Virgin Media to dump neutrality and target BitTorrent users

[BenMcr]

It just I thought the topic (as was pointed out to me) was whether Virgin HAD started to target Bittorrent users specifically

Not whether it was techincally possible etc

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by BenMcr

It just I thought the topic (as was pointed out to me) was whether Virgin HAD started to target Bittorrent users specifically

Not whether it was techincally possible etc

I believe the title of the thread is 'Virgin Media to dump neutrality and target BitTorrent users'. The possibility of them doing it either presently or in the future was what was being discussed. Given that copyright issues are totally irrelevant to throttling of any protocol that is off topic. Given that bandwidth scarcity is very relevant to throttling that's somewhat more on topic.

That Virgin offer poor upstream bandwidth and report no real upstream capacity issues on their local network implies throttling is unnecessary, should Virgin claim that it is required due to capacity issues in the future this becomes an issue.

Legality or otherwise of content not relevant, bandwidth both provisioned and used very relevant to throttling.

[popper]

actually it's not "HAD" but rather will or could, and the reasons behind that statement Virgin Media CEO Neil said what he said and how that, and related things will effect us the end users long term.

its seems to me, you from your employee perspective, would be welcoming expanding this primarily neil said "dump neutrality" to include the global reasons and the reasoning behind it, and why Neil has his "this Net Neutrality is crep" Opinion and what he intends to do about it for the good of the business both domesticly and globally.

BB and i are at least trying to give, and get the global picture as it unfolds, put ourselves in CEO Neils, the corporations, and the global executives shoes etc, to try and see were they get their crazy thinking from, and how that might effect in the long term, the actual end users paying the bills and giveing these people hiding behind the companies paper their and the middle men investors profits.

but you and Bonglet can continue linking tort copyright infringment to CP,giving sales advice on second hand Audio/video playback analogue goods market place, and talking up the merits of 3rd party vendors cashing in on the back catalogs etc without even trying to give even a slightly Net Neutrality Bent to it.

now i do like to bring in OT but related stuff now and again, i make no secret of that, it helps people consider the wider picture after all, BUT it has and will always have some form of a link to the topic, and i explain why when doing so.

---------- Post added at 15:45 ---------- Previous post was at 15:44 ----------

ohh i see BB got in there first while i was editing this and got called away for a time LOL

[bonobo]

Well Virgin are definitely throttling my connection when I use bittorrent.

If I start to download something on bittorrent it will start to download at full speed (10MBps), then after a couple of minutes my entire connection speed will drop to 1MBps, making web browsing pretty much impossible unless I reduce my max bittorrent speed to 50kbps. I then have to close my bittorrent client and reset my connection to get my full bandwidth back again.

I am a heavy user, but I make sure I never exceed the traffic management quotas, and most my heavy downloading is done over night. This doesn't stop the throttling though.

I'm really annoyed by this. They can't have STM and then still penalise heavy users who abide by the STM bandwidth limits.

P.S. Just incase anyone was wondering, yes my bittorrent software is set up properly, i've been using and tweaking it for years so it has minimum impact on the rest of my internet traffic.

[highroyds]

Originally Posted by bonobo

Well Virgin are definitely throttling my connection when I use bittorrent.

If I start to download something on bittorrent it will start to download at full speed (10MBps), then after a couple of minutes my entire connection speed will drop to 1MBps, making web browsing pretty much impossible unless I reduce my max bittorrent speed to 50kbps. I then have to close my bittorrent client and reset my connection to get my full bandwidth back again.

I am a heavy user, but I make sure I never exceed the traffic management quotas, and most my heavy downloading is done over night. This doesn't stop the throttling though.

I'm really annoyed by this. They can't have STM and then still penalise heavy users who abide by the STM bandwidth limits.

P.S. Just incase anyone was wondering, yes my bittorrent software is set up properly, i've been using and tweaking it for years so it has minimum impact on the rest of my internet traffic.

Which software do you use ?? Have you asked on the Virgin Media Tech support newsgroup as they'll help you out and tell you if its the software at their end.

[bonobo]

Utorrent usually, but I've tried most the others with the same result. I'll try asking in the newsgroup cheers.

[highroyds]

Originally Posted by bonobo

Utorrent usually, but I've tried most the others with the same result. I'll try asking in the newsgroup cheers.

I use uTorrent too and with our BB being upgraded in the last week or so our download speed has gone up to a max of 1MB, but thats only gone to that speed due to the seeders and trackers.

I'm also classed as a heavy user and our connections been fine, but I do only download during the night so I dont get STM'ed.

Hope this helps.

[bonobo]

Well, sounds like your situation is very similar to me, except I'm having problems. I'll ask in the tech support newsgroup and keep troubleshooting. I wonder if there's some kind of time cut-off when this potential throttling gets turned off. What time do you normally start downloading? And do you do much seeding in the day (within the STM limits)?

My upload speed's never been affected, just download, which seems a bit weird.

Thanks

[highroyds]

Originally Posted by bonobo

Well, sounds like your situation is very similar to me, except I'm having problems. I'll ask in the tech support newsgroup and keep troubleshooting. I wonder if there's some kind of time cut-off when this potential throttling gets turned off. What time do you normally start downloading? And do you do much seeding in the day (within the STM limits)?

My upload speed's never been affected, just download, which seems a bit weird.

Thanks

Any torrenting is always done during the night as its faster to do it during that time as most people are in bed in UK lol. I've only ever gone over my STM limits during the day when I've had to update the pc's and when I've been gaming or catching up on BBC iPlayer.

Sometimes my download through utorrent is quite slow at times 50 - 60kb, but othertimes when I've left it it does jump up to 150 - 200kb. But on certain trackers I've gotten around 1MB when theres been quite a few seeders (1000's). I used to have problems with my connections, but with some advice on the utorrent forum and setting my new router (netgear as I used to have a linksys) its been working perfectly.

[jamiefrost]

Originally Posted by bonobo

Well, sounds like your situation is very similar to me, except I'm having problems. I'll ask in the tech support newsgroup and keep troubleshooting. I wonder if there's some kind of time cut-off when this potential throttling gets turned off. What time do you normally start downloading? And do you do much seeding in the day (within the STM limits)?

My upload speed's never been affected, just download, which seems a bit weird.

Thanks

If your upload is saturated this will effect your download rate.

JJ

[NoFew]

Originally Posted by Impz2002

People seem to forget VM is a contended service, Providing everyone with a guaranteed bandwith weather it be 2meg or 50meg is not a viable option. there are always going to be times when people are all trying to use their connection at the same time. TheDon makes a very good point, has anyone ever wondered why a leased line is massively expensive ? its the guaranteed service level agreement that goes with it that costs so much. There isn't a single residential ISP in this country that provides a non contended service.

I believe that STM is a fair way of making sure all customers have a fair level of service. I think the trigger points for STM are low and don't reflect the things people use their connection for these days as the appetite for bandwith is just going to keep increasing.

I am assuming this Bittorrent shaping must be achieved by DPI which is a whole new bag of snakes.

I think people really need to realise what the network would be like if it was a free for all with no management. I guarantee there would be alot more moaning posts about slow speeds in peak times.

So in conclusion I support whatever method VM employ to make sure everyone gets their fair share as long as it reflects the changing times and treats everyone the same.

You don't get anything for free in life so lets just be glad we arnt all capped to x amount of gigs a month. Compared to some ISP's VM's STM is generous !

Impz

Virgin Media, Don't provide the full service they advertise anyway, & since STM I havn't once seen an increased speed in my Internet but complete trashed speeds. 10Mb - Dont think so barley 1Mb. Upload speeds..?? non existence.. customer service..?? useless virgin suck end off. Im of to write a review

[Toto]

Originally Posted by NoFew

Virgin Media, Don't provide the full service they advertise anyway, & since STM I havn't once seen an increased speed in my Internet but complete trashed speeds. 10Mb - Dont think so barley 1Mb. Upload speeds..?? non existence.. customer service..?? useless virgin suck end off. Im of to write a review

Why bother writing a review, take your hard earned elsewhere. Vote with your feet man.

[NoFew]

Originally Posted by Toto

Why bother writing a review, take your hard earned elsewhere. Vote with your feet man.

I'm now with sky unlimited Free at last all I have to do is send virgin media there modem & plastic spanner back per requested

[albertsteptoe]

Originally Posted by broadbandking

I am right in thinking utorrent passes the throttling? with the encyption option enabled?

Hello broadbandking, You seem to know a lot about Internet & stuff, Ive just seen this thread i have Virgin Media 50MB BB being installed on February 4Th & i use utorrent to download has this started yet because if it has no point in me getting there broadband. thanks for any help you can give.