Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

[AlexanderHanff]

Originally Posted by Ravenheart

I think I've found them, I've just logged in to my Blog to make an entry, and I found this waiting for moderation.



It's nice to know they're scouring everywhere to try and put their spin. Including my crappy blog

He is right, Phorm is not illegal under RIPA -if- you ignore s2 and s3 of the legislation; which conveniently happen to be the pertinent sections of the legislation with regards to protecting the HUMAN RIGHTS of the public with regards the right to privacy in our private lives and communications.

However, since we have been told time and time again that IGNORANCE of the law is no excuse in the eyes of the courts, if they continue to IGNORE s2 and s3 we will jump on their every move and push harder and harder for criminal charges to be brought against Phorm and the Agent ISPs.

Rest assured, the secret trials by BT last June were criminal under RIPA and any deployment of Phorm -anywhere- in the UK would be equally criminal for as long as Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000 exists in it's current phorm.

Want to opt in to Phorm? Welcome to the world of complicit behaviour. If you opt in you risk the chance of committing a criminal offence yourself for initiating a communication which you know is going to be subjected to interception. Your ISP will be making you a criminal.

(Most of the above is directed at the general public not the author of the post I linked to.)

Alexander Hanff

[3x2]

Secondly it’s not illegal - we don’t agree with FIPR

Phorm - you are missing the point - we no longer care. You will prise my surfing habits from my cold, dead hand.

[Ravenheart]

Alexander,

Many thanks for your reply to the post I got on my blog, I'm about to compile a new entry to reply to our friend

Would it be Ok to use extracts from your reply in my blog?

[Florence]

Originally Posted by OF1975

Tell me about it. I miss clicking on the link every few hours and watching the share price tank. On a positive note though at least it gives time for more publicity, more research and more time for everyone to write to MPs, MEPs, Privacy organisations etc.

I am currently drafting a letter I intend to send to my MP and all the MEPs for my area. After that I intend to follow up my email to Liberty with a written letter. Still no response from them yet but hopefully a written letter will be more successful.

Perhaps sharing the letter with others might help them to also send copies to their MP and all EUMPs.

[dav]

The most important point for me that the ISPs, Phorm and their PR bots miss time and time again is that the illegality of the system is largely of no consequence. If I decide that no-one can have any access to my browsing data, then that is where the discussion ends. There is no implied consent in any of the agreements I have with my ISP.
The fact that they are relying on untested legal issues is a matter of rank incompetance in a business dealing with such basic issues as privacy. The law and policy makers will nigh-on always side with the masses, otherwise at the next election they'll find themselves on the pavement. The sooner Phorms investors realise this and jump ship, the better.

[AlexanderHanff]

Originally Posted by Ravenheart

Alexander,

Many thanks for your reply to the post I got on my blog, I'm about to compile a new entry to reply to our friend

Would it be Ok to use extracts from your reply in my blog?

Certainly.

Alexander Hanff

[flowrebmit]

Originally Posted by 3x2

Phorm - you are missing the point - we no longer care. You will prise my surfing habits from my cold, dead hand.

OT: Your terms are acceptable (from the movie "Men In Black")

[OF1975]

Originally Posted by Florence

Perhaps sharing the letter with others might help them to also send copies to their MP and all EUMPs.

My letter isnt very good as I rushed it. I should have probably spent time refining it but if others want me to post it here then I will gladly do so if the mods have no problems with that.

[popper]

post it up, and we can all refine it, order it and lay out a clear message, then when it covers all the points needed we can all set a date and everyone posts it in collaberation all together, that would get someones attention surely.

you know like santa clause (section this, of the so and so act) season.

Ohh and dont forget to include the EU in any of this, theres plenty of law there we can put forward too, not just UK legislation.

what does the EU data Commissioner think of all this ?, remembering he made it quite clear the other month,your IP address is personal data.

plenty to consider, not least commercial piracy, everyone in govt likes to talk about that dont they.

[OF1975]

Ok here is the letter I have sent to all my MEPs:
Dear

I write to you today to draw your attention to a disturbing deal that has been done here in the UK between BT, Talk Talk and Virgin Media and an ex-spyware company called Phorm. This company (in its previous incarnation as 121 media) wrote a piece of spyware called People On Page which used rootkit technology to hide itself and make it incredibly difficult to uninstall. Recently Phorm has struck a deal with the 3 Internet Providers which means that it intends to place servers within these broadband providers network that will monitor users online actions in order to target adverts at said users.

Put simply, this is the online equivalent of the Post Office opening all your letters, reading them, then building a profile from what you wrote in order to send you better targetted junk mail.

In my opinion this deal poses a huge threat to online privacy and may very well be illegal under the Regulation of Investagatory Powers Act 2000. The Foundation for Information Policy Research recently wrote an open letter to the Information Commissioners Office arguing the Phorm system violates RIPA. Questions also remain as to whether this technology contravenes European legislation on privacy. So far over 8000 people have signed an online petition calling for the UK Prime Minister to investigate Phorms technology.

Useful information regarding the Phorm technology and its privacy and legal implications may be found by following these links:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/03/04/phorm_ripa/
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/03..._fipr_illegal/

The relevant petition can be found at this link:

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/ispphorm/

I would be grateful if you would take the time to look into this matter further and raise concerns with the relevant ministers of state and also in the European Parliament.

Hope you have a happy Easter.

Yours sincerely,
Edit: I used the writetothem website in order to do the letters. Its quick and efficient and saves time finding names and postal addresses.

[popper]

ohh im sure we can beef that up no end, on first read it strikes me that the sender is saying something about adverts....., ill pass it along.

i think we need something far stronger, not worked out the outline yet but something like

dear [insert name]

i write to you today on a most urgent and long reaching privacy matter. effecting a mass of consumers and business both in the uk and the whole EU, perhaps even the world.

it is proposed that the UK/EU broadband ISPs covertly sell (some might say comercially pirate)their users personal data property....

[OF1975]

Originally Posted by popper

ohh im sure we can beef that up no end, on first read it strikes me that the sender is saying somethng about adverts....., ill pass it along.

Please do beef it up all you want. I did admit it wasnt very good. Personally think the last thing we should do is send them a 5 page letter detailing in depth legal arguments about sections and subsections of various laws. My idea was to keep things simple and give them links to articles that would go into all the detailed stuff. Others may disagree though.

[popper]

thats alright, we have to start somewere, my typing isnt up to a one draft clear post but there are many readers here that can improve it and yet keep it generic enough for posting to most orgs etc.

no rush, lets get the points down clear then re-org it for impact and clarity.

[OF1975]

Originally Posted by popper

thats alright, we have to start somewere, my typing isnt up to a one draft clear post but there are many readers here that can improve it and yet keep it generic enough for posting to most orgs etc.

no rush, lets get the points down clear then re-org it for impact and clarity.

Sounds good to me.

[Ravenheart]

While searching for some EU data commissioner info I found this site, and I'm going to drop them an email. Although the FIPR are members I don't think it would hurt to have them on our side

Digital Rights Europe http://www.edri.org/