Post-Brexit Thread

Originally Posted by martyh

Exactly ,we do not want to be in it ,we just voted to get out of all that crap .It is enough to be able to trade on mutually agreed terms with countries instead of being told how/when and where we can trade .

Did we though? If we could stay in the common market without any of the rest of the EU stuff would that be ok?

A single market is very useful, especially for the service industry. Rather than the EU being a foreign market we trade with. Being able to treat Berlin as an addressable market the same way you would treat Liverpool is very good.

If we could get that without any of the other stuff perfect no?

Originally Posted by Damien

This morning there is more talk of a Norway deal this morning.

We don't need that ,for politicians to even suggest that shows a lack of confidence in themselves so while we're in the mood for chucking things out lets get rid of all the politicians not prepared to show some balls and make this work

---------- Post added at 09:09 ---------- Previous post was at 09:04 ----------

Originally Posted by Damien

Did we though? If we could stay in the common market without any of the rest of the EU stuff would that be ok?

A single market is very useful, especially for the service industry. Rather than the EU being a foreign market we trade with. Being able to treat Berlin as an addressable market the same way you would treat Liverpool is very good.

If we could get that without any of the other stuff perfect no?

Of course having free trade with the EU is better but we shouldn't get bogged down trying to get that at any cost ,we could survive quite easily without free trade .we used to be a self sufficient country actually supplying the rest of the world with skills and goods long before the EU swallowed us up

Originally Posted by martyh

We don't need that ,for politicians to even suggest that shows a lack of confidence in themselves so while we're in the mood for chucking things out lets get rid of all the politicians not prepared to show some balls and make this work

Well this is the problem isn't it? We voted Leave but not on what version of Leave we go for. There was a poll that showed the EEA was the most popular option of everyone because some on the Leave side supported it and the vast majority of Remain support it since it's the least change option. However a lot of Leave supporters would, rightly, be outraged because Immigration was the biggest theme of the Leave campaign.

This is why people are expecting an election so a governing party can get a mandate of what to do on Leave. I think though that Boris/Gove would be more inclined for the EEA option.

If we even had a chance of getting it that is. At the moment it seems the best deal we could get economically but the EU may well reject it.

Of course having free trade with the EU is better but we shouldn't get bogged down trying to get that at any cost ,we could survive quite easily without free trade .we used to be a self sufficient country actually supplying the rest of the world with skills and goods long before the EU swallowed us up

We also had an Empire.

Going forward we need a pragmatic focus on what is best for the UK now. What does our economy need in a deal, what could we get and what would it cost us.

Remainers have to expect the result and work for the best option and Leavers might have to temper their expectations of what is achievable and accept inevitable downsides they may not have expected.

[Anypermitedroute]

Originally Posted by Damien

Any reason for Austria? I was in Vienna a few months ago, seems a nice city to live in.

You could go before we actually leave? The one thing I am pretty sure of is that EU citizens already here and British people in the EU would be able to stay.

---------- Post added at 08:40 ---------- Previous post was at 08:38 ----------



Article 50 should be stalled at least until we have a new PM.

My girlfriend is Austrian and it is one the most beautiful places I seen. We goto south Austrian near the border, very rural. First Brit they have ever met but I made a real effort to understand the culture and learn about all items and they accepted me with welcome arms

The problem is Austria is fighting its own right wing issues regarding immigration and I'm hearing the same stories as before 10 years here ("of course I don't count but..." Line)

Yes I could go now but I think we will be even more buffered as simply we don't know what the deal will be. Yes I deep in my heart it will sort itself out but no one can say that with any degree of certainty whether EU as a whole or individual deals. All I knew under EU I have that freedom. I know I come from a generation that watch the fall of the wall, able to travel freely and people can sit around a dinner table from 6 nations, I'm not saying it won't continue to happen but it's just got harder and when people speak of returning to the good old days I read the history books and if I'm being honest it need to stay there as it's not the future I want for me or my children.

Utopian/aspirational/day dream, perhaps but you need to start somewhere and make it work and I just can't see how packing up and leaving will make that work but good luck to us.

And as for Norway model, I'm pretty sure the majority of Norwegian think it's poor deal. Whilst we are demonstarting a leanient view here on CF (which I am grateful) and elsewhere let's be honest with ourselves; the majority didn't want Eu because of immigration, People from abroad here taking what they perceive is their jobs because they consider that unfair (but likewise would at see a problem with a Brit working abroad)

I look forward to the jobless Britain taking the seasonal jobs of fruit picking and social care looking after my grandma, working as barista and cleaning toilets. Well done guys you got it back

Originally Posted by Damien

Well this is the problem isn't it? We voted Leave but not on what version of Leave we go for. There was a poll that showed the EEA was the most popular option of everyone because some on the Leave side supported it and the vast majority of Remain support it since it's the least change option. However a lot of Leave supporters would, rightly, be outraged because Immigration was the biggest theme of the Leave campaign.

Any deal that involves free movement of any sort would be totally unacceptable

This is why people are expecting an election so a governing party can get a mandate of what to do on Leave. I think though that Boris/Gove would be more inclined for the EEA option.

I would be very surprised if there wasn't a general election ,the problem is though is that all the major parties are pro Europe ,what about a new party or even a coalition with cross party ministers made up of Brexiters ?

If we even had a chance of getting it that is. At the moment it seems the best deal we could get economically but the EU may well reject it.

Another reason why we need strong politicians ,not the weak willed spongers we have had to put up with ,they have become lazy and reliant on Europe telling them what to do

Remainers have to expect the result and work for the best option and Leavers might have to temper their expectations of what is achievable and accept inevitable downsides they may not have expected.

I agree to an extent but i see this as an opportunity to give British Politics a shake up .Our politicians have become used to simply marking time and letting Europe make the real decisions ,now they need to take some chances and have the underlying idea that it is possible for the UK to function outside of Europe

---------- Post added at 09:45 ---------- Previous post was at 09:43 ----------

Originally Posted by Anypermitedroute

I look forward to the jobless Britain taking the seasonal jobs of fruit picking and social care looking after my grandma, working as barista and cleaning toilets. Well done guys you got it back

You may well be surprised .

[techguyone]

I don't understand why Anypermitedroute's girlfriend wouldn't be 'safe' ffs, is she going to be attacked or something? Given Austrias track record, you'd be less 'safe' in Austria.

I'm just glad we got the ref when we did, what with Gen Snowflake and the population makeup in the big Cities, another 5- 10 years would have killed that off forever.

This is our best chance to do something new and good, but it'll never work whilst half the country refuses to accept it and only offers doom and gloom.

I think a massive section of the public need to grow the fark up... petitions... calls for another ref... cries of how it's unfair... selfish old people etc etc.

It's happened, it's real, get over it.

Work together or it WILL fail.

Or is that what they want?

Originally Posted by techguyone

I don't understand why Anypermitedroute's girlfriend wouldn't be 'safe' ffs, is she going to be attacked or something? Given Austrias track record, you'd be less 'safe' in Austria.

I'm just glad we got the ref when we did, what with Gen Snowflake and the population makeup in the big Cities, another 5- 10 years would have killed that off forever.

This is our best chance to do something new and good, but it'll never work whilst half the country refuses to accept it and only offers doom and gloom.

I think a massive section of the public need to grow the fark up... petitions... calls for another ref... cries of how it's unfair... selfish old people etc etc.

It's happened, it's real, get over it.

Work together or it WILL fail.

Or is that what they want?

Yep ,those same people complaining about leaving the EU are most likely the same people complaining about Britain not being great any more ,well now's our chance and they will never get a better one in their lifetimes.Heard some student twonk on the news this morning complaining because going through customs is going to be "such a polarva"

Originally Posted by martyh

Yep ,those same people complaining about leaving the EU are most likely the same people complaining about Britain not being great any more ,well now's our chance and they will never get a better one in their lifetimes.Heard some student twonk on the news this morning complaining because going through customs is going to be "such a polarva"

Are the people who voted to stay in the EU the same people complaining about Britain not being great anymore? I would have thought such sentiments were more likely to come from people voting to Leave. They're far more likely to have been unhappy with the status-quo and to have been older. The archetypical Remain support would be a degree-level educated young person in a major city.

Personally I am not someone who thinks that. I think it's just a slogan. All of this stuff about believing in Britain, that Britain can be great again, doesn't go anywhere to making it happen. What will help is cold, hard, pragmatism and deal-making with the EU and beyond to secure the best outcome possible.

The vote was close. It's a divided country and in the case of Scotland a divide that may become tangible. We have a divide between cities and rural areas, young and old and between classes. This isn't going away. It wouldn't have gone away if Remain had won either. A fear some people had on either side was a close result and this is why.

Originally Posted by Damien

Are the people who voted to stay in the EU the same people complaining about Britain not being great anymore? I would have thought such sentiments were more likely to come from people voting to Leave. They're far more likely to have been unhappy with the status-quo and to have been older. The archetypical Remain support would be a degree-level educated young person in a major city.

Personally I am not someone who thinks that. I think it's just a slogan. All of this stuff about believing in Britain, that Britain can be great again, doesn't go anywhere to making it happen. What will help is cold, hard, pragmatism and deal-making with the EU and beyond to secure the best outcome possible.

The vote was close. It's a divided country and in the case of Scotland a divide that may become tangible. We have a divide between cities and rural areas, young and old and between classes. This isn't going away. It wouldn't have gone away if Remain had won either. A fear some people had on either side was a close result and this is why.

Way to have an upbeat attitude Damien

[denphone]

Originally Posted by techguyone

I don't understand why Anypermitedroute's girlfriend wouldn't be 'safe' ffs, is she going to be attacked or something? Given Austrias track record, you'd be less 'safe' in Austria.

I'm just glad we got the ref when we did, what with Gen Snowflake and the population makeup in the big Cities, another 5- 10 years would have killed that off forever.

This is our best chance to do something new and good, but it'll never work whilst half the country refuses to accept it and only offers doom and gloom.

I think a massive section of the public need to grow the fark up... petitions... calls for another ref... cries of how it's unfair... selfish old people etc etc.

It's happened, it's real, get over it.

Work together or it WILL fail.

Or is that what they want?

l have not moaned about it even though l voted remain so l think you are rather over generalising when you say half the country refuses to accept it as most people l know who voted remain have accepted the will of the people and have said the sooner we try to make this country work again the better.

[papa smurf]

there's a lot of talk in some papers about how the "boomers" have ruined the lives of 18-24 year olds who apparently voted to stay in large numbers ,does any one have an accurate turn out figure for this age group ie those who actually went to the polling booth . i found some stuff on the net yesterday that suggested a turn out of 34% and of that figure 70%voted remain not sure of its accuracy though.

Originally Posted by martyh

Way to have an upbeat attitude Damien

Oh come on. What's wrong with what I said?

I think it's a fair assessment of the situation. I didn't say we were heading for disaster but that it's a divided country, it is by the way, and we need to achieve the best deal possible.

Originally Posted by Damien

Oh come on. What's wrong with what I said?

I think it's a fair assessment of the situation. I didn't say we were heading for disaster but that it's a divided country, it is by the way, and we need to achieve the best deal possible.

Well you e gone from complete doom, to mild doom, another few days and your hysterics will be almost forgotten eh...

Originally Posted by RBMark

Well you e gone from complete doom, to mild doom, another few days and your hysterics will be almost forgotten eh...

My position is the same. I think Leaving is a mistake and I think it will hurt us economically. Democracy means you accept the result, which I do, but it doesn't mean you have to agree with it. When a party wins a General Election all the voters who didn't choose them have to accept their mandate to govern but they don't have to become supporters of the party.

I am pretty miffed at the sudden insistence those of us that lost become enthusiasts for the cause. I wouldn't expect any of you to become Europhiles had Remain won.

I do hope for a very good deal from Europe and that my reservations are wrong. I am not calling for a second referendum, I didn't sign that stupid petition.

I really don't know what all of you expect to be honest.

[Kursk]

Some people are so used to being namby-pambied they are petrified of change.

The UK, as is often the case, is leading the way in instigating that change. There will be continued co-operation with Europe but it will be on different terms; terms that do not absorb our democratic right to determine our own future.

The vote has been taken. Everyone needs to get behind the choice of the majority and stop bellyaching and worrying. It is isolationist to look upon the referendum result as a mistake. We have opened the door to the World with Europe still included.