Owen Paterson: Anger as Tory MP avoids suspension in rule shake-up

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by jfman

Proof if ever it were required that you’ve no sincere intention of engaging with the debate other than to defend the Conservatives at all costs to your waning credibility.

Waning is generous, of course that's further evidenced by claiming it's hysteria about second jobs, conveniently ignoring that the real issue is second jobs that go against the direct interests of their constituents

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by jfman

Proof if ever it were required that you’ve no sincere intention of engaging with the debate other than to defend the Conservatives at all costs to your waning credibility.

Behave, jfman, for goodness sake. I have engaged with the debate, but that doesn’t mean that I have to give succour to the left wing point of view being expressed on this forum.

You pay attention to your own credibility (you need to) and let me worry about mine.

---------- Post added at 16:47 ---------- Previous post was at 16:44 ----------

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Why would an Opposition Party spend their energy doing the Government's work for them? Labour is not in coalition with the Conservatives.


I'm afraid wishing these case studies of corruption away won't do it for the electorate and a lot of the press. Something needs to change and Johnson needs to swiftly make sure it's the legislation and not the occupier of No. 10 that changes.

If Labour felt that strongly about second jobs, that is exactly what they would do, if nothing else, to embarrass the government. They won’t do it, of course, because second jobs are also performed by their own MPs.

I cannot see people agonising about this is three months’ time, let alone three years.

Whataboutism will not get the current crop of Tory MPs off the hook if they have been found guilty of having their hands on the proverbial cookie jar.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

If Labour felt that strongly about second jobs, that is exactly what they would do, if nothing else, to embarrass the government. They won’t do it, of course, because second jobs are also performed by their own MPs.

I cannot see people agonising about this is three months’ time, let alone three years.

As I said, wishful thinking won't make this go away, Old Boy. If you were the leader of the opposition, your number one aim is to get into power. Doing the Government's homework for it is not top of your to-do list.

You need to grab a coffee with Seph at Waitrose and he'll get you up to speed.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Chris

I can’t get my head round this one at all, seeing as the stuff he didn’t declare, everyone knew about anyway. Did he think that meant he didn’t need to? It’s not as if he can have thought it could be hidden. Very odd.

I've been thinking about him to and would love to see the next person caught fiddling the dole just say they forgot to declare like the MPs and see what happens to them, still at least they can appeal their prison sentence

Originally Posted by Maggy

Whataboutism will not get the current crop of Tory MPs off the hook if they have been found guilty of having their hands on the proverbial cookie jar.

The latest being Rees Smug for not declaring his Cayman Islands loans

---------- Post added at 17:43 ---------- Previous post was at 17:41 ----------

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

As I said, wishful thinking won't make this go away, Old Boy. If you were the leader of the opposition, your number one aim is to get into power. Doing the Government's homework for it is not top of your to-do list.

You need to grab a coffee with Seph at Waitrose and he'll get you up to speed.

What's the old military saying, when your enemy is making a mistake, don't stop them

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Maggy

Whataboutism will not get the current crop of Tory MPs off the hook if they have been found guilty of having their hands on the proverbial cookie jar.

If they have done wrong, they must be punished. Boris Johnson said so very clearly this evening.

The problem with the current dialogue being pushed is that no-one apart from Owen Paterson has been found to have done anything wrong.

As to whether the rules should be changed, I guess this depends on the will of parliamentarians to change the arrangements.

---------- Post added at 18:14 ---------- Previous post was at 18:12 ----------

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

As I said, wishful thinking won't make this go away, Old Boy. If you were the leader of the opposition, your number one aim is to get into power. Doing the Government's homework for it is not top of your to-do list.

You need to grab a coffee with Seph at Waitrose and he'll get you up to speed.

If they put forward a proposal to ban second jobs, they would get more respect from the public that they actually tried to change it instead of simply whingeing about the practice to score political points.

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

I've been thinking about him to and would love to see the next person caught fiddling the dole just say they forgot to declare like the MPs and see what happens to them, still at least they can appeal their prison sentence



The latest being Rees Smug for not declaring his Cayman Islands loans

---------- Post added at 17:43 ---------- Previous post was at 17:41 ----------



What's the old military saying, when your enemy is making a mistake, don't stop them

Rees Mogg doesn’t own a company that doesn’t own a company that does own a company that makes money in Cayman. He doesn’t get paid by the company he doesn’t own but his wife who doesn‘t own the company works for it and gets wages. He doesn’t get paid by this company but owns 100% of the shares, and gets directors loans of £6,000,000, which he paid total interest of 0.8% (£48k in total) over 3 years, but this isn’t any form of remuneration, just "Directors Loans"…

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Rees Mogg doesn’t own a company that doesn’t own a company that does own a company that makes money in Cayman. He doesn’t get paid by the company he doesn’t own but his wife who doesn‘t own the company works for it and gets wages. He doesn’t get paid by this company but owns 100% of the shares, and gets directors loans of £6,000,000, which he paid total interest of 0.8% (£48k in total) over 3 years, but this isn’t any form of remuneration, just "Directors Loans"…

So are you excusing Rees Mogg for not breaking any rules?

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Behave, jfman, for goodness sake. I have engaged with the debate, but that doesn’t mean that I have to give succour to the left wing point of view being expressed on this forum.

Your posts on this matter are ever increasingly delusional if you sincerely believe it’s only “left wing” members of despairing at the Conservatives handling of this grubby affair.

If Labour felt that strongly about second jobs, that is exactly what they would do, if nothing else, to embarrass the government. They won’t do it, of course, because second jobs are also performed by their own MPs.

I cannot see people agonising about this is three months’ time, let alone three years.

The faulty crystal ball is back out I see.

Johnson’s Premiership is now fatally wounded. There will need to be a line drawn under it before the next election campaign.

[spiderplant]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

As for ‘levelling up’, I am surprised that anyone should not know what that means on either side of the House

Please can you provide a summary, for the benefit of those of us not in The House?

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

So are you excusing Rees Mogg for not breaking any rules?

Your Conservative-tinted spectacles also appear to include a <sarcasm> bypass filter…

He doesn’t get ‘renumerated’, but gets very very low interest loans for seven figure sums, and his wife gets paid for being the Secretary of a Holding Company, which I am sure doesn’t go into a joint account*

*you might wish to remove your specs for this one…

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by jfman

Your posts on this matter are ever increasingly delusional if you sincerely believe it’s only “left wing” members of despairing at the Conservatives handling of this grubby affair.

.

I am fully aware that some anti-Boris Conservatives are on the same side as Labour on this subject. They, too, tend to be on the left of the Conservative Party. They’ll get over it.

---------- Post added at 19:49 ---------- Previous post was at 19:48 ----------

Originally Posted by jfman

The faulty crystal ball is back out I see.

Johnson’s Premiership is now fatally wounded. There will need to be a line drawn under it before the next election campaign.

You wish!

---------- Post added at 19:51 ---------- Previous post was at 19:49 ----------

Originally Posted by Hugh

Your Conservative-tinted spectacles also appear to include a <sarcasm> bypass filter…

He doesn’t get ‘renumerated’, but gets very very low interest loans for seven figure sums, and his wife gets paid for being the Secretary of a Holding Company, which I am sure doesn’t go into a joint account*

*you might wish to remove your specs for this one…

I asked you a question (hence the question mark). Has he broken any rules?

Feel free to ignore this question with the usual diversionary tactics if you can’t possibly comment. I’ll understand.

[jfman]

Anti-Boris Conservatives.

The divisive rhetoric of modern politics has gone for the Old Boy here.

I would wager that Johnson won’t lead the party into the next election in 2024.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by jfman

Anti-Boris Conservatives.

The divisive rhetoric of modern politics has gone for the Old Boy here.

I would wager that Johnson won’t lead the party into the next election in 2024.

Can we quote you on that?

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Can we quote you on that?

Of course, OB. Unlike others I don’t move the goalposts with increasing regularity nor shirk from being held against the statements I make.

He’s toast.