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Linear is old tech - on demand is the future
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Old 27-02-2019, 17:43   #616
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Originally Posted by jfman View Post
Why do they need superfast broadband to be rolled out further than it already is? If they are relying on the tiny minority of homes without adequate broadband to make or break their business model then the plans are already margonal at best. Those homes are already years behind in terms of the market emerging there.

It’s a red herring for the reality you ignore. The market simply doesn’t exist on the level you believe it does and you underestimate the main players now and their ability to adapt. Despite both Sky and Virgin being supported as part of wider media empires that have a worldwide business model relying upon it.
There are still large areas of the country without superfast broadband, and it is essential for streaming services (for live streaming particularly) to have reliable, fast broadband speeds. Otherwise, some will be cut of completely and others will be complaining of stuttering, blocking and the like, which is not a good advertisement for their service. It should not take much longer now before these problems are a thing of the past in the vast majority of homes.

As for the market not existing for streaming, do come off it! If Amazon, for example, took the lion's share of the rights to Premiership football, you would soon see the demand that you insist isn't there!

Incidentally, there are a number of streaming services that already cover sport, particularly in the US, so this 'adaptation' argument is the real red herring.
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Old 27-02-2019, 18:00   #617
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post
As for the market not existing for streaming, do come off it! If Amazon, for example, took the lion's share of the rights to Premiership football, you would soon see the demand that you insist isn't there!
Dream on OB as that seems to be another chapter of your imaginary tale..
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Old 27-02-2019, 18:03   #618
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Dream on OB as that seems to be another chapter of your imaginary tale..
Until someone produces credible sums I’m not convinced that Amazon shareholders are going to see the kind of outlay in what’s ultimately a small market (26m homes max) on a global level. If they’d £4 billion to burn through I’m sure there’s far more profitable exercises they could undertake for far less risk.

Sky, on the other hand, have a ready made distribution model from day one.
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Old 27-02-2019, 18:04   #619
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post

Incidentally, there are a number of streaming services that already cover sport, particularly in the US, so this 'adaptation' argument is the real red herring.
You seem to delude yourself that what happens in the US happens here but what you don't understand is the British do things very much different from the Americans on many counts.

---------- Post added at 18:04 ---------- Previous post was at 18:03 ----------

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Until someone produces credible sums I’m not convinced that Amazon shareholders are going to see the kind of outlay in what’s ultimately a small market (26m homes max) on a global level. If they’d £4 billion to burn through I’m sure there’s far more profitable exercises they could undertake.
Exactly..
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Old 27-02-2019, 18:31   #620
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

OFCOM claim that 95% of the households in the UK can get broadband speeds in excess of 24MB. That's more than enough to provide SVOD services if consumers are willing to pay for it.
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Old 27-02-2019, 18:53   #621
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

That, as always, is an up to speed. What would happen if every one of those enabled homes simultaneously tried to utilise even 10Mbps, streaming to 2 or 3 devices? The reality of an entirely IP delivered TV system is that greater than 99% of all homes will need access to broadband that can deliver a minimum of 24Mbps, constantly, at all times of day.
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Old 27-02-2019, 18:58   #622
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Originally Posted by denphone View Post
You seem to delude yourself that what happens in the US happens here but what you don't understand is the British do things very much different from the Americans on many counts.
Oh, Den, you are so parochial!

---------- Post added at 18:58 ---------- Previous post was at 18:56 ----------

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Originally Posted by jfman View Post
OFCOM claim that 95% of the households in the UK can get broadband speeds in excess of 24MB. That's more than enough to provide SVOD services if consumers are willing to pay for it.
What about the outcry there would be from Sky Sports subscribers who could not receive the new football streaming service? Best to wait until the job is done, don't you think?
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Old 27-02-2019, 19:03   #623
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Originally Posted by Chris View Post
That, as always, is an up to speed. What would happen if every one of those enabled homes simultaneously tried to utilise even 10Mbps, streaming to 2 or 3 devices? The reality of an entirely IP delivered TV system is that greater than 99% of all homes will need access to broadband that can deliver a minimum of 24Mbps, constantly, at all times of day.
Happy to be corrected if so, but the report I read did appear to indicate that is the minimum speed homes could expect to get (assuming they pick the premium products available at their exchange or are served by Virgin Media).

I don't believe an all streaming future is credible for a number of reasons which I've posted at length about. However, I don't accept that Amazon or anyone else isn't able to offer a premium product including Premiership rights because the internet speeds aren't fast enough to support it. Such a product wouldn't require 2 or 3 connections at once per household in the same way as an all streaming future would.

You are correct though - the barrier to have multiple screens showing different content in HD and UHD will mean that for some time traditional broadcast methods over satellite and cable will be the used.
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Old 27-02-2019, 19:07   #624
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Originally Posted by Chris View Post
That, as always, is an up to speed. What would happen if every one of those enabled homes simultaneously tried to utilise even 10Mbps, streaming to 2 or 3 devices? The reality of an entirely IP delivered TV system is that greater than 99% of all homes will need access to broadband that can deliver a minimum of 24Mbps, constantly, at all times of day.
That's a good point, Chris, but I'm sure they will have thought about that.I expect the answer is that in practice, you would not get 100% of households using all that capacity at the same time. As demand increases, so will capacity.

There are those who complained quite vociferously that relying on wind and solar power would lead to problems during the winter by now. Hasn't happened, though, because there are back up systems in place. Similarly, as streaming increases, so will capacity.

---------- Post added at 19:07 ---------- Previous post was at 19:04 ----------

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Happy to be corrected if so, but the report I read did appear to indicate that is the minimum speed homes could expect to get (assuming they pick the premium products available at their exchange or are served by Virgin Media).

I don't believe an all streaming future is credible for a number of reasons which I've posted at length about. However, I don't accept that Amazon or anyone else isn't able to offer a premium product including Premiership rights because the internet speeds aren't fast enough to support it. Such a product wouldn't require 2 or 3 connections at once per household in the same way as an all streaming future would.

You are correct though - the barrier to have multiple screens showing different content in HD and UHD will mean that for some time traditional broadcast methods over satellite and cable will be the used.
Things will look very different in 15 years' time and solutions will be found to the capacity issues that you envisage now.
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Old 27-02-2019, 19:07   #625
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post
Oh, Den, you are so parochial!

---------- Post added at 18:58 ---------- Previous post was at 18:56 ----------



What about the outcry there would be from Sky Sports subscribers who could not receive the new football streaming service? Best to wait until the job is done, don't you think?
I'm quite sure that the capitalists at Amazon aren't holding off on this lucrative venture because of the small number of Sky Sports subscribers who can't get adequate broadband.

Sky didn't hold off because of the number of homes without direct line of sight to a satellite dish, in conservation areas or because landlords sometimes don't allow tenants to install a dish.

There's plenty of outcries to be had out there because Sky increase their content, but as Neil Diamond sings money talks.

Similarly there'd be nothing preventing an Amazon channel getting carriage on Sky or Virgin Media to complement its streaming offering, priced at a premium and obviously a second class product by comparison. Yet... they don't.

Quote:
Things will look very different in 15 years' time and solutions will be found to the capacity issues that you envisage now.
Even if solved the basics of economics will always apply. There's no indication that they can offer a product cheaper or better offering the same content as Sky and turn a profit in doing so.
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Old 27-02-2019, 19:22   #626
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Originally Posted by jfman View Post
I'm quite sure that the capitalists at Amazon aren't holding off on this lucrative venture because of the small number of Sky Sports subscribers who can't get adequate broadband.

Sky didn't hold off because of the number of homes without direct line of sight to a satellite dish, in conservation areas or because landlords sometimes don't allow tenants to install a dish.

There's plenty of outcries to be had out there because Sky increase their content, but as Neil Diamond sings money talks.

Similarly there'd be nothing preventing an Amazon channel getting carriage on Sky or Virgin Media to complement its streaming offering, priced at a premium and obviously a second class product by comparison. Yet... they don't.
I don't think that Amazon would wish to invite too much adverse publicity from people who lose a service they have now with Sky solely because of Amazon's involvement. That could well impact on the retailing part of their business.

It is true that Amazon could set up a conventional TV channel, but quite honestly, I don't think they want to do that. Their concentration will be on expanding their existing streaming services.

---------- Post added at 19:22 ---------- Previous post was at 19:16 ----------

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Even if solved the basics of economics will always apply. There's no indication that they can offer a product cheaper or better offering the same content as Sky and turn a profit in doing so.
I have already outlined ideas of what Amazon could do differently from Sky. It's not rocket science when you start thinking about it.

For example, offering 'skinny bundles' of matches to enable people to watch some football rather than no football at all due to the cost might well prove very popular. With Sky, it's everything or nothing. That excludes so many people.
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Old 27-02-2019, 19:39   #627
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

If only Sky offered a way you could buy Sky Sports only. Like a day pass, or a monthly pass without having to commit to a 12 month contract or a basic TV package. It'd introduce so many new entrants into the market presently excluded.
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Old 27-02-2019, 19:39   #628
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

No it's not you can take a day pass for a one off event or week pass for several over the weekend.

Edit jfman beat me to it.
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Old 27-02-2019, 19:42   #629
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Oh, Den, you are so parochial!
The mind is like a parachute OB as unless you open the parachute one never learns anything..
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Old 27-02-2019, 21:09   #630
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Re: Linear is old tech - on demand is the future

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Originally Posted by jfman View Post
If only Sky offered a way you could buy Sky Sports only. Like a day pass, or a monthly pass without having to commit to a 12 month contract or a basic TV package. It'd introduce so many new entrants into the market presently excluded.

I would be happy to sign a 12 month contract for sky sports only if I could, unfortunately they are allowed to make you pay for a load of rubbish channels I never watch - most of which are on freeview anyway.
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