The state benefits system mega-thread.

[Jimmy-J]

Now his family and Labour MP Luciana Berger want the Government to learn lessons from this tragic case.

They never seem to learn anything.

[nomadking]

he passed away less than two years later.

It was hardly just days later. And even then it might not have been related to his condition.

Mr Barlow died after never regaining consciousness following a fall at home – just seven months after his mother passed away.

That is something that could happen to any of us.


The money stopped because he didn't appeal.

A DWP spokesman said: “We have followed the correct procedures in the processing of this benefit claim. People have the right to appeal a decision, but if the appeal is withdrawn we cannot continue with processing the claim.”

Originally Posted by denphone

Dying Merseyside man was told by benefits assessors ‘you’re fit to work’

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/...55QGg.facebook

Was he was sucking on the nipple of the state?.

I think Pierre's point was that not so long ago family helped other family members out who where suffering hardship ,now it seems the first port of call is the state .

Your example is another over emotive story spun by the press to tug at heart strings when in fact the man himself refused treatment and refused help from the state ,it should also be pointed out that 2 years ago (when he had his assessment) he may have been capable of work in some capacity .

[Kabaal]

I wouldn't take anything as an indication that families aren't helping each other out anymore. That's just not newsworthy and there have always been those who milk the state.

[denphone]

Originally Posted by martyh

I think Pierre's point was that not so long ago family helped other family members out who where suffering hardship ,now it seems the first port of call is the state .

Your example is another over emotive story spun by the press to tug at heart strings when in fact the man himself refused treatment and refused help from the state ,it should also be pointed out that 2 years ago (when he had his assessment) he may have been capable of work in some capacity .

The difference between families then and now has changed a lot as many family members have moved away Marty and Pierre and as such many families are not as close as they used to be in more ways then one.

We must not stereotype benefit claimants into the same bracket of they are all scroungers and yes there are some who do use the state as a first port of call and indeed we must come down hard on those people but there are also many out there who get no help from the state at all who do the arduous job of looking after their ill and disabled family members themselves and are too proud to ask the state for help but need help there are also others who because of their illnesses and disabilities who do get help from the state and they are very gracious to receive that help as l am myself because of my own illnesses and disabilities as we need help at home with aids and help in getting around whether it be with wheelchairs , scooters , disability aids or a mobility car.

Yes the man might have refused treatment but l can assure you that the condition he had coupled with a need to have a heart transplant meant he was in no state even two years ago to do any type of work at all.

Having been through the appeals process myself l can assure you that it is very stressful for the person involved and thus many are not willing to go through 9 to 12 months of deep stress as they go through the unwieldy appeals process.

[nomadking]

The appeals process consists of writing an appeal letter, continuing to supply notes from GPs and waiting, not running a marathon every week.

Robert Barlow died last November aged 47 while suffering from a heart defect and brain tumour.

The tumour would not have been identified at the time of the ATOS examination(December 2012) and may not have been identified at all before his death,

The picture is very misleading as he died aged 47, and doesn't look that in the picture.

If his condition had deteriorated then he could apply again.

Originally Posted by denphone

The difference between families then and now has changed a lot as many family members have moved away Marty and Pierre and as such many families are not as close as they used to be in more ways then one.
.

Generally speaking though families tend to stay in one area ,yes there will be exceptions ,mine is one such family ,however we do not live in a large country ,we live in a country where it is possible to get from one end to the other in a few hours

We must not stereotype benefit claimants into the same bracket of they are all scroungers

I do not believe anybody has done that ,it is getting extremely tiresome when you try to close down any type of debate by saying "we are not all scroungers"

Having been through the appeals process myself l can assure you that it is very stressful for the person involved

Lots of things in modern life extremely stressful generally people deal with it ,disabled or not .

[RichardCoulter]

The Gary Barlow tax avoidance case has put things into perspective. According to Channel 5 this morning:

Each year, tax avoidance costs the UK economy £69.9 billion pounds.

Each year benefit fraud costs the UK economy £5.2 billion pounds.

Try and guess which is covered more in the newspapers, has it's own free hotline to report wrongdoers, has numerous television programmes made about it etc etc...

[Qtx]

Yet even on this board there are some sticking up for the tax avoiders saying it's not illegal. It doesn't need a genius to work out that the system favours the rich.

[jb66]

True, but if I worked hard to earn millions it's a kick in the teeth having to give 50% of my earnings to folk that can't be arsed getting of their backside

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

Each year benefit fraud costs the UK economy £5.2 billion pounds...

Holy crap, £5.2 billion is stolen by benefit fraudsters, seriously the benefit system needs looking at. I see tax avoidance differently to benefit fraud.

Gary Barlow will of paid £millions in tax and donated £millions to charity. Benefit thieves steal from those in desperate need. Vile thieving ****.

---------- Post added at 08:00 ---------- Previous post was at 07:58 ----------

Originally Posted by Qtx

Yet even on this board there are some sticking up for the tax avoiders saying it's not illegal. It doesn't need a genius to work out that the system favours the rich.

The system perhaps favours those that work hard or have a talent and get themselves rich. Obviously some are born into wealth.

On this board anything and anyone can be slagged into the ground. But god help us if we mention benefit fraud.

[Qtx]

Originally Posted by jb66

True, but if I worked hard to earn millions it's a kick in the teeth having to give 50% of my earnings to folk that can't be arsed getting of their backside

Benefits are a small percentage of what tax gets spent on. There are plenty of other areas where the government wastes money.

I hit the highest tax bracket 15 years ago and hated as much as the next man the fact so much was taken from my salary. Before then I let someone else be on call sometimes to stop myself hitting the limit and end up with less money due to the extra tax percentage. So doing things to maximise your cash is natural but the extremely wealthy go way beyond that with their avoidance and it's not right they end up paying such a small percentage of tax compared to someone on an average wage.

The playing field is unbalanced in favour of the wealthy.

---------- Post added at 08:10 ---------- Previous post was at 08:06 ----------

Originally Posted by Bogof

On this board anything and anyone can be slagged into the ground. But god help us if we mention benefit fraud.

It's because those in genuine need or ill get lumped together with the fraudsters and whenever benefit fraud is discussed, which demonises those who have done no wrong.

No one demonises genuine clamaints, but benefit fraud is vile and disgusting. Workers/tax payers do not begrudge the benefit system. Once my tax is paid its paid, I'm not getting it back no matter what it is spent on. Even if the benefit system was shut down you just know taxes wouldn't be reduced.

What annoys everyone (not just workers) is benefit fraudsters who literally stop the NHS affording life saving/life extending drugs, they stop disabled people getting the care and help they need. They prevent social services having the funds to help everyone who needs help.

Thats why people despise benefit fraudsters and cheats, it is about as low as someone can get. Literally preventing someone getting life saving/life changing help. When someone is prepared let others suffer in pain or go without the help they desperately need just because they don't want to get a job, well that is vile! Like I said no one begrudges the system, we have to pay the taxes wether there is a benefit system or not, we just find it hard to believe another person would happily sit back and take funds causing others suffer knowing they are partly to blame.

[Ignitionnet]

Originally Posted by jb66

True, but if I worked hard to earn millions it's a kick in the teeth having to give 50% of my earnings to folk that can't be arsed getting of their backside

Most of the welfare bill goes to pensioners. Next stereotype please.

[Qtx]

Originally Posted by Bogof

N
What annoys everyone (not just workers) is benefit fruadsters who literally stop the NHS affording life saving/life extending drugs, they stop disabled people getting the care and help they need. They prevent social services having the funds to help everyone who needs help.

Thats why people despise benefit fruadster and cheats, it is about as low as someone can get. Literally preventing someone getting life saving/life changing help.

What a load of tosh. You will blame a benefit fraudster for a lack of NHS funding when tax avoidance takes ten times more cash away from the coffers. Imagine all the extra lives that could have been saved if they had paid their tax. That is using your own logic.

Fraudsters are indeed **** but get some perspective