Home News Forum Articles
  Welcome back Join CF
You are here You are here: Home | Forum | Brexit

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most of the discussions, articles and other free features. By joining our Virgin Media community you will have full access to all discussions, be able to view and post threads, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own images/photos, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please join our community today.


Welcome to Cable Forum
Go Back   Cable Forum > General Discussion > Current Affairs

Brexit
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 13-04-2019, 18:07   #1591
Chris
Trollsplatter
Cable Forum Team
 
Chris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: North of Watford
Services: Humane elimination of all common Internet pests
Posts: 31,605
Chris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden aura
Chris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden auraChris has a golden aura
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrimUpNorth View Post
Agreed - didn't Adolph want a European super stake (of sorts)? Don't feel you can say that about about Nige
Stake = tent peg
State = territory, defined politically
Chris is offline   Reply With Quote
Advertisement
Old 13-04-2019, 18:29   #1592
007stuart
cf.addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Glasgow
Services: TIVO V6 Meg Service TV XL Virgin Phone Home & Mobile My wife says I have too many SONOS units
Posts: 394
007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future007stuart has a brilliant future
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris View Post
Stake = tent peg
State = territory, defined politically
Going to have to update your profile moniker of Trollsplatter to Wordsmith
007stuart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 19:22   #1593
Sephiroth
Simples
 
Sephiroth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: RG41
Services: Vivid 200;Hub 3 MM; ASUS RT-AC68U. BT Infinity2; Tivo; V6; XL Phone; Devolo 1200AV
Posts: 6,269
Sephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze array
Sephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze arraySephiroth has a bronze array
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 View Post
What's with the word police? We all knew what the post meant. Maybe he should have used an obscure french word instead

---------- Post added at 17:09 ---------- Previous post was at 16:59 ----------



A contradiction surely.

He 1) doesn't support his constituents (against Remain), 2) he doesn't support his country (for Hard Brexit) and 3) he does not support his party (voted against Mrs May)

Apart from this, he is a great MP ...
A shallow reply from you.

John Redwood has consistently campaigned against the EU's hegemony. He has consistently supported the concept of a Common Market. The electorate in his constituency have returned him to Parliament since 1987 fully knowing his position on the EU.

As you know, Brexit has turned everything on its head and your contribution is specious.
__________________
Seph.

My advice is at your risk.
Sephiroth is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 19:24   #1594
Pierre
The Dark Satanic Mills
 
Pierre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: floating in the ether
Posts: 7,416
Pierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny star
Pierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny star
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman View Post
Okay I shouldn't have made such a sweeping generalisation. I think enough are that at risk Tories from a Brexit party and at risk Labour MPs in majority leave voting constituencies.

I don't think that the Rees-Moggs, Redwoods, Johnsons, Goves, Raabs of this world are in politics to make the world a better place. All of them are independently wealthy and on the payroll of think-tanks, newspapers, etc. Johnson himself described the £100 000 financial interest in a flat he has as "chicken feed" - one can only assume he thinks the same of his backbench MP salary?
Well if all these are already millionaires then surely they havenít gone into politics for the money, they must be doing it for the altruism of civic duty?

In regards to wealthy MPs, I doubt youíll find many from any party that are on the bread line.
__________________
The wheel's still turning but the hamsters dead.
Pierre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 19:29   #1595
OLD BOY
Experience is everything
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wokingham
Services: 2 V6 boxes; Full House; Now TV, Amazon and Netflix; VM broadband and landline
Posts: 8,586
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick View Post
EU Parliament voting intention (10-11 April)

Lab - 24%
Con - 16%
Brexit Party- 15%
UKIP - 14%
Lib Dem - 8%
Green - 8%
Change UK - 7%
SNP/Plaid - 6%
Other - 1%

Yougov.
I think there is a general unawareness of the Brexit Party, and once we have had the election campaign, a lot of UKIP voters will come across to Farage's party.

---------- Post added at 19:29 ---------- Previous post was at 19:25 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman View Post
So the most popular party is the one with the vaguest Brexit policy!

Westminster voting intention:

LAB: 32% (+1)
CON: 28% (-4)
LDEM: 11% (-1)
BREX: 8% (+3)
UKIP: 6% (-1)
CHUK: 3% (+3)
GRN: 3% (-1)

via
@YouGov
, 10 - 11 Apr
Chgs. w/ 03 Apr
Yes, because the Brexit vote will be divided between the Conservatives, Brexit and UKIP..

I would have thought the leavers in the Labour Party would also move over to the Brexit Party. They would find that more attractive than the extreme right wing UKIP bunch. So expect to see the Labour voting intentions to diminish.
OLD BOY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 19:34   #1596
jfman
Architect of Ideas
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,750
jfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful one
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
Well if all these are already millionaires then surely they havenít gone into politics for the money, they must be doing it for the altruism of civic duty?

In regards to wealthy MPs, I doubt youíll find many from any party that are on the bread line.
There's nothing altruistic about austerity.

More like it's to be paid for their influence, raise their profiles for speaking, consultancy, boardroom positions in the future.

I'm not saying it's unique to the Conservative Party either.
jfman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 19:51   #1597
OLD BOY
Experience is everything
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wokingham
Services: 2 V6 boxes; Full House; Now TV, Amazon and Netflix; VM broadband and landline
Posts: 8,586
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien View Post
Farage is not popular. There is a reason the official Leave campaign didn't want to use him and why he has failed to be elected 6/7 times. He has some loyal support spread out thinly across the country.

He has represented relatively popular positions though and even if the supporters of those positions think it is a poor cheerleader for them he has often been the only outlet for them. There were plenty of Leave supporters who has distain for Farage's dog whistling xenophobia but UKIP were the only option if the matter of the EU was their main political concern. Just as Corbyn isn't popular but is the only option for many who want higher taxation, higher public spending and to end benefit cuts.

I don't really think he needs to be 'beaten', it's just a matter of continuing to argue against those positions and to not get drawn into Farage's ego-trip whilst doing so.
On the contrary, Nige was the only reason many people voted UKIP last time. Had it not been for the toxicity of UKIP with its fanatical base, many more would have voted for them.

Nige has recognised this and formed his very own party. You have grossly underestimated Nigel Farage's popularity, but then again you are a remainer and presumably mix socially with remainers.

---------- Post added at 19:43 ---------- Previous post was at 19:34 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
I don't - I think a (reasonably sized) minority may be, but that the majority of politicians get into politics because they want improve things for people and the country, but we sometimes differ (due to our outlook) because their thoughts on what would improve things may not be the same as ours.

I've known quite a few MPs, and most of them worked long hours (through the week and weekends), and often didn't see much of their families.
I agree with that, Hugh. People really don't understand how much work MPs have to get through and what their motives are. The vast majority are motivated with a desire to serve their constituents and to make a difference.

It is undeniable that MPs have very little time to spend with their families, such is their dedication. To call them 'self-serving' is very unfair.

It is easy enough for 'Gogglebox' contenders to sit on their sofas eating pizzas and criticising. If they truly disapprove, they should get off their butts, put themselves forward as candidates, and have the courage of their convictions.

---------- Post added at 19:46 ---------- Previous post was at 19:43 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman View Post
Okay I shouldn't have made such a sweeping generalisation. I think enough are that at risk Tories from a Brexit party and at risk Labour MPs in majority leave voting constituencies.

I don't think that the Rees-Moggs, Redwoods, Johnsons, Goves, Raabs of this world are in politics to make the world a better place. All of them are independently wealthy and on the payroll of think-tanks, newspapers, etc. Johnson himself described the £100 000 financial interest in a flat he has as "chicken feed" - one can only assume he thinks the same of his backbench MP salary?
Of course they want to make the world a better place! They want to make the country more prosperous (which is the way you fund public services sustainably), and being businessmen, they can see how this can be done.

---------- Post added at 19:51 ---------- Previous post was at 19:46 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien View Post
Corbyn could be elected for the same reasons Brexit won. A group of people feel the problems they have are being ignored and will vote for someone that they feel is speaking to them.

The Tories inability to do anything about homes for example is going to really hurt them in the end. They keep avoiding any real change because they don't want to upset their voter base by doing anything that might stop the inflation in house prices but their voter base is getting older and older.
What are you on about? So Labour's record on housing between 1997 and 2010 was anything to shout about?

There is a huge house building programme currently taking place. Villages are turning into towns in the Thames Valley!.

This will reduce house prices to much more sustainable levels. Unfortunately, this does take time, but at least this Government is trying.

Last edited by Hugh; 13-04-2019 at 22:40.
OLD BOY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 19:52   #1598
jfman
Architect of Ideas
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,750
jfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful one
Re: Brexit

More money in the hands of the few is not equal to making the country a better place. It’s only the way public services are funded if income and profits are effectively (and progressively) taxed. Something we know it isn’t.
jfman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 19:52   #1599
OLD BOY
Experience is everything
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wokingham
Services: 2 V6 boxes; Full House; Now TV, Amazon and Netflix; VM broadband and landline
Posts: 8,586
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 View Post
I guess John Redwood's seat may be at risk in the case of a general election then due to his pro-Brexit stance being at odds with those of his constituents'.
He has a big enough majority to sustain his position against those who voted for him before who don't really understand his stance on Brexit.
OLD BOY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 19:56   #1600
Hom3r
Proud Ex EU Citizen.
 
Hom3r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Galactic Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha, www.daves-world.co.uk. A secret Moonbase (shh don't tell anybody)
Age: 50
Services: 1 V6 Tivo, 2x1TB Tivo, , SH3. Samsung Galaxy Note 8, 2TB & 3 TB WD NAS, Smart Home stuff, & Cuddy To
Posts: 15,183
Hom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny stars
Hom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny starsHom3r has a pair of shiny stars
Re: Brexit

I was there to day outside Parliament Square.

The were stopping several groups merging.

---------- Post added at 19:56 ---------- Previous post was at 19:54 ----------

There is talk that Anna Sourbitch, and two other MPs are going to try and make a law banning negative comments against MPs.

if you can't handle the heat, I'm sure a shelf stacking job awaits
__________________
I voted leave, Leave means leave, and NO to an illegal 2nd referendum. We already voted in a democratic vote. Twitter Facebook
My Blog
Hom3r is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 20:08   #1601
OLD BOY
Experience is everything
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wokingham
Services: 2 V6 boxes; Full House; Now TV, Amazon and Netflix; VM broadband and landline
Posts: 8,586
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 View Post
What's with the word police? We all knew what the post meant. Maybe he should have used an obscure french word instead

---------- Post added at 17:09 ---------- Previous post was at 16:59 ----------



A contradiction surely.

He 1) doesn't support his constituents (against Remain), 2) he doesn't support his country (for Hard Brexit) and 3) he does not support his party (voted against Mrs May)

Apart from this, he is a great MP ...
The only true bit about this comment is (1), because it is correct to say that the majority of his constituents voted to remain. However, as most thinking people appreciate, the electorate was promised that the result of the referendum would be honoured. Clearly, he is an honorable man because he is trying to honour that promise.

As for (2), there are many Brexiteers who do not agree with the pessimistic view that leaving without a deal would be a disaster, because it would not be. Rather, it would give us the opportunity to trade on our own terms, free from EU tariff policies, suffocating bureaucracy and legislation which hampers businesses' ability to function.

And in relation to (3), it is perfectly honorable to Brexit without being closely tied to EU policies and obligations as it is to have a bridging arrangement to smooth the transition.

Both the ERG and Theresa May are trying to help us leave the EU. The true disrupters are the remainers who are trying to prevent the will of the electorate. Shame on them.

---------- Post added at 20:08 ---------- Previous post was at 20:04 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman View Post
The register of members interests will show that, all of those I've named, make far more from outside activity than they do from being an MP. I don't think that's an astonishing accusation in any way. It's a matter of public record.

Being a rational capitalist that I am if I had two jobs and one paid me four times the other, regardless of time commitment required, I know which I'd have more 'focus' on when it came to legislating on economic matters.
They get paid for their expertise. Can you justify your comment that those being paid from outside activity are doing less than those who don't?

As a Redwood constituent, I can tell you that I have raised a number of issues with him and received prompt and helpful responses. Xso I think your perception is completely wrong. Some people have an enormous capacity for work.
OLD BOY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 20:12   #1602
jfman
Architect of Ideas
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,750
jfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful one
Re: Brexit

suffocating bureaucracy and legislation which hampers businesses' ability to function.

That sounds more like trading on WTO rules with the largest single market in the world that just happens to be on your doorstep.

---------- Post added at 20:12 ---------- Previous post was at 20:09 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY
They get paid for their expertise. Can you justify your comment that those being paid from outside activity are doing less than those who don't?

As a Redwood constituent, I can tell you that I have raised a number of issues with him and received prompt and helpful responses. Xso I think your perception is completely wrong. Some people have an enormous capacity for work.
Thereís no requirement for me to justify comments I didnít make, although it doesnít surprise me you are getting into contortions trying to twist my words.
jfman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 20:17   #1603
OLD BOY
Experience is everything
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wokingham
Services: 2 V6 boxes; Full House; Now TV, Amazon and Netflix; VM broadband and landline
Posts: 8,586
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman View Post
More money in the hands of the few is not equal to making the country a better place. Itís only the way public services are funded if income and profits are effectively (and progressively) taxed. Something we know it isnít.
We rely on businessmen to bring money into the country. If you want to tax them until the pips squeak, they will simply move elsewhere. This is something socialists simply don't want to address. It's the politics of jealousy promoted by those without a clue.

---------- Post added at 20:17 ---------- Previous post was at 20:14 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman View Post
suffocating bureaucracy and legislation which hampers businesses' ability to function.

That sounds more like trading on WTO rules with the largest single market in the world that just happens to be on your doorstep.

---------- Post added at 20:12 ---------- Previous post was at 20:09 ----------



Thereís no requirement for me to justify comments I didnít make, although it doesnít surprise me you are getting into contortions trying to twist my words.
Well, that was the implication as I read it. OK, I'll humour you. What did you really mean to imply, then?

As for WTO rules, they are clearly liberating compared with EU legislation.
OLD BOY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 20:18   #1604
jfman
Architect of Ideas
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,750
jfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful onejfman is the helpful one
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post
We rely on businessmen to bring money into the country. If you want to tax them until the pips squeak, they will simply move elsewhere. This is something socialists simply don't want to address. It's the politics of jealousy promoted by those without a clue.
You’re making the false assumption that everyone can just up sticks, move somewhere else and make similar income/profits doing equivalent roles elsewhere. That’s very unlikely to be true for the vast majority of “businessmen”.

You’ve also personalised it, ignoring the big global companies who make huge profits from UK consumers and pay minimal tax here.

Quote:
Well, that was the implication as I read it. OK, I'll humour you. What did you really mean to imply, then?
It’s not my obligation to explain my posts in greater detail because you fail to understand them.

Quote:
As for WTO rules, they are clearly liberating compared with EU legislation.
So liberating very few countries trade on those terms.
jfman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-04-2019, 20:30   #1605
Dave42
cf.mega poster
 
Dave42's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Jarrow Tyne & Wear
Services: V.I.P 120 tivo and v+
Posts: 5,000
Dave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronze
Dave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronzeDave42 is cast in bronze
Re: Brexit

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post
We rely on businessmen to bring money into the country. If you want to tax them until the pips squeak, they will simply move elsewhere. This is something socialists simply don't want to address. It's the politics of jealousy promoted by those without a clue.

---------- Post added at 20:17 ---------- Previous post was at 20:14 ----------



Well, that was the implication as I read it. OK, I'll humour you. What did you really mean to imply, then?

As for WTO rules, they are clearly liberating compared with EU legislation.
is that why only 1 country in world trade only on them OB
Dave42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 2 (1 members and 1 guests)
Sephiroth
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:14.


Server: xenon.zmnt.net
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.