Brexit (Old)

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by ianch99

All part of the narrative now forming where the right wing Leave supporters, now seing the reality of the task ahead, instead of saying how easy Brexit was/is going to be, they are now formulating a new "We Were Betrayed" message to try and cover their backs.

I think only the gullible will be fooled by this ..

The two are not materially linked. The Leave campaign was totally naff as most of us would agree. The campaign was before the vote. The Referendum result (after the campaign) was Leave. There seem to be an awful lot of politicians trying to betray that instruction.

Originally Posted by ianch99

I think the description of the Daily Express Newspaper referred to in the post is fair and accurate:

What it says in some random newspaper is irrelevant, members have been told not to use those terms in this thread, if I have discouraged the word "Remoaner" being used, then I expect both sides to play ball, you should not be suggesting any or all Brexiteers are "Right wing leave supporters".

I voted leave, I want to fully leave and I am not "Right wing" whatsoever.

I am not a "Hard Brexiteer", nor a "Brexstremist". I expect my democratic choice that won, to be respected, that does not make me any other variation of a leaver aka Brexiteer.

Totally ridiculous terms used by Remainers and vice versa Leavers to attack either side, the same crap that happened in the last thread, I have requested not happen in this one.

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by Mick

What it says in some random newspaper is irrelevant, members have been told not to use those terms in this thread, if I have discouraged the word "Remoaner" being used, then I expect both sides to play ball, you should not be suggesting any or all Brexiteers are "Right wing leave supporters".

I voted leave, I want to fully leave and I am not "Right wing" whatsoever.

I am not a "Hard Brexiteer", nor a "Brexstremist". I expect my democratic choice that won, to be respected, that does not make me any other variation of a leaver aka Brexiteer.

Totally ridiculous terms used by Remainers and vice versa Leavers to attack either side, the same crap that happened in the last thread, I have requested not happen in this one.

You are really not reading what I post nor are you reflecting the real world. Like it or not, there *are* groups that reflect a right of centre view of how Brexit should be conducted. The Daily Express, Daily Mail, etc. are members of this group. Trying to pretend that they do not exist or they do not hold such extreme views is denying reality.

you should not be suggesting any or all Brexiteers are "Right wing leave supporters"

First, I never suggested that *all* Brexiteers are "Right wing leave supporters" as you well know so don't misrepresent what I said.

Secondly, you are in denial if you think that no Brexiteers are "Right wing leave supporters".

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by Dave42

“How many countries in the world have no trade deals in place? None.
"How many countries on April 1st next year will have no trade deals in place - one.” can you guess what that country will be ?

Sigh,

If we leave with no actual deal then WTO rules will apply until a deal can be agreed so the world won't stop. That means we will still be able to trade although the cost may be slightly more to the person in the street.

Don't forget a 2yr transition period has already been agreed and a free trade deal could be agreed in that period or close to.

That said the EU may be quite willing to wipe out £250 billion of trade, the choice is theirs.

[Dave42]

Originally Posted by pip08456

Sigh,

If we leave with no actual deal then WTO rules will apply until a deal can be agreed so the world won't stop. That means we will still be able to trade although the cost may be slightly more to the person in the street.

Don't forget a 2yr transition period has already been agreed and a free trade deal could be agreed in that period or close to.

That said the EU may be quite willing to wipe out £250 billion of trade, the choice is theirs.

not if a no deal Brexit which is looking more likely everyday the EU will lose some yes but they still have all there trade deals UK will have 0 trade deals and fall of cliff edge UK will suffer lot more than EU

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by pip08456

Sigh,

If we leave with no actual deal then WTO rules will apply until a deal can be agreed so the world won't stop. That means we will still be able to trade although the cost may be slightly more to the person in the street.

Unfortunately, it will be several people in the street and not in the factory if we are willing to open our ears to what the likes of Airbus are informing us. I don't think we will get to this stage as it's in no one's interest.
https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-ai...-idUKKBN1JW0XG

Originally Posted by ianch99

You are really not reading what I post nor are you reflecting the real world. Like it or not, there *are* groups that reflect a right of centre view of how Brexit should be conducted. The Daily Express, Daily Mail, etc. are members of this group. Trying to pretend that they do not exist or they do not hold such extreme views is denying reality.



First, I never suggested that *all* Brexiteers are "Right wing leave supporters" as you well know so don't misrepresent what I said.

Secondly, you are in denial if you think that no Brexiteers are "Right wing leave supporters".

That’s not what I said, I was trouncing your ridiculous assertion that, those who expect a full walk away from EU are Right wing, they are not and enough of this rubbish about I’m in denial or not living in real world, which is very inaccurate.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Unfortunately, it will be several people in the street and not in the factory if we are willing to open our ears to what the likes of Airbus are informing us. I don't think we will get to this stage as it's in no one's interest.
https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-ai...-idUKKBN1JW0XG

What a wonderful example you have linked to Andrew, not a multimillion pound industry but a multibillion one!

I take it you are taking the media line that it is a warning to just the UK Gov but not the EU so let's have a look at it and it will possibly involve Dave's assertion that there is no transition period in event of a "No Deal" scenario.

“The certification for thousands of parts that are today part of the supply chain, part of our aircraft, would fall apart, and that could be a very troubling situation for us and could eventually lead to a standstill of production,”

Yep, in the event of no deal I can see that, I bolded "eventually" as I'll come back to it later.

Bear in mind the UK produces only the wings for Airbus and has the supply chain in place.

“In case there is no agreement, we will not be allowed to install parts and make them fly on airplanes so there will be aircraft grounded,”

So which aircraft will be grounded? Both you and the media have said our operators won't be able to fly in EU airspace so he must be referring to EU operators surely!

“We will, of course, speak up. We do this because this is what we owe our shareholders,” German-born Enders said.

Of course this is what busnisses do he goes on though.

Asked to provide examples of the steps being taken to soften the impact of Brexit, Airbus’s Faury said the company was looking at installing a three-month buffer of parts in some factories.

But in order to reach this level in the nine months remaining before Britain leaves the European Union, suppliers would have to abruptly raise production by one third - whereas most of suppliers were already at full capacity, he said.

Airbus is building warehouses to store the extra parts, an industry source added.

This is not the head of an industry saying production will be moved out of the country (though it may be eventually) but one saying he is striving to get a 3 month buffer of EASA cerified parts to put in the wing to carry on production for at least 3 months after a full brexit if there is no deal.

That takes us nicely back to Dave's assertion that there will be no transition period in the event of no deal! What will happen to 3 months supply of uncertified wings? There'll only be certified parts inside of them, the wing itself has to be certified.

So yes Andrew, I took time to read (couldn't listen) it, I suggest you do the same.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by pip08456

So yes Andrew, I took time to read (couldn't listen) it, I suggest you do the same.

I've taken your advice Pip and read this salutary warning in the article. "Airbus last month issued its strongest warning yet over Brexit, saying that withdrawal without a deal would force it to reconsider its long-term position and put thousands of British jobs at risk."

The problem for everyone(all sides) is that we are in uncharted waters in a dinghy and we seem to have mislaid the paddles and the map. Just about the only certainty is that like a divorce there will be pain,recrimination and a aggression sorting out of the shared possessions in our future and it may take a very long time before we reach a comfortable position as a country.

However both sides should be working together to mitigate any future pain to all of the citizens of the UK. We haven't got time to fight each other. Whatever happened to compromise? The time for recrimination should be over by now.

[pip08456]

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

The problem for everyone(all sides) is that we are in uncharted waters in a dinghy and we seem to have mislaid the paddles and the map. Just about the only certainty is that like a divorce there will be pain,recrimination and a aggression sorting out of the shared possessions in our future and it may take a very long time before we reach a comfortable position as a country.

However both sides should be working together to mitigate any future pain to all of the citizens of the UK. We haven't got time to fight each other. Whatever happened to compromise? The time for recrimination should be over by now.

The problem with this divorce is children won't accept that the divorce is happening.









metaphorically speaking.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

The problem for everyone(all sides) is that we are in uncharted waters in a dinghy and we seem to have mislaid the paddles and the map. Just about the only certainty is that like a divorce there will be pain,recrimination and a aggression sorting out of the shared possessions in our future and it may take a very long time before we reach a comfortable position as a country.

However both sides should be working together to mitigate any future pain to all of the citizens of the UK. We haven't got time to fight each other. Whatever happened to compromise? The time for recrimination should be over by now.

Some positive sounds here.

The EU’s chief Brexit negotiator on Friday said he was ready to negotiate with the British government to prevent a hard border for Northern Ireland, insisting that Brussels did not want to divide the province from the rest of the UK.
Michel Barnier said there was still time to seal a Brexit withdrawal deal before Britain’s departure in March. But he added that the two sides needed to rapidly “de-dramatise” a long-running dispute over “backstop” plans that would avoid checks at the Irish border.
“There will be a backstop, not necessarily our backstop,” he said, adding: “We can work, we can amend, we can improve.”

https://www.ft.com/content/85c97370-...d-0181731a0340

[Sephiroth]

Do,please remember that there is a specific term used in the EU: “Withdrawal Agreement”.

This would be the agreement that determines what the financial settlement and citizens’ rights, among several others.

They want that stitched up before the future relationship can be taken forward in earnest.

There is still much to exercise us and argue over.

[papa smurf]

'They're a THREAT!' Tory MP warns of SHOCKING consequences if May surrenders to rebels


interesting video about the possible outcome of surrendering to Tory rebels

Speaking exclusively to Express.co.uk, Ms Dorries said: “They are not just a threat to Brexit, they are a threat to the future of this country.


https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/99...election-today