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Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)
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Old 12-12-2020, 10:48   #391
chrispy2000
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

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Originally Posted by lonespeaker View Post
I upgraded a month ago via the web chat. they did it for £85 a month. I was only 4 months into an 18 month contract too.
That is only £4 less a month a new customer gets if for in a 18 month contract.
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Old 12-12-2020, 11:29   #392
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

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Originally Posted by chrispy2000 View Post
That is only £4 less a month a new customer gets if for in a 18 month contract.
I am only on the Bigger Bundle with 2 Maxit TV V6 boxes, not on the Oomph Bundle, and was still invited to join the 360 "upgrade" at no charge.
It is most definitely NOT an "upgrade", I see it as just a different menu and operating system with the same channels and content but accessed differently.
I wouldn't get upset about not getting the invite (I wish I never!) and at this stage I would not recommend it until all the bugs are ironed out with software fixes.
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Old 12-12-2020, 11:44   #393
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

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Originally Posted by jfman View Post
Well, there's the RRP and the roulette wheel of retentions.
Very true.
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Old 12-12-2020, 20:07   #394
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

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Originally Posted by lonespeaker View Post
I upgraded a month ago via the web chat. they did it for £85 a month. I was only 4 months into an 18 month contract too.

Week or so later I was invited to the current V6 software upgrade to TV360 trial.
thanks!
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Old 12-12-2020, 22:26   #395
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

Having received the new tv360 main box and mini box I can say that I like the speed and look of the new interface. Tbh we don’t record much and mainly stream/watch from catchup so won’t miss the extra storage we had from two V6 boxes but with hard drives so cheap I think VM would have saved their support staff a lot of grief if they had put a 2TB drive in the main box. Ok the mini box having to have coax is still annoying but most other issues can be fixed with software updates.

The annoying issue were catch-up kept failing on the V6 until I rebooted is also gone. And the Netflix and Amazon prime apps seem to actually work now.

Personally I preferred to have new boxes after having had the V6s for a number of years those considering the software update method should be aware their hard drives aren’t likely to last too much longer. Also looking at VMs user forum it seems many of the issues are with converted V6s so why risk it for a bit more storage.

Last edited by Zarf2007; 12-12-2020 at 22:31.
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Old 13-12-2020, 11:33   #396
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

I've been giving the new 360 software a whirl. I'm going to try and be objective here and give a balanced take things based on the current software version. Before I start, here are some health warnings:

  • I'm normally a Sky+ user
  • These are just my opinions
  • I only played around with it for a couple hours
  • I've not tested the profile section
  • It's a good while since I've properly used the TiVo based software so might be being unfair in some criticisms
  • The box I was using was an upgraded V6 rather than a fresh install
  • My lack of overall usage may mean I've missed some shortcuts that might make some of my criticisms irrelevant, and I'm happy to be corrected.
  • I appreciate that with all new things, there is a learning curve


So let's start with the positives.

It looks a whole lot better than the TiVO based software and works really fast. This is very subjective I know, but I like it. Channel change is near instantaneous and matches Sky+ which is great.

Watchlists I think will actually be really useful. If you've found something you don't want to watch immediately, and it was hard to find, you can save it there and get super quick access. If they can find some way of working around Netflix's stupid stance on search integration I think this will actually be one of its better features.

I was in the "voice search is a gimmick" camp but actually is really useful. It's usually the fasted way of getting to things in most cases if you know what you are looking for. I think it would become my preferred method of search in the long term.

The new guide is nice and clean and doesn't feel cluttered. It's just a bit of a change to have the programme information at the bottom when just about every thing else I've used has it at the top. This isn't wrong, just not something my brain is used to.

I think some of the menu layouts are a lot more user friendly than TiVo and in some respects does a better job displaying information. I also don't feel like I'm going really deep down into menus like I used to.

Start Over is actually a really cool idea - it's just a shame it's across limited channels. I'm not here to get into a debate about this is just a rebrand of catch up (it isn't) but I think this kind of gets around the need to have the box buffering multiple channels itself - a great feature I admit, but I suspect most box users have no clue it's there on the TiVO and I'm not even sure people who do find it get it. This makes the whole thing a lot more accessible for the average user. And it removes a significant overhead on the boxes in ordinary use which will help with overall performance.

But quite why start over and catch up have the same icon I don't know.

So where am I on the fence.

I quite like the new filtering system in the guide and on demand as it's a quick way of reorganising things but it's not easy to clear filters once they are set. This is where the old clear button would have come in useful. It would be good if you could save a preference for the sort by filter because that's "popular" by default and I'd much rather it was alphabetical. More on that in the section below.

Whilst the new mini guide is nice and clean, information hierarchy isn't great and it's hard to see what you are looking and or what is the most important piece information.

The remote itself. I'm not sure what it is but I feel they could have done better.

The new programme info screens. They look great, but if I only want to see a synopsis it's a bit of an overkill but it does remove that quirk of the TiVo software where pressing info on a programme shows something different depending on whether or not you have the mini guide open.

OK so to what I don't like.

My biggest issue is there seems to be some really odd UX choices that make things unnecessarily complicated.

You go into a very similar sections and the layout is completely different for no obvious reason e.g. Catch Up VS Sky Cinema.

There are multiple ways to get to the same content but they behave very differently. The TiVO system was guilty of this too admittedly.

The home key doesn't behave consistently. Sometimes it goes back to home, sometimes it goes back one step.

If you're trying to get people to understand a new system consistency is key.

Is it clear that pressing OK expands menus in the new home screen? I'm not so sure. Once you've worked that out, it's fine but my parents were confused.

The fact there isn't really a proper list of your series links is an interesting omission given that is probably the best feature of the TiVo based software. There is the upcoming section but that's not really doing the job.

There are the broader series link issues which are well documented so won't say too much. But to have done such a half arsed job of it for launch, given the series link heritage of TiVo, especially when you're trying to convince some higher paying customers to move across seems a very interesting decision. It just did it's job cleverly and the user didn't have to think too much about it. And this is something that definitely isn't flagged clearly.

From a recording perspective, the default is to show all recordings across both boxes which I feel is an odd default but you need to remember that there is meant to be a parent and child box set up. It's already caused a number of accidental deletions (which you coincidentally now can't retrieve from a deleted folder - once they're gone, they're gone) because the other household member didn't remember setting up those recordings. Yes you can filter it for your box, it doesn't remember the next time you come in. I guess this is because it's geared towards a parent and child box set up rather than two parent boxes.

And this audio sync bug that doesn't seem to have been officially acknowledged by Virgin. Not sure how wide spread it is and whether it affects only those who upgraded their V6 boxes with external amplifiers. But every day you turn the box on, the audio/video is out of sync to a different degree and needs to be manually adjusted. I think I've found a solution but it's a bit annoying.

A more minor quibble is the fact that it doesn't remember your filters. Which is a good and bad thing and there is no right and wrong answer but it would be good to have the choice. For sort by and also what recordings you are looking at e.g. all VS a specific box.

Some speculation and opinion now.

So that's my take on the new software as it stands. A lot of this can be resolved with software updates which I'm sure will come. But I think it might be a interesting change in direction for Virgin.

You have an existing platform that is feature rich, but is possibly costing a small fortune to license when 90% of its user base uses only half of its features. I've made these numbers up by the way but that's an assumption I've made.

So you start your own platform and make it do what 90% of the user base want and save on the licensing costs. Lower fees passed onto the user. To be clear, the 360 platform isn't at this point yet.

This approach will obviously annoy a certain customer segment but I guess they hope that some of those more advanced users move across and settle. Not that I'm saying that this is the correct or fair approach, nor this is actually the approach that Virgin are taking. This is my reading of the situation so it's just an opinion.

So what would I recommend:

  • If you're a new customer, you don't have a choice
  • If you're an existing customer on the right package and aren't a power user, I'd probably hold off unless you want the slicker interface
  • If you're a power user, stick with what you've got


Hope people have found this useful!

Last edited by Bob; 13-12-2020 at 11:43.
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Old 13-12-2020, 12:52   #397
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

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Originally Posted by Bob View Post
And this audio sync bug that doesn't seem to have been officially acknowledged by Virgin. Not sure how wide spread it is and whether it affects only those who upgraded their V6 boxes with external amplifiers. But every day you turn the box on, the audio/video is out of sync to a different degree and needs to be manually adjusted. I think I've found a solution but it's a bit annoying.
It is a known error. Until it's fixed, I'd recommend leaving the audio delay setting at zero, and changing your TV picture settings to reduce the video processing delay instead. High frame rate settings are often the culprit. Changing settings like film mode and game mode can also help.

If you do have an amp, it might also have an audio delay setting you could use.
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Old 13-12-2020, 13:30   #398
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

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Originally Posted by spiderplant View Post
It is a known error. Until it's fixed, I'd recommend leaving the audio delay setting at zero, and changing your TV picture settings to reduce the video processing delay instead. High frame rate settings are often the culprit. Changing settings like film mode and game mode can also help.

If you do have an amp, it might also have an audio delay setting you could use.
Glad it's known. There was a thread on the official forum but no one from VM has participated. Also hadn't seen it mentioned here so wasn't sure how prevalent it was.

Those are helpful tips - thanks Spiderplant. I will have a tinker with things this afternoon. I'll have to dig into their Sony's TV settings.

Update: Put the TV in Cinema mode and that seems to have solved the issue!

Last edited by Bob; 13-12-2020 at 13:39.
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Old 13-12-2020, 15:18   #399
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob View Post
From a recording perspective, the default is to show all recordings across both boxes which I feel is an odd default but you need to remember that there is meant to be a parent and child box set up. It's already caused a number of accidental deletions because the other household member didn't remember setting up those recordings.

This depends on how your household uses the boxes.


If you're independent adults living in a shared house and you've each got a box in your room, then you'd want it to just show your recordings, with a way of finding other recordings when your housemate happened to mention a great show they'd been watching.


If you live alone and have a box in the lounge and a box in the bedroom, you don't want to have to think about which box you were on when you made the recording - you'd want it to show up the same everywhere.


I've seen mention of profiles. Can you have your old behaviour by both using your own profile?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob View Post
So that's my take on the new software as it stands. A lot of this can be resolved with software updates which I'm sure will come. But I think it might be a interesting change in direction for Virgin.


...


So you start your own platform and make it do what 90% of the user base want and save on the licensing costs. Lower fees passed onto the user. To be clear, the 360 platform isn't at this point yet.

It's all very well saying wait for the software updates, but this isn't new software. It's already in use in other countries, so I'd have expected them to have resolved problems like over-recording series links and audio syncing by now.
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Old 13-12-2020, 16:18   #400
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

Can someone please explain Watchlist, the extremely poor substitute for Bookmarks, and how it works, specifically why not all epg content can be added?..So what is the point?
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Old 13-12-2020, 17:04   #401
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

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Originally Posted by thelem View Post
This depends on how your household uses the boxes.


If you're independent adults living in a shared house and you've each got a box in your room, then you'd want it to just show your recordings, with a way of finding other recordings when your housemate happened to mention a great show they'd been watching.


If you live alone and have a box in the lounge and a box in the bedroom, you don't want to have to think about which box you were on when you made the recording - you'd want it to show up the same everywhere.


I've seen mention of profiles. Can you have your old behaviour by both using your own profile?






It's all very well saying wait for the software updates, but this isn't new software. It's already in use in other countries, so I'd have expected them to have resolved problems like over-recording series links and audio syncing by now.
I don't know what affect profiles have as I've not tried them out. I'm not saying the situation in this household is "normal" but my point was that it would be nice to be able to set a default view that is remembered. The old TiVo software let you get recordings off other boxes if you wanted but it wasn't the default list of recorded programmes. It's not a big deal but just want what was expected because of the way TiVo behaved.

And I'm not suggesting the current software is good. Far from it. I even said I wouldn't recommend upgrading if you have TiVo at this point in time.

Also, how much of the software from other European deployments is maintained for the UK version? How much of it has been rewritten? Did the do updates to existing software or deploy completely new hardware for everyone? Genuine questions.

All this has an impact on testing and the isolation of issues. I agree however that some of this should probably have been spotted sooner.

This software is far from perfect and agree some of the missing features should probably have been added before it was rolled out. At no point did I suggest that relying on software updates was an acceptable situation for feature that are missing. Virgin should have been more transparent about the differences and features that you'll lose. They did do that when TiVo first launched as there was some functionality loss initially. Red button and reminders spring to mind.

But this isn't been forced on anyone who has a V6 and as I said at the very end of my post, I wouldn't recommend it.

The main point of the post to be honest. To help people who didn't know what to do have a bit more insight.

This all assumes it's Virgin's intention to replicate TiVos features with their own software which I suspect isn't the case. They'll cherry pick the ones that have the most value I suspect. Again, I have no insider knowledge on the matter. It's just my take on the situation.

---------- Post added at 17:04 ---------- Previous post was at 16:59 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by fox35 View Post
Can someone please explain Watchlist, the extremely poor substitute for Bookmarks, and how it works, specifically why not all epg content can be added?..So what is the point?
In its current form it feels like what you have on Netflix. A place to gather shows that you intend to watch on a single place for ease of finding later and it's agnostic to the source. Netflix's decision not to allow third parties to aggregate their content aside.

I've not come across EPG content that couldn't be added but didn't look into that deeply. What have you found so far that doesn't work?

Last edited by Bob; 13-12-2020 at 17:17.
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Old 13-12-2020, 20:23   #402
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

"I've not come across EPG content that couldn't be added but didn't look into that deeply. What have you found so far that doesn't work?"[/QUOTE]
Sky One 8pm tomorrow "A League Of Their Own", just an example of many many shows and content that cannot be added to Watchlist.
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Old 13-12-2020, 21:41   #403
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

Hmm...just picked loads of shows at random and there doesn't seem to be any sort of logical pattern to what is or isn't. Thought it might be a rights issue but doesn't look like it...
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Old 14-12-2020, 09:10   #404
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

Does anyone see the BBC iPlayer UHD trials/series on their 360 box ?

Works well when viewing on my native Sony TV iPlayer app but just curious about the 360.
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Old 14-12-2020, 10:25   #405
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Re: Virgin TV 360 users (Horizon)

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Does anyone see the BBC iPlayer UHD trials/series on their 360 box ?

Works well when viewing on my native Sony TV iPlayer app but just curious about the 360.
I searched for UHD on iPlayer on my TV360 box and although it finds several programmes (Dracula etc) it doesn't appear to play in UHD although the picture quality looks great.

I then tried my LG TV built in iPlayer and searched for UHD and it found the same programmes, except the title now has a UHD logo next to it.

So unless the TV360 iplayer omits the UHD logo, I don't know whether it does or doesn't lol
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