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ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
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Old 10-05-2013, 00:21   #1246
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Well, I'm tempted to switch. The channels which BT currently plan to stream are among my most-watched channels on VM's XL pack anyway. I built a decent (for me) triple-play package (including BT Sport) for £38 per month on BT's web site. If I added BT Sport at £15 onto my current Virgin package, I'd be paying £78 per month.

I'm not even sure I'd miss TiVo much, compared to YouView. The former is, and sadly remains, all about untapped potential which VM are exploiting at a all-too-leisurely pace (Apps, Lovefilm/Netflix, lack of MRS channels, VMTV Android release, inefficient use of tuners etc).
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Old 10-05-2013, 01:05   #1247
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Quote:
Originally Posted by Media Boy View Post
Quote:
Everyone's saying BT will make losses on the Sport side of things.

However, they probably expect to for the first few years, and as others have said, prob hope to take more rights and end up in a 50/50 style share situation with Sky (which would result in BT surely then charging, and presumably sky having to lower their prices)

But if BT get a good increase in viewers, which is likely, as they have 5m Broadband subscribers now, plus the inevitable people they entice, plus those who subscribe who used to have ESPN.

It is logical to predict they will have more viewers than Sky Sports. They could therefore market the advertising slots very competitively and charge more than if they had subscribers paying.

Say they had 1.5m paying £15 that's £22.5m BT is paying £246m per season. Subscriptions wouldn't even scrap the surface anyway.

BT made a profit of £675m last year.

They're not eating into that too much are they?
So you think BT are just starting up Three Sports Channels just to stop the VAT man from getting it?
No. Just pointing out that people who are saying that BT somehow can't afford to offer their channels cheaply are wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by muppetman11 View Post
I'm sure I read that Sky has around 6 million Sky Sports subscribers on its own platform and VM has around 700,000 , they also sell to Talk Talk , Smallworld , BT , UPC Ireland so I realistically can't see BT beating Sky Sports viewing figures. How many of their 5 million BB subscribers will have no interest in sport at all or be without BT TV or Sky TV.
Sky's record viewing figure was the Manchester Derby last year which peaked at 4.4m. with an average of 4m.

However, they average around 2m viewers per game, some games only 1.5m.

11m peak watched last years FA Cup final on ITV.

United's 2nd leg defeat to Real Madrid averaged 9m.

The point I was trying to make was pretty simple.

If you assume that there are the 6m Sky Sports subscribers, of which on average only 2m ever tune in to watch a game.

And there are 5m BT Broadband subscribers.

It's also sensible to assume that whilst some Sky subscribers may have BT broadband, a lot with have Sky Broadband.

Therefore, you have a hefty chunk of 5m BT subscribers now having access to BT sport channels for free.

You will also get some who move from Sky to BT for BB.

And also some who stay at Sky for BB but still sign up to BT Sport.

So you have BT Sport that will become accessible to at least 5m BT BB users, plus a chunk of the 6m who subscribe to Sky Sports.

Basically, you can envisage BT's matches being available to a wider audience than Sky Sports.

I included ITV's figures because that highlights how people want to watch football but don't want to pay, therefore it's very probable that there's people with BT BB who don't want to pay for sport, but will want to tune in when it's offered to them for free.

If it does bear out that there are higher viewing figures, then BT can extract greater advertising revenue and thereby negate the need to charge.

I highlighted BT's revenue to show that they would only generate in the mid £20m by charging everyone which doesn't cover 10% of the costs of acquiring the rights (let alone paying for "talent").

ie. They're better off trying to get as many people watching as possible and make money out of the advertisements as advertising generates far greater revenue than subscriptions.
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Old 10-05-2013, 06:15   #1248
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Not if by doing so they don't drive subscriptions to their own products. Take Sky Atlantic. The argument on here is often that viewing figures are low and they'd make more money from advertising revenue by opening the channel up to cable viewers. But that simplistic argument ignores the fact that Sky estimate that Atlantic drives a quarter of new subscriptions to its platform and, by their own admission, that's where the real money lies.

BT cannot hope to recoup their investment in this rights cycle, in my opinion, and certainly not through advertising revenue generated by wholesaling a channel to other operators when it could be better used to drive subscriptions to its broadband product.

FWIW, I think it's a good deal for BT broadband customers, and having once been one of those I can only say that it's about time BT broadband customers had a good deal!
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Old 10-05-2013, 06:55   #1249
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad View Post
It might actually be a good thing for non-sports fans with XL and VIP. If ESPN drops out, and BT Sports doesn't come to Virgin at all, suddenly Virgin have extra money to play with. What this could mean is:

1. More HD channels
2. More on demand content
3. A dedicated 3D channel
4. Premier Sports
5. SKY Atlantic
6. Etc......
Oh Chad it that imagination of yours running riot again.
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:05   #1250
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

All this makes me realise that it us, the consumer, that are the mugs here. For me the introduction of BT into the market is the straw thats broke the camels back. enough is enough. "The fatted calf has only so much fat."

I might aswell join the hoards of others and if there is a match i want to see on TV just stream it!
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:25   #1251
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Quote:
Originally Posted by raefil View Post
All this makes me realise that it us, the consumer, that are the mugs here. For me the introduction of BT into the market is the straw thats broke the camels back. enough is enough. "The fatted calf has only so much fat."

I might aswell join the hoards of others and if there is a match i want to see on TV just stream it!

Allready crossed my mind
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:36   #1252
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Quote:
Originally Posted by coulsontom View Post
No. Just pointing out that people who are saying that BT somehow can't afford to offer their channels cheaply are wrong.



Sky's record viewing figure was the Manchester Derby last year which peaked at 4.4m. with an average of 4m.

However, they average around 2m viewers per game, some games only 1.5m.

11m peak watched last years FA Cup final on ITV.

United's 2nd leg defeat to Real Madrid averaged 9m.

The point I was trying to make was pretty simple.

If you assume that there are the 6m Sky Sports subscribers, of which on average only 2m ever tune in to watch a game.

And there are 5m BT Broadband subscribers.

It's also sensible to assume that whilst some Sky subscribers may have BT broadband, a lot with have Sky Broadband.

Therefore, you have a hefty chunk of 5m BT subscribers now having access to BT sport channels for free.

You will also get some who move from Sky to BT for BB.

And also some who stay at Sky for BB but still sign up to BT Sport.

So you have BT Sport that will become accessible to at least 5m BT BB users, plus a chunk of the 6m who subscribe to Sky Sports.

Basically, you can envisage BT's matches being available to a wider audience than Sky Sports.

I included ITV's figures because that highlights how people want to watch football but don't want to pay, therefore it's very probable that there's people with BT BB who don't want to pay for sport, but will want to tune in when it's offered to them for free.

If it does bear out that there are higher viewing figures, then BT can extract greater advertising revenue and thereby negate the need to charge.

I highlighted BT's revenue to show that they would only generate in the mid £20m by charging everyone which doesn't cover 10% of the costs of acquiring the rights (let alone paying for "talent").

ie. They're better off trying to get as many people watching as possible and make money out of the advertisements as advertising generates far greater revenue than subscriptions.
Please update your calculator 22.5m per month which is £270m per year.
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Old 10-05-2013, 11:48   #1253
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Sky made losses for years and years when they first started up. BT know they will make losses to begin with.
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Old 10-05-2013, 11:49   #1254
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Does anyone know if the State of Origin Rugby League is on Sky Sports or Premier Sports this year?

EDIT: Just found out it's on Premier sports, and so is the highlights package. Absolutely gutted.

Never mind we are all winners as sports fans.
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Old 10-05-2013, 12:14   #1255
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dash: CF noob View Post
Please update your calculator 22.5m per month which is £270m per year.
Yes. Glaring error.
Which kind of shows BT could make their money back if they wanted to.

---------- Post added at 11:14 ---------- Previous post was at 11:13 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy_m View Post
Not if by doing so they don't drive subscriptions to their own products. Take Sky Atlantic. The argument on here is often that viewing figures are low and they'd make more money from advertising revenue by opening the channel up to cable viewers. But that simplistic argument ignores the fact that Sky estimate that Atlantic drives a quarter of new subscriptions to its platform and, by their own admission, that's where the real money lies.

BT cannot hope to recoup their investment in this rights cycle, in my opinion, and certainly not through advertising revenue generated by wholesaling a channel to other operators when it could be better used to drive subscriptions to its broadband product.

FWIW, I think it's a good deal for BT broadband customers, and having once been one of those I can only say that it's about time BT broadband customers had a good deal!
can't be figured out with certainty tho surely?
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Old 10-05-2013, 12:20   #1256
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Quote:
Originally Posted by coulsontom View Post
can't be figured out with certainty tho surely?
If there was no truth in it whatsoever what would be the point of having the channel exclusive on the Sky platform ? Sky are a business and as such are in the game of making money.
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Old 10-05-2013, 12:21   #1257
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Quote:
Originally Posted by smallclone View Post
Does anyone know if the State of Origin Rugby League is on Sky Sports or Premier Sports this year?

EDIT: Just found out it's on Premier sports, and so is the highlights package. Absolutely gutted.

Never mind we are all winners as sports fans.
I wonder how long it will take them to realise all they are doing is pushing people in the direction of streaming sites ?

I will not be paying BT for sport because

A. i am not willing to pay for Sky and BT

B. I am not a football fan. My main sport is Rugby League which i get on Sky sports

C. I am sure i will not miss out on the Union games .
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Old 10-05-2013, 12:23   #1258
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Well I guess a relatively simple survey of new customers would provide accurate enough data, and they must be confident that it's true otherwise it's a pretty reckless statement to make.
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Old 10-05-2013, 12:36   #1259
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

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Originally Posted by Sirius View Post
I wonder how long it will take them to realise all they are doing is pushing people in the direction of streaming sites ?
Exactly. They're more popular than ever now these subscription streaming sites. I wonder why.
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Old 10-05-2013, 12:42   #1260
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Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news

Quote:
Originally Posted by coulsontom View Post
Everyone's saying BT will make losses on the Sport side of things.

It is logical to predict they will have more viewers than Sky Sports. They could therefore market the advertising slots very competitively and charge more than if they had subscribers paying.

Say they had 1.5m paying £15 that's £22.5m
BT is paying £246m per season. Subscriptions wouldn't even scrap the surface anyway.

BT made a profit of £675m last year.

They're not eating into that too much are they?
A big part of BT's strategy is to target the 113,400 pubs, clubs and bars in the UK along with the 27,000 or so hotels and 7,000 bookmakers. They are also exploring getting their channels into fitness clubs and gyms.

http://www.btplc.com/News/Articles/S...E-BFF015637BD9

"Just over half of independent pubs who take this offer will pay the equivalent of £135.00 per month for BT Sport."

"For example a sixty five bedroom hotel would be able to enjoy premium sport in their bar and rooms for £163 per month, which is 75% cheaper than Sky."

"BT Sport is an exciting new proposition which is available to all commercial premises including offices, golf clubs, sporting clubs, bookmakers and Corca registered clubs with prices starting from as little as £75 per month."
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