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Britain outside the EU
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Old 05-02-2021, 12:20   #346
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Re: Britain outside the EU

So, the crunch point is are they "our friends in Europe?". If not, there's little point bothering with them to any greater extent than we would bother with other non-friends such as Belarus.

It's clear who are friends are, including: Australia, New Zealand, Canada, USA, Portugal, Sweden, Israel, Singapore and prolly a good few others.

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Old 05-02-2021, 12:39   #347
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Re: Britain outside the EU

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth View Post
You might be partially right about time being the cure - except that the status quo on sending food etc to NI would prolong unreasonable disaster.

In case one might respond "but that's what we signed up to", there's nothing wrong with trying to rectify the unintended consequences. If the EU say no to Gove, then there's little point in pretending that they are "our friends in Europe"; they become the enemy to a certain degree.

Gove is after two more years of grace so that we can build our software to accurately populate the crazy forms (70 pages I understand for a fish consignment to the EU). If they are "our friends", they'll say yes.
They had offered to extend the implementation period for another two years to prevent problems like this arising but Boris said there was no need and everything was ready. Is Boris wrong or right?
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Old 05-02-2021, 13:01   #348
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Re: Britain outside the EU

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Originally Posted by 1andrew1 View Post
The supermarkets had tons of problems but this will be overcome by sourcing from Ireland and other EU countries instead of Great Britain.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-55575988
https://www.newfoodmagazine.com/news...and-shortages/

Some foods can no longer be exported from NI to GB.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-55818519
This is where it gets stupid. The eels can't be exported to Billingsgate because of an export ban to countries outside the EU.

Then

Quote:
There is also likely to be additional cost for the fishermen's co-operative if it has to fly its eels to the Netherlands from Dublin, rather than from the nearby Belfast International Airport, to adhere to the terms of the EU's eel trade restrictions.
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Old 05-02-2021, 13:01   #349
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Re: Britain outside the EU

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 View Post
They had offered to extend the implementation period for another two years to prevent problems like this arising but Boris said there was no need and everything was ready. Is Boris wrong or right?
If it's as you say, Boris was wrong. He is far too gung-ho, imo.

EDIT: My remark above does not include extending the WA. I should have picked that up.
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Old 05-02-2021, 13:13   #350
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Re: Britain outside the EU

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 View Post
They had offered to extend the implementation period for another two years to prevent problems like this arising but Boris said there was no need and everything was ready. Is Boris wrong or right?
And how would that have alleviated anything?

It would've involved the WHOLE of the WA being extended. The 2 year offer was made in April of last year. As I have to keep pointing out, the failure of the Joint Committee(ie the EU) is the biggest problem. They were the ones responsible for the detail of how things were going to be implemented.
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Old 05-02-2021, 13:22   #351
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Re: Britain outside the EU

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth View Post
If it's as you say, Boris was wrong. He is far too gung-ho, imo.
Yep, a particularly scathing David Allen Green blog on this subject was published yesterday - Four examples of Prime Ministerial power – how Boris Johnson in fact ‘did everything he could’ for there to be a trade barrier down the Irish Sea

As always, you have to ask if the deal is so bad, is the Government;
  • Incompetent
  • Negligent
  • Malicious
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Old 05-02-2021, 13:47   #352
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Re: Britain outside the EU

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking View Post
And how would that have alleviated anything?

It would've involved the WHOLE of the WA being extended. The 2 year offer was made in April of last year. As I have to keep pointing out, the failure of the Joint Committee(ie the EU) is the biggest problem. They were the ones responsible for the detail of how things were going to be implemented.
Per Seph's post - it would allow time for the appropriate software to be written and tested.

Stating something erroneous multiple times does not make it correct.

---------- Post added at 12:47 ---------- Previous post was at 12:35 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonbxx View Post
Yep, a particularly scathing David Allen Green blog on this subject was published yesterday - Four examples of Prime Ministerial power – how Boris Johnson in fact ‘did everything he could’ for there to be a trade barrier down the Irish Sea

As always, you have to ask if the deal is so bad, is the Government;
  • Incompetent
  • Negligent
  • Malicious
A great blogger.

I think the issue is that the government was fixated on a deadline of 31st December 2020 to end the transition period as it would feel like failure to have another extension.
So, it's more a case of sign now, we'll sort the mess out afterwards but the electorate and history books will show we started the new trade deal on 1st January 2021.
A long way of saying a) Incompetent but probably competent in keeping the electorate on board ie survival which is most government's aim.
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Old 05-02-2021, 14:08   #353
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Re: Britain outside the EU

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonbxx View Post
Yep, a particularly scathing David Allen Green blog on this subject was published yesterday - Four examples of Prime Ministerial power – how Boris Johnson in fact ‘did everything he could’ for there to be a trade barrier down the Irish Sea

As always, you have to ask if the deal is so bad, is the Government;
  • Incompetent
  • Negligent
  • Malicious
I can forgive the government for a bad deal in the sense of my position on the Leaver scale. Just get it done and nibble away at what needs undoing. The EU has demonstrated how right we were for obvious reasons.

From your position as a Remainer, trade would take precedence over the Leavers' perception of sovereignty. We have different perceptions.

But yes, I've never been a Boris fan. But then you prolly wouldn't approve of my alternative preference.

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Old 05-02-2021, 14:11   #354
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Re: Britain outside the EU

Ah yes, Mr "Will the supermarkets buy the shellfish the EU will not take and work with our fishing industry to sell it to U.K. buyers?"...
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Old 05-02-2021, 14:15   #355
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Re: Britain outside the EU

Well, this guy obviously didn't get the memo.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55939857

Quote:
Forget Frankfurt and Paris, says Barclays boss
The UK financial services industry should focus on competing with the US and Asia rather than the EU.
That's the view of the boss of Barclays for the City after Brexit.
Jes Staley told the BBC that although jobs that would have been created here have been moved to the EU, Brexit gives one of the UK's most important sectors the chance to define its own agenda.
"I think Brexit is more than likely on the positive side than on the negative side," he said.
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Old 05-02-2021, 14:26   #356
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Re: Britain outside the EU

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Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Ah yes, Mr "Will the supermarkets buy the shellfish the EU will not take and work with our fishing industry to sell it to U.K. buyers?"...
Just goes to show how nasty the EU is and how right we are to diverge from the path they are taking.


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Old 05-02-2021, 15:24   #357
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Re: Britain outside the EU

I have a friend in Ireland that says it's impacting Ireland, with plenty of supermarkets with empty shelves and most of the goods to Ireland come through the UK.

Maybe R.o.I should have worked a bit harder with the UK to impress upon the EU to avoid these Irish Sea issues.
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Old 05-02-2021, 15:34   #358
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Re: Britain outside the EU

2016. Let's leave the EU to get rid of Brussels bureaucracy tying up business.

2021. 71 pages of paperwork for a single lorry of fish
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55887043
Quote:
Mr Samways says he initially felt "extremely prepared" for Brexit, but was surprised by the "excessive" amount of paperwork required.

The government says that it is aware of a "small number of issues" since 1 January and that the recent announcement of a £23m fund for fishing firms should help those "experiencing export delays".

But Mr Samways dismisses the suggestion that these are just teething problems.

He has concerns that delays and extra costs could mean UK fishermen will take their catch directly to ports on the Continent, cutting out exporters like him.

"That's something we cannot afford."


---------- Post added at 14:34 ---------- Previous post was at 14:28 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
I have a friend in Ireland that says it's impacting Ireland, with plenty of supermarkets with empty shelves and most of the goods to Ireland come through the UK.

Maybe R.o.I should have worked a bit harder with the UK to impress upon the EU to avoid these Irish Sea issues.
If the UK had accepted an extension to the withdrawal agreement but insisted a deal was signed this year then this issue could have been reduced significantly.. Unfortunately, the UK government decided against this and RofI can't compel an extension.
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Old 05-02-2021, 15:58   #359
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Re: Britain outside the EU

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 View Post
2016. Let's leave the EU to get rid of Brussels bureaucracy tying up business.

2021. 71 pages of paperwork for a single lorry of fish
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55887043


---------- Post added at 14:34 ---------- Previous post was at 14:28 ----------


If the UK had accepted an extension to the withdrawal agreement but insisted a deal was signed this year then this issue could have been reduced significantly.. Unfortunately, the UK government decided against this and RofI can't compel an extension.
Give it a chance, Andrew.

The EU has shown us its true colours. As you've said before, let's move on; I say let's make our way in the world. Sod the EU.
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Old 05-02-2021, 16:14   #360
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Re: Britain outside the EU

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Originally Posted by Sephiroth View Post
Give it a chance, Andrew.

The EU has shown us its true colours. As you've said before, let's move on; I say let's make our way in the world. Sod the EU.
I'll raise a glass to that
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