Updated: Boris resigns as party leader

[BenMcr]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

By the way, it was the scientists that pushed Boris into the lockdown rules. His heart was never really in it, was it?

That's what a leader does though. To take advice from experts and base decisions on all available information, even if that means going against a personal view or feeling.

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Maybe not. My point is, this will not matter at the next election. The electorate will be focussed on more important things, like who do they trust to run the economy.

If the opposition are hoping that all this fake surprise and gasping is going to prove more important than having a believable manifesto with Starmer in charge, they are in for a much bigger shock down the road.

By the way isn’t No 10 owned by the Crown and therefore exempt from these restrictions?

Do you need any polish for that tin ear of yours? Because it sounds to me like you’re trying to justify egregious breaches of emergency legislation at a time of national crisis, on a technicality that only a very few of the most privileged in society could have hoped to enjoy.

One minor indiscretion passes with the news cycle. However this Chinese water torture is designed (I use the term deliberately) not to be so easily dismissed. Starmer probably won’t win the next election, but that will be in part due to his opponent not being Boris. The ground is being laid for a leadership challenge, which will occur the very moment it would no longer look like Tories obsessing over themselves during a continuing crisis. Some time this summer I suspect.

Originally Posted by Pierre

I reckon most people don’t give a shit.

The twitterati and other Social Media platforms will no doubt melt down,

People, esp on anti social media, always like to pretend to be outraged, they think that's what is expected.

People I know, who I have asked, are really just fed up of the endless mud slinging.
They expect rules to be bent (esp by politicians, which says a lot) they do it themselves.

I dont know anyone, at all, who has never broken a lockdown rule for the last two years.

Originally Posted by Paul

I dont know anyone, at all, who has never broken a lockdown rule for the last two years.

They aren't the ones who made the rules. If caught they could have been prosecuted and fined just as thousands actually were. One student was fined £10,000 for having a party: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-dorset-55362290.

Judging by the fall in Tory polling and the even steeper collapse in Johnson's own approval numbers people do not care. People do not like being taken for mugs and that at a time when people were banned from being with loved ones dying in hospitals the story that the Government were having parties is cutting through.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Chris

Do you need any polish for that tin ear of yours? Because it sounds to me like you’re trying to justify egregious breaches of emergency legislation at a time of national crisis, on a technicality that only a very few of the most privileged in society could have hoped to enjoy.

One minor indiscretion passes with the news cycle. However this Chinese water torture is designed (I use the term deliberately) not to be so easily dismissed. Starmer probably won’t win the next election, but that will be in part due to his opponent not being Boris. The ground is being laid for a leadership challenge, which will occur the very moment it would no longer look like Tories obsessing over themselves during a continuing crisis. Some time this summer I suspect.

My tin ear? [stands back in awe at the irony].

All I am pointing out here is that:

1. These ‘leaks’ are being given the light of day by Boris’s opponents who have no policies to put forward that are better than his. They see him as a popular figure who must be brought down, and so they resort to pettiness and smears.

2. All of this will matter not when the general election comes around. Anyone with a brain will understand that Sir Kier Starmer (AKA Mr Hindsight) has no chance of winning and Ed Davey a good deal less.

3. Boris is already off the hook with his decoration expenses and doesn’t seem to bothered about the party issue.

4. I don’t know a single person who hasn’t broken the lockdown rules in some way. You can say ‘but these are his rules’ as much as you like, but we all know he was pushed into making these rules by the same scientists you want us all locked down again. This time around, he has outmanoeuvred them. Starmer would have given in.

---------- Post added at 07:55 ---------- Previous post was at 07:51 ----------

Originally Posted by Damien

They aren't the ones who made the rules. If caught they could have been prosecuted and fined just as thousands actually were. One student was fined £10,000 for having a party: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-dorset-55362290.

Judging by the fall in Tory polling and the even steeper collapse in Johnson's own approval numbers people do not care. People do not like being taken for mugs and that at a time when people were banned from being with loved ones dying in hospitals the story that the Government were having parties is cutting through.

It’s a storm in a teacup. It will pass. It’s a long time until the next General Election.

If Boris is guilty of an offence, I am sure he will be fined as well. Perhaps we should leave that to the police, eh, rather than being a judge and jury armchair army?

The problem I have with the apparently leaked email, the date of it has been totally obscured. We had nice weather in 2021 too. It’s just too convenient for the media to keep drip feeding these supposedly bombshell garden party stories.

I have to ever agree though, Boris’s time is spent, because true Conservatives, don’t feel the PM has been Conservative of late.

[jonbxx]

Originally Posted by Mick

The problem I have with the apparently leaked email, the date of it has been totally obscured. We had nice weather in 2021 too. It’s just too convenient for the media to keep drip feeding these supposedly bombshell garden party stories.

I have to ever agree though, Boris’s time is spent, because true Conservatives, don’t feel the PM has been Conservative of late.

The blurring of the 'To' list is fun too. I note that the sounds have moved from denial to let's see what the investigation says, making it tomorrows problem. This suggests that senior and, more importantly, political people were aware of what was going on and straight up denial and being caught in a lie won't cut it any more

[BenMcr]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

If Boris is guilty of an offence, I am sure he will be fined as well. Perhaps we should leave that to the police, eh, rather than being a judge and jury armchair army?

You mean the police who control all entry in No 10, and who have previously said they don't apparently investigate things due to 'lack of evidence' or 'it being in the past'

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...hristmas-party

“The correspondence and footage does not provide evidence of a breach of the Health Protection Regulations, but restates allegations made in the media. Based on the absence of evidence and in line with our policy not to investigate retrospective breaches of such regulations, the Met will not commence an investigation at this time.”

Apparently though they're looking it again

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-b1990406.html

Police are in contact with the Cabinet Office over claims the Prime Minister’s aide organised a “bring your own booze” Downing Street drinks party during the first lockdown.

Some civil servant will probably get fired for not advising Boris it's against the rules.

[Blackshep]

Boris is done but I think there's more to come and they'll keep him until all the bad news is out then they will get rid. I'm not shocked or surprised by any of this boris has always believed he's above most of us because for much of his life he has been he's got away with thing's his whole life. The conservative party has a bigger problem though the boris antics have alienated so many of the public that the idea of another private school perceived toff isn't going to be acceptable.

Will this matter come the next election I think it will if the Tory candidate can be linked too strongly with boris Johnson this has and is doing a lot of damage despite what the Tory faithful might think.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Mick

The problem I have with the apparently leaked email, the date of it has been totally obscured. We had nice weather in 2021 too. It’s just too convenient for the media to keep drip feeding these supposedly bombshell garden party stories.

I have to ever agree though, Boris’s time is spent, because true Conservatives, don’t feel the PM has been Conservative of late.

I agree Johnson's days are numbered. But it was predicted at the time that he would be used by the Party to win the election, get Brexit over the line and then be replaced. The Brexit economic baggage could be left with Johnson ("not the fault of Brexit in itself, just a bad deal negotiated by Johnson") and a new leader would win the election for the Party in 2024.

But it's clearly not the media who are drip-feeding these stories to us as they don't possess a file of them in the first place! Instead, it's likely someone who was/is connected to government who is drip-feeding them to the media to undermine Johnson.

Mr K's suggestion that it is Cummings' advent calendar doesn't seem so far-fetched after all, does it?

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

My tin ear? [stands back in awe at the irony].

All I am pointing out here is that:

1. These ‘leaks’ are being given the light of day by Boris’s opponents who have no policies to put forward that are better than his. They see him as a popular figure who must be brought down, and so they resort to pettiness and smears.

2. All of this will matter not when the general election comes around. Anyone with a brain will understand that Sir Kier Starmer (AKA Mr Hindsight) has no chance of winning and Ed Davey a good deal less.

3. Boris is already off the hook with his decoration expenses and doesn’t seem to bothered about the party issue.

4. I don’t know a single person who hasn’t broken the lockdown rules in some way. You can say ‘but these are his rules’ as much as you like, but we all know he was pushed into making these rules by the same scientists you want us all locked down again. This time around, he has outmanoeuvred them. Starmer would have given in.[COLOR="Silver"]

It’s a storm in a teacup. It will pass. It’s a long time until the next General Election.

If Boris is guilty of an offence, I am sure he will be fined as well. Perhaps we should leave that to the police, eh, rather than being a judge and jury armchair army?

This is a blue-on-blue fight, Old Boy.

The next election is two years away but Johnson won't be allowed to fight it. The Conservative Party is the most successful party in the UK if not the West in winning elections. One reason is that it displays little sentimentality towards its leaders. It would not have tolerated the electoral failings of a leader who polled like Corbyn. Its over-riding aim is to be in power, not in Opposition.

1. Why are you putting leaks in quotation marks? They are leaks, no ifs and buts. His opponents in the Party read the polls and see him as an unpopular figure who threatens their 2024 election chances. Breaking your own rules in such a significant manner is not a smear but a fact. This doesn't sit well with the general public who dislike one set of rules for the ruled and another set for the rulers.

2. The polls put Labour ahead so the Party has a good chance of winning if Johnson remains as PM. Which is why the Party will topple him.

3. He was bothered enough to throw Martin Reynolds to the wolves last night.

4. Not sure that an elected elite of scientists rule the country last time I checked my constitutional handbook! "...we all know he was pushed into making these rules by the same scientists you [sic] want us all locked down again" We don't, that's your unproven theory.
The PM can call upon the country's experts and then make an evidence-based decision in conjunction with his Cabinet colleagues.

5. It's no storm in a teacup, it's the dying spasms of Johnson's brief and turbulent leadership. He should do the honourable thing and resign although I am sure Labour supporters would love him to drag the show on to May 2024. You surely don't align yourself with them, Old Boy?

Boris Johnson is so lucky to have someone investigate whether he was at a party. The rest of us have no way of knowing whether we attend a party or not.

@DavidSchneider

OLD BOY, if it's not an issue if he was at the party, why doesn't he admit it?

(and if he wasn't there, he should just say so).

[1andrew1]

Wednesday should be a national holiday so we can all see Starmer tear Johnson to shreds at PMQs. (Assuming Starmer doesn't have to self-isolate again. )

[papa smurf]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Wednesday should be a national holiday so we can all see Starmer tear Johnson to shreds at PMQs. (Assuming Starmer doesn't have to self-isolate again. )

He might mention the party but i doubt he has the ability to do any damage to
bojo, might be better if Rayner does it.

The Government is waiting for the independent investigation to establish if Johnson was at the party