Brexit (Old) - Page 470

**Hugh** · 30-01-2019, 08:05

"Alternative arrangements"?

Is that like a "cunning plan"?

I’m not being flippant, but it would seem our revised approach to Brussels is "something something not sure what this will be something something" - if that gets agreed, I will be impressed (and I hope it does get agreed, to avoid a Hard Brexit).

When I ran Major Programmes, if something wasn’t going to be delivered, and I offered alternatives to the Programme Board, they would want to know what the specific ‘alternatives’ were, and wouldn’t accept generalities - can’t really see the EU being any different.

**Mick** · 30-01-2019, 08:22

The ball is now firmly in EU hands, their move.

It’s all well and good, them playing a tough hand, “We won’t budge.”

But as it stands. Germany is on brink of recession. Ireland’s economy could crash also if No deal becomes the only way forward. The EU cannot afford to take such a financial hit.

They’ve offered really only to extend A50 or revoke it, that was overwhelmingly rejected last night in parliament, a second referendum will now not be entertained, the Cooper Amendment and Grieve Amendment could have paved a way for this, but that got killed last night.

No, the EU wants us to keep voting. Well, we’re not singing to their tune and the cracks are appearing all over the place.

ianch99 · 30-01-2019, 08:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

It does seem like no deal. Tbh I didn't think May would go back and ask to reopen the withdrawal agreement she agreed. I can see the EU allowing some fudge but in the end I don't see them conceding the Irish border question, it doesn't seem there is actually time for it.

The pundit reaction seems to be that this is a stalling tactic to allow another two weeks.

Parliament made it clear that No Deal was off the table at least as far as the motion allowed. Interestingly, the two successful motions sort of cancel each other out.

May is going to the EU to threaten No Deal if they do not cave in and at the same time, the EU can see, behind May's back, a placard which says "She's Buffling!"

Nice ..

Mr K · 30-01-2019, 08:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre

Ball is in EU court really.

They've already whacked the ball back into our court.. (i.e no renegotiation)

Where is Andy Murray when you need him?

papa smurf · 30-01-2019, 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99

Parliament made it clear that No Deal was off the table at least as far as the motion allowed. Interestingly, the two successful motions sort of cancel each other out.

May is going to the EU to threaten No Deal if they do not cave in and at the same time, the EU can see, behind May's back, a placard which says "She's Buffling!"

Nice ..

None binding and meaningless,May can just ignore it if she wants , no deal is still the default position.

Mr K · 30-01-2019, 09:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by papa smurf

None binding and meaningless,May can just ignore it if she wants , no deal is still the default position.

Much like all the other things voted on yesterday, meaningless. Apparently we have to wait another 2 weeks for another 'meaningful' vote -which will doubtless be ignored if it gives the wrong answer !

I know this maybe controversial, but I'm beginning to think politicians are a total waste of time and money...

**Damien** · 30-01-2019, 09:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick

The ball is now firmly in EU hands, their move.

It’s all well and good, them playing a tough hand, “We won’t budge.”

But as it stands. Germany is on brink of recession. Ireland’s economy could crash also if No deal becomes the only way forward. The EU cannot afford to take such a financial hit.

Remember that the EU has been thinking no deal is more likely for a while now. It's going to be bad for them but I think it might be priced into their decision making at this point. If our only plan is 'we really will do no deal you know?' then I don't think it's going to work.

I think the ERG et all know this which is why they're so keen on the tactic. It's no deal.

At this point I am thinking we might as well. Let them have the pure Brexit they wanted and own it if there are consequences. If it does turn out fine then they were right and it worked, if it does go wrong then they can't pretend 'it wasn't Brexit though' and it's on them.

BenMcr · 30-01-2019, 09:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

if it does go wrong then they can't pretend 'it wasn't Brexit though' and it's on them.

I can pretty much guarantee they've been taking lessons from the Donald Trump school of ownership. Own the wins, blame everyone else for the failures.

**Maggy** · 30-01-2019, 09:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenMcr

I can pretty much guarantee they've been taking lessons from the Donald Trump school of ownership. Own the wins, blame everyone else for the failures.

**Damien** · 30-01-2019, 09:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenMcr

I can pretty much guarantee they've been taking lessons from the Donald Trump school of ownership. Own the wins, blame everyone else for the failures.

Politicans always do but if the public buys it is the question and it will be hard for Johnson, Mogg and Baker to say it wasn't the Brexit they wanted and try to start a stab in the back myth.

**Maggy** · 30-01-2019, 09:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

Politicans always do but if the public buys it is the question and it will be hard for Johnson, Mogg and Baker to say it wasn't the Brexit they wanted and try to start a stab in the back myth.

Oh they will. They have become quite adept at the act of speaking in forked tongue.

**Damien** · 30-01-2019, 09:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maggy J

Oh they will. They have become quite adept at the act of speaking in forked tongue.

They will but few will buy it IMO. What could they say?

jonbxx · 30-01-2019, 09:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

Remember that the EU has been thinking no deal is more likely for a while now. It's going to be bad for them but I think it might be priced into their decision making at this point. If our only plan is 'we really will do no deal you know?' then I don't think it's going to work.

I think the ERG et all know this which is why they're so keen on the tactic. It's no deal.

There is that strange disconnect where people from the ERG and their ilk say there nothing to fear from a no deal situation while at the same time say that the EU will budge as they don't want a no deal as it will be bad for them.

Let's not forget the relative exposure of the two parties which I have posted before;

UK exports to EU in 2017 - £274b or 44% of all exports or 14% of GDP
UK imports from EU in 2017 - £341b or 8% of all exports or 2.6% of GDP

(GDP figures from Trading Economics site, exchange rates from Google Finance)

BenMcr · 30-01-2019, 10:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

They will but few will buy it IMO. What could they say?

As a starter - that even if we leave with No Deal, all the impacts from that are because the EU are blocking us by still not making exceptions for the UK.

papa smurf · 30-01-2019, 10:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr K

Much like all the other things voted on yesterday, meaningless. Apparently we have to wait another 2 weeks for another 'meaningful' vote -which will doubtless be ignored if it gives the wrong answer !

I know this maybe controversial, but I'm beginning to think politicians are a total waste of time and money...

It shows that they don't share your view of how brexit should proceed, maybe it's your version that is just out of touch.