product through a third party. I'm lucky enough to have Virgin as an option.

However there isn't enough competition in the market to drive prices down due to the high fixed costs of installing being a barrier to entry.

So then nationalising Open reach, funding the national build of FTTP with tax money, then giving the service "free" to everyone. There-bye killing off Virgin Media and any other provider, is increasing competition is it? increasing choice? or is it stifling innovation and just ensuring that everyone has the same vanilla product with no chance of having any thing different?

Quote:

While I'm sure many in the telecommunications sector would rightly be terrified of their cushy jobs

You are some piece of work. Virgin Media engineers out in the street now in sub-zero temperatures fixing faults, cushy are they?

All 15,000 or so employees , the customer service reps on £15K a years revelling in an orgy of greed ?

Quote:

However to the average household saving £300 to £600 a year and finding broadband through taxation would be beneficial.

Great let's destroy a sector make thousands of people unemployed, so JFman can save £600 a year while he plays himself watching his computer.

Definitely for the many.

Quote:

The state is already having to massively subside areas that aren't "cost effective" anyway - might as well bring the profitable parts into the fold to benefit the taxpayer

Which bits of Virgin Media are the Govt subsiding?

Quote:

It's just right wing propaganda because they know their time is coming. Tick tock.

Left wing lunacy, I really hope McDonnell has a few more ideas like this up his sleeve, he doing the Tory campaign the world of good.

jfman

15-11-2019 10:40

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 36017214)

oh look, it's Hugh on his big white stallion coming to the aid of JFman, like he needs it lol.

Some one advocating to get rid of all competition and have a single state owned provider is Marxism in it's purest form.

But killing the British car market by bringing in all the British car manufacturers into one single govt owned vehicle was fine was it?

So then nationalising Open reach, funding the national build of FTTP with tax money, then giving the service "free" to everyone. There-bye killing off Virgin Media and any other provider, is increasing competition is it? increasing choice? or is it stifling innovation and just ensuring that everyone has the same vanilla product with no chance of having any thing different?

You are some piece of work. Virgin Media engineers out in the street now in sub-zero temperatures fixing faults, cushy are they?

All 15,000 or so employees , the customer service reps on £15K a years revelling in an orgy of greed ?

Great let's destroy a sector make thousands of people unemployed, so JFman can save £600 a year while he plays himself watching his computer.

Definitely for the many.

Which bits of Virgin Media are the Govt subsiding?

Left wing lunacy, I really hope McDonnell has a few more ideas like this up his sleeve, he doing the Tory campaign the world of good.

Save the insults that I'm a "piece of work". Your failure to understand economics is not my problem.

You are falling into the neo-liberal trap that competition is always the answer when it simply isn't. You've asked questions to distract the point - at no point did I claim Virgin Media were subsided - I said the parts of fibre rollout that aren't commercially viable are subsidised.

All to provide consumers limited choice which doesn't drive down prices. Killing off competition in this instance removes duplicate costs and delivers a more efficient outcome for the taxpayer.

Mr K	15-11-2019 10:47

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Some interesting local council results yesterday. LD gain 2 from Cons, and SNP gain 1 from Cons.

Quote:

Culverden (Tunbridge Wells) result:

LDEM: 46.7% (+33.5)
CON: 24.9% (-19.1)
WEP: 10.2% (+10.2)
TWA: 9.5% (+9.5)
LAB: 5.2% (-14.3)
GRN: 3.5% (-7.5)

Liberal Democrat GAIN from Conservative.

Shap (Eden) result:

LDEM: 48.5% (+17.3)
CON: 33.8% (-17.4)
PCF: 17.7% (+0.1)

Liberal Democrat GAIN from Conservative.

Dunfermline East (Fife) first preferences:

SNP: 33.2% (+9.1)
CON: 24.8% (-6.5)
LDEM: 22.8% (+13.8)
LAB: 13.5% (-6.3)
GRN: 5.1% (+0.9)
LBT: 0.6% (+0.6)

SNP GAIN from Conservative.

denphone

15-11-2019 10:51

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36017221)

Some interesting local council results yesterday. LD gain 2 from Cons, and SNP gain 1 from Cons.

Indeed some very interesting results which just makes this general election even more unpredictable and volatile then it already is.

jfman

15-11-2019 11:11

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Tories going to get eliminated in Scotland at the GE. No Ruth running around with a Union Flag on the campaign any more. Just old, stake, grey, white men who don't care about Scotland's interests.

Pierre

15-11-2019 11:18

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36017219)

Save the insults that I'm a "piece of work". Your failure to understand economics is not my problem.

Nor yours mine.

Quote:

You are falling into the neo-liberal trap that competition is always the answer when it simply isn't.

You've fell into the trap that Marxist state controlled entities is the answer, when the facts of over 150 years of evidence and nation case studies say otherwise.

Good luck in the future comrade.

---------- Post added at 11:18 ---------- Previous post was at 11:17 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfman (Post 36017225)

Tories going to get eliminated in Scotland at the GE. No Ruth running around with a Union Flag on the campaign any more. Just old, stake, grey, white men who don't care about Scotland's interests.

Will be on a par with Labour then.

Cable Forum

15-11-2019 12:08

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

It seems we are getting carried away again and degrading the debate with petty bickering and personal insults.

Enough. Offending posts have been removed and should there be any more of this, individual topic bans will be implemented on such individual(s), who ignore this instruction.

Thread re-opened.

denphone

15-11-2019 13:20

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36017221)

Some interesting local council results yesterday. LD gain 2 from Cons, and SNP gain 1 from Cons.

Heres two more interesting ones.

Quote:

St Mary's (Powys) result:

LAB: 37.4% (+16.3)
CON: 26.5% (-14.9)
PC: 14.1% (+14.1)
LDEM: 11.1% (-16.3)
IND: 11.0% (+11.0)

Labour GAIN from Conservative.

No GRN (-10.2) as prev.

Quote:

Goodrington with Roselands (Torbay) result:

CON: 49.3% (+17.6)
LDEM: 35.5% (-)
BREX: 9.3% (+9.3)
LAB: 4.0% (-3.2)
GRN: 1.9% (-8.9)

Conservative GAIN from Liberal Democrat.

No UKIP (-14.7) as prev.

Mick	15-11-2019 13:25

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

The thing with council elections is that there is very low turnout, you cannot measure with any reasonable levy of accuracy of what the General Election results will show.

denphone

15-11-2019 13:30

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick (Post 36017250)

The thing with council elections is that there is very low turnout, you cannot measure with any reasonable levy of accuracy of what the General Election results will show.

l think what the results do suggest is that there will be a lot of tactical voting and volatility come election day.

jonbxx

15-11-2019 14:51

Re: Election 2019 - Week 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick (Post 36017250)

The thing with council elections is that there is very low turnout, you cannot measure with any reasonable levy of accuracy of what the General Election results will show.

Yeah, I wouldn't read too much into council elections either. In my area, the local council is Liberal Democrat while the parliamentary constituency is turbo Conservative (Three Rivers Council vs South West Herts)

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