Coronavirus

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Damien

I can't remember if I spoke against not joining the EU programme, I don't think I did. However it's clear it's good we didn't join.

On what grounds? Being part of a purchasing syndicate was not conditional on the European Medicines Agency approving the drugs? If it was, then I agree with you.

Originally Posted by Paul

We have been vaccinating for a month now, Im pretty sure we were first - in fact is anywhere in the EU doing so yet ? (genuine question btw).

We were first and other EU countries are now vaccinating too with Israel cited as the most successful. However, my understanding is that joining the procurement programme wouldn't have changed this.

[downquark1]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

On what grounds?

---------- Post added at 14:43 ---------- Previous post was at 14:40 ----------


We were first and other EU countries are now vaccinating too. However, my understanding is that joining the procurement programme wouldn't have changed this.

They have not moved as quickly

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

However, my understanding is that joining the procurement programme wouldn't have changed this.

Please do explain this understanding.

How would joining have improved the situation ?

[joglynne]

This seems like an interesting site. Mainly USA but also covers global progress.

More Than 17.5 Million Shots Given: Covid-19 Vaccine Tracker
The biggest vaccination campaign in history has begun. More than 17.5 million doses in 38 countries have been administered,

Page down to ... The Global Vaccination Campaign to see how many vaccinations have been done up to yesterday. (07/01/2021)


https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/c...-distribution/

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Paul

Please do explain this understanding.

How would joining have improved the situation ?

We would have paid less for the same vaccines.

[joglynne]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

We would have paid less for the same vaccines.

I hope you are not criticising our Goverment for putting lives befor money Andrew. Going direct to the source may have cost a tad more but we would have had no real control of our supplies of the vaccines and not be as ahead of the game as we now are.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by joglynne

I hope you are not criticising our Goverment for putting lives befor money Andrew. Going direct to the source may have cost a tad more but we would have had no real control of our supplies of the vaccines and not be as ahead of the game as we now are.

If they were the same vaccines delivered at the same time then I don't see the difference apart from having more money left to spend on other things.

[joglynne]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

If they were the same vaccines delivered at the same time then I don't see the difference apart from having more money left to spend on other things.

I understand that we ordered supplies and committed a lot sooner than the EU who waited for proof that the vaccines were effective before ordering. Thus risking a delay in the vaccines being delivered to us.

High income countries such as the UK and the US have pre-ordered vast amounts of candidate covid-19 vaccines ahead of their regulatory approval.
Pre-ordering is not just about ensuring access to the first batches of vaccine but about speeding up the process, says Alex Harris, head of global policy at the Wellcome Trust. He explains, “In this instance, the essential benefit of having already made upfront investment—in, for example, manufacturing the vaccine at risk [making it with no certainty that it will work] and building a stockpile significantly—outweighs the cost of that vaccine failing.”

Harris believes that governments are striking deals early because, without the upfront investment from rich countries, they recognise that vaccine manufacturers would not be making any vaccine at risk: they would wait until they had all of the safety and efficacy data and then get regulatory approval. “Then there would be an almighty bunfight for that very limited supply in six to nine months, and the company would say it’s going to take us some time to ramp up our manufacturing,” he says.

https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3226

November 12, 2020
The European Union has ordered 300 million doses of BioNTech/Pfizer’s COVID-19 vaccine following this week’s landmark announcement that it was effective in more than 90% of patients.

https://pharmaphorum.com/news/eu-orders/

Another article that outlines our Government's reasons for 'going it alone' may well have been due to uncertainty about how Brexit could have effected delivery of the vaccines..
https://www.nuffieldtrust.org.uk/new...avirus-vaccine

[jfman]

Nothing wrong with paying a premium for the market leading product delivered earlier, in my view. Israel for example have done the same seeking to vaccinate all over 16s by April I think.

The question really is where the UK goes from here does it maintain it’s lead or does mass vaccination get bogged down in delivery problems, logistical challenges or random other delays. If so, running “into the lead” looks more a political stunt than a coherent vaccination strategy. As ever, the proof will be in the pudding.

UK records 1,325 more Covid deaths

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55594107

A further 1,325 people have died in the UK within 28 days of a positive coronavirus test - a new record.

Another 68,053 new cases have been recorded - the highest daily figure since mass testing began.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by jfman

Nothing wrong with paying a premium for the market leading product delivered earlier, in my view. Israel for example have done the same seeking to vaccinate all over 16s by April I think.

The question really is where the UK goes from here does it maintain it’s lead or does mass vaccination get bogged down in delivery problems, logistical challenges or random other delays. If so, running “into the lead” looks more a political stunt than a coherent vaccination strategy. As ever, the proof will be in the pudding.

Agreed. If it's a case of same product at the same time for a cheaper price then that's the value of the European scheme. If not then worth going direct and paying more.

[Julian]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

On what grounds? Being part of a purchasing syndicate was not conditional on the European Medicines Agency approving the drugs? If it was, then I agree with you.

We were first and other EU countries are now vaccinating too with Israel cited as the most successful. However, my understanding is that joining the procurement programme wouldn't have changed this.

Israel is not in Europe.....

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Julian

Israel is not in Europe.....

Agreed - but it's cited as the most successful country globally at rolling out Covid 19 vaccinations with 12% of its population vaccinated. Apologies for any ambiguity.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-55514243

Originally Posted by Paul

We have been vaccinating for a month now, Im pretty sure we were first - in fact is anywhere in the EU doing so yet ? (genuine question btw).

The best global data on vaccinations is here:

https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations

The UK is ranked 4th in the world both by absolute number of injections given, and also per 100 of population. By the latter measure Israel and the UAE are doing exceptionally well but this is because their distribution rate is very similar to ours, except to a much smaller population. Bahrain is a statistical anomaly because its population is tiny. In absolute terms China and the USA have administered more jabs than us but given their population size neither of them is actually keeping pace with us.

So far, the British vaccination programme is going really rather well, and it will only accelerate over the coming days thanks to the Oxford-AZ vaccine, which is made here and is easier to store and administer.

The best performing EU countries are Germany and Italy. These have managed only about a third of what we have.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by Hugh

UK records 1,325 more Covid deaths

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55594107

At least it is not a daily figure. Still bad enough though.