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Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
View Poll Results: Will you be opting out of the Virgin Ad Deal?
Yes, Definitely. 958 95.51%
No, I am quite happy to share my surfing habits with anyone. 45 4.49%
Voters: 1003. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 19-03-2008, 14:40   #1441
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

I understand how angry some are but cancelling now might be jumping from the frying pan to the fire. If this is not defeated now you might well jump to an isp that within your contract time decides "if they are doing it and making money i will too". Trust me i get the anger and disillusionment with VM i feel it as strongly as anyone and feel that after all the years i have been a customer with comtel\ntl\VM i deserve better treatment. But until the market splits into the ones that have phorm and those that make a full permenent commitment not to have phorm i think jumping ship could be causing more trouble and cost then it is worth atm.
 
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Old 19-03-2008, 14:46   #1442
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by RizzyKing View Post
But until the market splits into the ones that have phorm and those that make a full permenent commitment not to have phorm i think jumping ship could be causing more trouble and cost then it is worth atm.
I agree and whatsmore I think we will be more successful if we fight from within. Stay a VM customer but downgrade your services so they lose money. Keep their customer services busy with correspondence, phone calls, questions, anything you can think of, until it becomes too costly both in time and money for them to deal with it all. Send them DPA notices then if they go ahead with an "opt-out" service report them to the police for RIPA violations. Never underestimate the power of being a nuisance.
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Old 19-03-2008, 14:50   #1443
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Is this the same 121 that infected all of us windows xp users at one time or another with all that adware crap that you could never get off your machine with the annoying you might have adaware on your machine buy this now forever on your taskbar untill you did a full format, if it is im sorry to say i wont be keeping any of vm's services at all, that back then was one of the biggest nuisances on the net and i bet this phorm one is even bigger coming from those idiots .
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Old 19-03-2008, 14:51   #1444
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by RizzyKing View Post
I understand how angry some are but cancelling now might be jumping from the frying pan to the fire. If this is not defeated now you might well jump to an isp that within your contract time decides "if they are doing it and making money i will too". Trust me i get the anger and disillusionment with VM i feel it as strongly as anyone and feel that after all the years i have been a customer with comtel\ntl\VM i deserve better treatment. But until the market splits into the ones that have phorm and those that make a full permenent commitment not to have phorm i think jumping ship could be causing more trouble and cost then it is worth atm.
On most ADSL providers that use Entanet the contract is one month yes 1month then mac and move on but Entanet have said they are not interested in dealing with phorm and the vISPs that they supply will be too small to attract Phorm. BT wholesale cannot use Phorm since this would break data protection for the companies they supply.
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Old 19-03-2008, 15:19   #1445
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Anyone else noticed that PhormPrTeam have vanished again after only one post? Its been 3 hours since they last posted. Well, they do say that if you cant stand the heat get out of the kitchen.
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Old 19-03-2008, 15:31   #1446
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by OF1975 View Post
Anyone else noticed that PhormPrTeam have vanished again after only one post? Its been 3 hours since they last posted. Well, they do say that if you cant stand the heat get out of the kitchen.
They don't indulge in dialogue, they are just publishing prepared statements.

Could you imagine a team of lawyers and publicists sat around a PC deciding on how best to 'spin' each individual posting?
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Old 19-03-2008, 15:38   #1447
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam
as per some news stories that have broken over the past few hours, we are pleased to be able to release the interim Privacy Impact Assessment that we've referred to in interviews and our live chats on Webwise.
Why can't you stop twisting the truth and fabricating lies? It was released first to the media by Simon Davies, not by you on the Phorm website.

Do you really think we're all idiots who believe every word spouted by a 'PR' team who are, at best, delusional
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Old 19-03-2008, 15:47   #1448
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam View Post
Hi all

Apologies for recent absence -
....
The full interim report is at http://www.phorm.com/user_privacy/pr...act_report.php and you can ask questions on the site too
been there, done that, got no answers to the questions put....

generic answers are such fun....
and this ones not been mentioned in a while.

  1. If you are a customer of BT Retail (or of any other BT divisions e.g. BT Business) , Virgin Media or Carphone Warehouse Talk Talk, or any other company that thinks to profile your data for advertising , then you might like to write to them quoting the very clear The Data Protection Act 1998 section 11:
    1. 11 Right to prevent processing for purposes of direct marketing
    2. (1) An individual is entitled at any time by notice in writing to a data controller to require the data controller at the end of such period as is reasonable in the circumstances to cease, or not to begin, processing for the purposes of direct marketing personal data in respect of which he is the data subject.
    3. (2) If the court is satisfied, on the application of any person who has given a notice under subsection (1), that the data controller has failed to comply with the notice, the court may order him to take such steps for complying with the notice as the court thinks fit.
    4. (3) In this section "direct marketing" means the communication (by whatever means) of any advertising or marketing material which is directed to particular individuals.
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Old 19-03-2008, 16:03   #1449
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by manxminx View Post
.... Do you really think we're all idiots who believe every word spouted by a 'PR' team who are, at best, delusional
Sadly, that is precisely what they think. The majority of people will be too easily fooled by their PR spin. Look at the comments posted on news websites in response to this. Uninformed people are focusing on the adverts rather than the invasion of privacy angle. That is why we need to keep on fighting to get the word out that the adverts are a side issue (still annoying but not the real issue) and that the real threat comes not only from the invasion of privacy the technology represents but also what is possible in the future if Phorm are allowed to get away with this.

I have already alerted US friends of mine to what is going on here and how it is likely to start there too. They arent impressed one iota.
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Old 19-03-2008, 16:46   #1450
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Seeing as there aren't really separate threads in this discussion, thought this might be of interest to the main group here, especially in light of the privacy comments being made. Today's ICO survey (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7304455.stm) on data protection highlights why the Phorm system is actually an improvement in online privacy.

We don't store any personally identifiable information so there is nothing to lose. We can't accidently reveal what we don't have unlike the ad targeting systems of other major Internet companies which retain identifiable personal data for over 12 months before it is even anonymised.
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Old 19-03-2008, 16:51   #1451
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

More blatant lies. not once in that article does it mention Phorm and say how wonderful it is in comparison. Of course with the Phorm malware we'd be living in a privacy utopia with pink fluffy bunnies and happy smiling rainbows as endorsed by... ohh wait.. no-one!

The piece says
Quote:
Eight out of ten people are taking greater care to protect personal information following recent data loss blunders, according to a survey.
Hence why people don't want Phorm, or it's constant spin.

You really are getting desperate. did you also do the PR for the emperors new clothes?
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Old 19-03-2008, 16:52   #1452
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam View Post
Seeing as there aren't really separate threads in this discussion, thought this might be of interest to the main group here, especially in light of the privacy comments being made. Today's ICO survey (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7304455.stm) on data protection highlights why the Phorm system is actually an improvement in online privacy.
So... are you saying that Phorm's interception of our data is actually better for our privacy than if Phorm didn't intercept it?
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Old 19-03-2008, 16:57   #1453
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam View Post
Seeing as there aren't really separate threads in this discussion, thought this might be of interest to the main group here, especially in light of the privacy comments being made. Today's ICO survey (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7304455.stm) on data protection highlights why the Phorm system is actually an improvement in online privacy.

We don't store any personally identifiable information so there is nothing to lose. We can't accidently reveal what we don't have unlike the ad targeting systems of other major Internet companies which retain identifiable personal data for over 12 months before it is even anonymised.
Spin, spin, spin, spin, spin.

When you've played for a local cricket club you get to see some really poor efforts at spin and this is a *really* poor effort.

Why hasn't Phorm answered the technical questions posed here or addressed the issues raised in public forums elsewhere?

There is no mention of Phorm in that report at all. If you can't or won't answer the technical questions put to you then please don't waste time here with placatory spin.

I've replied to Ian Woodham and also written to Neil Berkett with an executive management summary of why Virgin Media's brand will be irreparably tarnished by associating with Phorm. Including the very informative article mentioned elsewhere.

I'm staying Phorm phree. Not wanted, not needed.
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Old 19-03-2008, 16:57   #1454
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam View Post
Seeing as there aren't really separate threads in this discussion, thought this might be of interest to the main group here, especially in light of the privacy comments being made. Today's ICO survey (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7304455.stm) on data protection highlights why the Phorm system is actually an improvement in online privacy.

We don't store any personally identifiable information so there is nothing to lose. We can't accidently reveal what we don't have unlike the ad targeting systems of other major Internet companies which retain identifiable personal data for over 12 months before it is even anonymised.
Outright lies. Phorm will store data for 14 days for "debugging and research purposes." Phorm is as much an improvement in online privacy as al-qaeda are an improvement in inter-faith relations. Check back in an hours time when PhormPrTeam will be releasing a new press release praising Christmas as a way of improving the lifespan of Turkeys.
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Old 19-03-2008, 17:00   #1455
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Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam View Post
We don't store any personally identifiable information so there is nothing to lose. We can't accidently reveal what we don't have unlike the ad targeting systems of other major Internet companies which retain identifiable personal data for over 12 months before it is even anonymised.
We know that, I fully accept that Phorm doesn't store any personally identifiable information on disk (RAM is surely a storage medium, even if it's only in there for microseconds?).

What we object to, as many many people here and elsewhere have said, is the interception of our data by your software. What also worries us is that the Phorm patents allow for storage of personal data. So although at the moment you might not store our data, software creep can (and does) occur.
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