Brexit discussion

[Osem]

Makes you wonder how the developed world outside of EU control actually survives doesn't it.

[1andrew1]

Interesting article in The Observer about people who regretted voting Leave.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...g-leave-brexit

[daveeb]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Interesting article in The Observer about people who regretted voting Leave.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...g-leave-brexit

Good read that Andrew, i'm sure everyone will agree.

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Interesting article in The Observer about people who regretted voting Leave.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...g-leave-brexit

You need to read the article again.

“It’s not that nobody is changing their minds,” explains Joe Twyman, co-founder of YouGov. “Very few are, and when they are, they’re cancelling each other out, so the aggregate level change is very small.”

In other words, some people on the Remain side are ALSO changing their minds.

Btw, it's not an interesting article when it's wrote in a Anti-Brexit newspaper, such as the guardian. But I like how your source completely negates the point your trying to raise, by just the tiny paragraph I quoted from it.

[denphone]

Originally Posted by daveeb

Good read that Andrew, i'm sure everyone will agree.

l call it handbags at ten paces.

[1andrew1]

I previously posted a great but lengthy RTE article about how the Irish border could well be a stumbling block for negotiations in December. It explained that no matter how much progress the UK with paying its settlement bill, the border remained a sticking point and this part of the Brexit process was Ireland' s only opportunity to veto the deal.

This issue now seems to be reported a lot more widely.

The top headline on SkyNews is now Ireland 'threat to veto Brexit trade talks


There are similar stories across a range of news outlets.

They all pick up from today's Observer report.

Ireland’s European commissioner has urged Theresa May to change her Brexit plans dramatically to prevent a mounting crisis over the Irish border from derailing her hopes of an EU trade deal.
The threat of a hard Irish border has emerged as the major obstacle to the prime minister’s aim of securing the green light for Brexit trade talks at a crucial summit only weeks away. She has effectively been handed just days to give stronger guarantees over the issue.
Phil Hogan, the EU’s agriculture commissioner, told the Observer that it was a “very simple fact” that remaining inside the single market and customs union, or allowing Northern Ireland to do so, would end the standoff.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...r-brexit-chaos

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

I previously posted a great but lengthy RTE article about how the Irish border could well be a stumbling block for negotiations in December. It explained that no matter how much progress the UK with paying its settlement bill, the border remained a sticking point and this part of the Brexit process was Ireland' s only opportunity to veto the deal.

This issue now seems to be reported a lot more widely.

The top headline on SkyNews is now Ireland 'threat to veto Brexit trade talks


There are similar stories across a range of news outlets.

They all pick up from today's Observer report.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...r-brexit-chaos

Just give them Northern Ireland back I'm sure everyone will be fine about it

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Mick

You need to read the article again.

In other words, some people on the Remain side are ALSO changing their minds.

Btw, it's not an interesting article when it's wrote in a Anti-Brexit newspaper, such as the guardian. But I like how your source completely negates the point your trying to raise, by just the tiny paragraph I quoted from it.

I'm not making a point, just highlighting an interesting article.

The article IS about leave voters who regretted their decision. It could be that all remain voters have regretted their decision and are waiting by for BoJo to lead them to the promised land of milk and honey. But the article's not about them.

One rather large clue is the article's headline "‘I thought I’d put in a protest vote’: the people who regret voting leave"

[Hom3r]

To paraphrase Red Dwarf on Brexit.

It will be happened; it shall be going to be happening; it will be was an event that will have been taken place in the future. Simple as that.

[1andrew1]

Can't see this happening but an interesting read. Does point out that the referendum would probably get the same result so little reason to do it

Brexit Referendum ‘May Need to Be Redone’
Multiple sources with links to UK intelligence report that Russian corruption of the Brexit vote is far worse than previously thought. The referendum on remaining part of the EU received so much illegal foreign money and influence from Russia, these sources say, that UK intelligence is minded to recommend to Theresa May’s government that the Brexit vote be redone, as it is not thought that the vote was ‘free and fair’. This term is often used in Great Britain to describe a legitimate election process.
It is illegal under UK electoral law for foreign nationals and entities to spend sums of money influencing domestic votes. The Political Parties, Elections and Referendums Act, sources said, was quite clear on the illegality of such donations.
This reporter broke the story, last year, that the same Russian entities that were pushing botnets for Trump were pushing them for Brexit, and for Marine le Pen and Viktor Orban. The level of money and the reach of the fake bots and targeted data funded by Russia, using Cambridge Analytica, sources said, was so great that MI5 and MI6, the UK’s versions of the FBI and CIA, did not believe that the Brexit referendum could have been said to have been ‘free and fair’.

https://patribotics.blog/2017/11/24/...-to-be-redone/

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

I'm not making a point, just highlighting an interesting article.

The article IS about leave voters who regretted their decision. It could be that all remain voters have regretted their decision and are waiting by for BoJo to lead them to the promised land of milk and honey. But the article's not about them.

One rather large clue is the article's headline "‘I thought I’d put in a protest vote’: the people who regret voting leave"

Andrew, you cannot say, you’re not making a point, when you quite clearly are and that is, you’re raising the point some leave voters have remorse. It’s probably true some are, but as Yougov has pointed out, it’s not very many and there is remorse for some people who voted Remain too, but there is not this massive swing in decision and it’s not going to change the result anyway.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Mick

Andrew, you cannot say, you’re not making a point, when you quite clearly are and that is, you’re raising the point some leave voters have remorse. It’s probably true some are, but as Yougov has pointed out, it’s not very many and there is remorse for some people who voted Remain too, but there is not this massive swing in decision and it’s not going to change the result anyway.

I've simply pointed out an interesting article. I really don't know what more I could have done to keep you happy short of summarising every nuance in the article. Maybe I could have simply repeated the original headline but I thought that was a bit provocative so actually tamed it down. Hey ho!

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

I've simply pointed out an interesting article. I really don't know what more I could have done to keep you happy short of summarising every nuance in the article. Maybe I could have simply repeated the original headline but I thought that was a bit provocative so actually tamed it down. Hey ho!

It’s only interesting if it fits the Anti-brexit narrative.

Of course the guardian will post these kind of stories, it’s obvious there are people who have changed their minds, but this is not attributed to just people who voted leave.

Again, it’s all one sidedness with you. You’ve put this article here to try highlight there is just ‘leavers remorse’, you said nothing about there being remainers remorse, but that short sentence about Yougov’s findings, completely negates any point of the article, the article has bias, where are the interviews for people who regret voting Remain?

[denphone]

Originally Posted by Mick

Andrew, you cannot say, you’re not making a point, when you quite clearly are and that is, you’re raising the point some leave voters have remorse. It’s probably true some are, but as Yougov has pointed out, it’s not very many and there is remorse for some people who voted Remain too, but there is not this massive swing in decision and it’s not going to change the result anyway.

l have not got any problem with why people made their decision as my problem is with the continuous ongoing chaos of HMG as it simply has no clear or concise plan going forward and seems to make things up on the hoof as it goes along and sadly as time goes on that is very likely to reveal itself and sadly it will be the British public where the consequences will be felt hard as thus so far HMG has very cleverly obfuscated a message to many of the public into believing that everything will be wonderfully fine and dandy when sadly it will be nothing of the sort as the economic reality starts to set in and the brown stuff starts flying around.

---------- Post added at 12:54 ---------- Previous post was at 12:52 ----------

Originally Posted by Mick

It’s only interesting if it fits the Anti-brexit narrative.

Of course the guardian will post these kind of stories, it’s obvious there are people who have changed their minds, but this is not attributed to just people who voted leave.

Again, it’s all one sidedness with you. You’ve put this article here to try highlight there is just ‘leavers remorse’, you said nothing about there being remainers remorse, but that short sentence about Yougov’s findings, completely negates any point of the article, the article has bias, where are the interviews for people who regret voting Remain?

There is one sidedness and biasedness on both sides and because of that rarely do we get the full truth as we saw clearly in the referendum and thus thereafter.

Originally Posted by denphone

l have not got any problem with why people made their decision as my problem is with the continuous ongoing chaos of HMG as it simply has no clear or concise plan going forward and seems to make things up on the hoof as it goes along and sadly as time goes on that is very likely to reveal itself and sadly it will be the British public where the consequences will be felt hard as thus so far HMG has very cleverly obfuscated a message to many of the public into believing that everything will be wonderfully fine and dandy when sadly it will be nothing of the sort as the economic reality starts to set in and the brown stuff starts flying around.

---------- Post added at 12:54 ---------- Previous post was at 12:52 ----------



There is one sidedness and biasedness on both sides and because of that rarely do we get the full truth as we saw clearly in the referendum and thus thereafter.

Yes which is what I’m trying to clearly demonstrate Den,, I have always brought both sides in to the debate.

The issue of the government is a separate issue, plus the EU is also being a PITA as well, so you cannot just blame HMG. The EU is being as vindictive as they can be.