General : WWE (no spoilers for 24 hours)

The end of RAW was obvious what was going to happen (and the only way it could) but up to then it was a decent show. I'l probably buy Summerslam, hopefully the undercard backs up the main events instead of just being a 2hr wait.

The sound man must have been on double time at the end as well.

[TheDon]

Start was excellent.
Ending was crap.

The summerslam match has been obvious and telegraphed from the start. The non-reaction of the crowd to it said it all, it was a "oh is that it" moment.

The dueling chants was pretty crap as well because of the ridiculous amount of kids, girls, and middle aged single still live in their mom's basement men that will cheer Cena no matter what. God I hate Cena for how bad WWE is now (although it's not his fault it's all in the booking).

Speaking of hating Cena, why the **** did they bring out Johnny Ace just so Cena could come out and essentially rehash CM Punk's promo? Oh wait, it's because CM Punk's promo was gold, and you can't have anyone upstage Cena, so he came out and failed at being funny.

What could be a great angle is being ruined by two things:
1) HHH has to put himself over at every possible opportunity.
2) Cena has to be put over at every possible opportunity.

The WWE would be a MUCH better place without Cena, they're so hand tied with him because they made the mistake of letting him get so big at the expense of all others. If there were a number of big sellers, like there was in the attitude era, they could do a storyline like this MUCH better. Now, with the entire roster built to support one man, they can't do anything without worrying about destroying their one money maker.

I want Cena to get busted for steroids (the guys obviously on human growth hormone, he has the classic GH belly) so they can rebuild the WWE around a roster of talent not just one guy. His character is too far gone to save IMO, it'd take something absolutely special to reign it back in to the point where the audience will accept him not rolling all over everyone.

[Russ]

Punk out-promo'd HHH, never thought I'd see that happen. Awesome stuff. I'd love to see a 3-way promo between Punk, Rock and Jericho.

I almost spat my tea out of my nose when I read you want to see Cena out of WWE. To quote Miz, "Really?! Really?!".

I can never understand it when people say that. In their hurry to be part of the 'cool' "we hate Cena" group they fail to realise the obvious: he creates a reaction. A massive reaction. That is the most basic, remedial aspect of wrestling, from WWE to the local workingmen's club promotion.

You want to see the guy you don't like getting beaten. Usually it's the super-over heels (Miz etc) who you want to see losing. Admitedly Cena is a unique situation being a massively-over face to some but still, a large portion of the audience want to see him lose. Things are changing in WWE, they're allowing others to shine against Cena (Rock, Punk). You want to see Punk beat Cena at SS. Job done.

Again, I fail to see why you don't see the obviously regardind Cena's status. No one performer is bigger than WWE. If you want to blame anyone for Cena's rise then blame Vince, not the wrestler himself. They could easily bury him over time. If they started now then a clean win for Rock at WM would work.

As for HHH putting himself over...well duh! Why not? He's one of the best and they've put him in an excellent position. Instead of having no-credability situations in the past (Stone Cold being RAW GM whilst still a wrestler etc) they now have a man who the audience know is already a 'suit' in WWE management calling the shots. The advantage is HHH can work (unlike Vince) so obviously he'll return to the ring as part of the storyline. I'm assuming he'll try to 'control' Punk in the way Vince tried to make SCSA a 'company man' as his popularity took off. HHH hasn't wrestled regularly in a while so they need to make look strong.

Again the Laurenitis part was pretty obviously and clear to most people. Different demographs but Punk and Cena have almost the same levels of popularity so both guys need to go in to SS looking strong. Both men divide the audience which is why they ended the show they way they did. I'm genuinely puzzled as to why so many people fail to see that.

Although I will agree the way they did the ending was embarrassing.

[TheDon]

Yes but the reaction he causes isn't the sort of reaction you want, it's an eye rolling "oh god this again". People don't boo him because they hate him in a positive way like a heel, they boo him because he's boring and repetitive and it's just the same old same old. This isn't like Cena fans booing CM Punk because he took the title away, which is the reaction you want, this is people booing him because the very concept of Cena is boring, stale, and damaging to the whole of WWE.

I don't want to see Cena getting beat, I actually don't want to see Cena AT ALL, because I know exactly how it'll end up, Cena will win whatever blow off matches they have with some five moves of doom rapadoo superman crap because he always has to come out on top. The same as has happened time and time and time again. It's boring, it's stale, it's insulting to anyone with half a brain.

Other people might be getting "to shine" but there every time they do Cena pops up to remind everyone how he's the greatest and at the top of the company. The entire thing is built around him.

You can tell how bad things are with Cena when he ridicules CM Punk's claim to the title by going "why? because he beat me one time?" Yes Cena, that's EXACTLY why he's the one with the biggest claim to the championship, because he BEAT YOU in a CHAMPIONSHIP MATCH. In this entire feud CM Punk has done everything to put the WWE Championship over, to make it out like it matters, like it's important. For years now the title has been nothing but a prop, and Cena on Raw showed exactly why, he doesn't care that he lost the title, because the guy only beat him once, it doesn't matter, Cena's still the best.

I agree that no one SHOULD be bigger than WWE, but Cena is. Cena is WWE. I already said it's not his fault, it's the fault of booking, but Cena at the moment is so far ahead of the rest of the roster that reigning him in is actually damaging to the company. People say it time and time again, Cena is merch sales. When was the last time WWE's merch was build around one guy? Attitude era there were a ton of guys all shifting merch, no one person stood out along, not even The Rock, you had Stone Cold there shifting just as much, but now it's all Cena.

HHH is permanently over, he doesn't HAVE to put himself over, he's over just by being HHH. His job should be to put other people over, instead he buries people at the expense of himself. We saw it last time he had a major role, he buried the entire roster one 20minute promo at a time. He's doing it with CM Punk, making sure that he knows that HHH, someone past their peak, is better than him still and could destroy him anytime he wanted. Why? What do we gain from that? What do we gain from knowing that a wrestler who isn't on the roster anymore, can destroy the WWE champion? It's just pointless. Like CM Punk said, it's all ego. What exactly does the WWE gain by putting a part-time wrestler over at the expense of guys working on the roster?

Both guys need to go into SS looking strong, but Cena could do that in any manner of ways, hell Cena looks strong just because he's Cena. His promo on Johnny Ace was another fine example of him burying the WWE title, his favourite part of a title match, in which he needed to save the title from leaving the WWE, was punching a suit in the face. How exactly does that do anything to build up the credibility of the WWE?

Even when CM Punk did his "I'm leaving" promo, he put the title over at the expense of everything else, making it mean something, making it important, this is why he's doing his "it's not a belt, it's a championship title" thing, to try to get it to actually mean something. Cena doesn't care about it because it's a prop to him. If he has it or not it doesn't matter, Cena is still the best in the WWE.

Which is why I say that it would be better without him, because with a character like Cena you have the entire company hand tied. If getting rid of him meant a major burying act (which would severely damage their income, so I doubt will ever happen) or him leaving, I don't care, I just think the product would be a hell of a lot better with an actual competitive roster. Not one that's build around giving guys short pushes for the sole purpose of feeding them to Cena.

There should be several viable champions each one with crowd support, it shouldn't just be one guy, with half the crowd in love with him, and the other half fed up with him and just cheering for who ever he's against.

I just can't see WWE pushing anyone else to the level of Cena.

[Russ]

They do not need to get rid of Cena. Just change him. They're doing it right now - for 7 years nobody ever broke his double shoulder block/ missed punch/ protoplex etc fightback but Punk and Rey did it within a few weeks. This looks like the start of a major shift for Cena. It may well take months (even up to a year) but it's a start.

[TheDon]

I've just lost faith in WWE being able to pull the trigger on something like that.

When you hear that the plan for this angle was for HHH to pedigree CM Punk and Del Rio to cash in, and that the arch being ended like that is pretty much a when not an if, it doesn't really do much to give you much faith that it's the start of the change that's needed.

It's obvious Del Rio is going to be champion before the Mexican tour, so it's just a matter of when and how that switch happens, and if it goes Via Cena.

[adzii_nufc]

Already told you the Cena Heel turn is incoming.

Getting good at preditcting things.. Either I am awesome or WWE is really that bad nowadays.

[Russ]

Very good at predicting things...if you count the kind of things everyone else has been predicting for months....

[adzii_nufc]

Originally Posted by Russ

Very good at predicting things...if you count the kind of things everyone else has been predicting for months....

So we both agree WWE is just that predictable?

[Russ]

We can agree Cena will eventually be turning heel, that much is a given.

[Russ]

WWE have released Vladimir Koslov, Melina, DH Smith and Chris Masters. Gail Kim has also left.

[wwe]

undertaker coming back in October Cart wait

[ChrisLUFC22]

Originally Posted by wwe

undertaker coming back in October Cart wait

Where have you read this mate? I've been waiting ages for his return, and I assumed it would be at SummerSlam as it seems to be a bit of a tradition nowadays.

[wwe]

Originally Posted by ChrisLUFC22

Where have you read this mate? I've been waiting ages for his return, and I assumed it would be at SummerSlam as it seems to be a bit of a tradition nowadays.

sorry forgot to add a link.



http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage...tober-PPV.html

[ChrisLUFC22]

Originally Posted by wwe

sorry forgot to add a link.



http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage...tober-PPV.html

Cheers