Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

[bigbadcol]

Just one other interesting fact.

It is intresting that Phrom's PR Puppy has not commented on the outlaw story.

Prehaps that is because Out-Law are a Law Firm.!!

[PhormUKPRteam]

Originally Posted by Florence

Your PC has hidden around it personal details about you a simple line of script to those who are not programmers will look like it doesn't pose a threat but this script could reveal everything about you. Your PC holds more information than you would tell your bank manager about yourself and once Phorm has their cookie on your PC they can change the script rules you wouldn't know and your personal details are already for them to farm out to highest bidder. You wouldn't even know they had gathered this information since you had already accepted that they could gather info they just moved the goal posts a little.

Again to reiterate the point Webwise can never know who you are or where you've browsed. All that is ever stored is a random number, advertiser categories eg sport or travel and a timestamp. You can permanently opt out by blocking cookies from the domain, www.webwise.com.

[ceedee]

Originally Posted by Jayceef1

I have never said that I dismiss peoples genuine concerns or argue that black is white. Again you misinterpret. Just that people should base their concerns on facts rather than unfounded speculation of what it will do or what might happen in the future. A lot is of this is based on the BT implementation which is far more advanced that the others. CPW look like they will implement differently and VM could do different still. When we "know" exactly how it will work then you can make the judgement call.

Well we're not going to "know" exact details until Phorm is operational and I have a suspicion that it might be a bit tricky to get it changed then!
What will you do if Phorm/VM decide at some time in the future to start quietly recording further behavioural data (per the patent)?
Do you think they'll give you an opt-out?

I know some will say not at any cost but others may not providing the safeguards are adequate or they put their own solution in place and some will not care at all.

It's quite simple: should ISPs (and thereby, unknown third parties) be permitted to obtain, analyse and profit from our private browsing data?
The spirit, if not the actual letter, of data protection and privacy laws says it's not allowed without full and express consent (which we can't give because we don't "know" what they'll do tomorrow) but you seem to think we should just let them implement it before protesting?

Unless it is ruled out completely by the European commisison then it is highly likely that it will happen in some form whatever anyone thinks and most other ISPs are likely to follow suit. I am not for it but it may be something that we have to live with for cheap broadband.

I don't receive "cheap broadband" -- I pay well over comparable "cheap" ADSL offers because I want a reliable and secure connection. If VM won't provide it, then I'll be switching back to a security-conscious ADSL provider at considerably higher costs.

If you want to roll over and let Phorm and VM drastically alter the basis of the internet that's fine by me, just stop spouting your defeatist nonsense at folks that don't.

[Florence]

Originally Posted by popper

http://www.out-law.com/page-4

"OUT-LAW Services

OUT-LAW is part of Pinsent Masons which is among the 100 largest law firms in the world. We can help you with a full range of legal solutions. Here you'll find a selection of our services."

its interesting that Outlaw a law firm, cant get answers from Phorm, as per above story.

its also interesting that BT did apparently run unlawful trials last year on a selection of their userbase using this very same Phorm patent pending Kit.

its also interesting that an effected BT tech user, happens to grab a dataset of this web traffic while this trial is taking place, and discovers several things about what it is doing to his data stream.

its also interesting that infact Phorm didnt register with the data protection registrar so commiting an offence,until at least 6 months AFTER this Unlawful BT data sharing trial took place.

thats enough interesting facts for now then, i hope you agree...

Knew just proves we cannot trust a word coming from Phorm. I will copy this over to ISPr if you don't mind, the Phorm PR team have been busy on there spamming the copy and paste information.

[ceedee]

Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam

Again to reiterate the point Webwise can never know who you are or where you've browsed. All that is ever stored is a random number, advertiser categories eg sport or travel and a timestamp. You can permanently opt out by blocking cookies from the domain, www.webwise.com.

You've obviously not read all of the the patent:

[0042] As explained above, the context reader may be configured to more than just keyword and other contextual data pertaining to a given web page. The context reader may also include behavioral data (e.g, browsing behavior), other historical data collected over time, demographic data associated with the user, IP address, URL data, etc.

@PhormUKPRteam: How long is the contract between your company and Phorm?
You are solely here to put Phorm's case until the fuss quietens down, right?

[none]

On a slight side note:

Knocked up another batch to choose from


av – 100x100

http://img356.imageshack.us/img356/6585/avdonotwant100x100ii7.jpg

av – 120x120
[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/9264/avdonotwant120x120mm2.jpg

sig
[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/8183/sigdonotwantmp1.gif

<free to share>

[popper]

copy away,add any other interesting facts etc, as long as its not for profit.

its also a good thing to put a direct url to the CF board or thread so as to help grow the readership, the more the meryer

[bigbadcol]

Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam

Again to reiterate the point Webwise can never know who you are or where you've browsed. All that is ever stored is a random number, advertiser categories eg sport or travel and a timestamp. You can permanently opt out by blocking cookies from the domain, www.webwise.com.

Still the same party line. CAN YOU READ Mr PR Puppy

I refer you to the patent once again which states

".......the context reader may be configured to more than just keyword and other contextual data pertaining to a given web page. The context reader may also include behavioral data (e.g, browsing behavior), other historical data collected over time, demographic data associated with the user, IP address, URL data, etc."

So The Context reader can store IP addresses, Demographic data, urls. etc.

Oh and Mr PR puppy, are you the same person who who was previously UKTechTeam and isn't tech and doesn't work for Phorm but actually a PR company called Citigate Drew Rogerson (?). (Why don't you set your sig accordingly so we know?) (thanks felixcatuk for that)

The patent is the facts of your system. No amount of spin will cover that up.

Thank you

[Traduk]

Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam

Again to reiterate the point Webwise can never know who you are or where you've browsed. All that is ever stored is a random number, advertiser categories eg sport or travel and a timestamp. You can permanently opt out by blocking cookies from the domain, www.webwise.com.

Your assertions may be absolutely 100% true but what weight does it carry in the total context of what is proposed.

Phorm's CEO appears to be splitting the various inter-related technical aspects and companies into modules and making definitive statements about what is not, or cannot be seen or done by each and any as though they are unrelated entities. I am afraid that you have just done exactly the same and it doesn't matter one iota what various parts of the whole can or cannot do as it's the whole entity that is the subject of concern.

It is entirely possible to break down many factors in any situation into benign little modules but when combined into the whole they can have very different characteristics.

[Florence]

Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam

Again to reiterate the point Webwise can never know who you are or where you've browsed. All that is ever stored is a random number, advertiser categories eg sport or travel and a timestamp. You can permanently opt out by blocking cookies from the domain, www.webwise.com.

Just to remind you the PATENT Phorm has applied for can allow this to happen without the customer’s knowledge. There you go again this should be OPT-IN not opt-out it is not what pay VM for and is an invasion on my freedom, human and personal rights.

Since you avoid getting answers to my earlier questions on who controls the updating scripts, updates the servers then this will always be like putting a pedophile in charge of a primary school.

[~$ su]

Originally Posted by ceedee

It's quite simple: should ISPs (and thereby, unknown third parties) be permitted to obtain, analyse and profit from our private browsing data?

If you want to roll over and let Phorm and VM drastically alter the basis of the internet that's fine by me, just stop spouting your defeatist nonsense at folks that don't.

I see another kind of nonsense here.

Phorm aren't doing anything that isn't already done by other companies and hasn't been done for many years.

You try being an ISP and not having certain information about your customers on your servers and databases when all their traffic is going through you.

If you don't like what Phorm and VM are doing, complain, opt-out, or use a proxy.

It's that simple.

[Florence]

Originally Posted by bigbadcol

Still the same party line. CAN YOU READ Mr PR Puppy

I refer you to the patent once again which states

".......the context reader may be configured to more than just keyword and other contextual data pertaining to a given web page. The context reader may also include behavioral data (e.g, browsing behavior), other historical data collected over time, demographic data associated with the user, IP address, URL data, etc."

So The Context reader can store IP addresses, Demographic data, urls. etc.

Oh and Mr PR puppy, are you the same person who who was previously UKTechTeam and isn't tech and doesn't work for Phorm but actually a PR company called Citigate Drew Rogerson (?). (Why don't you set your sig accordingly so we know?) (thanks felixcatuk for that)

The patent is the facts of your system. No amount of spin will cover that up.

Thank you

I posted information they were a PR company back on page 47 I think http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/34502235-post703.html

Once I had found out but for some reason everyone seemed to just miss it as noone started to mention PR for a few pages.

[~$ su]

Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam

Again to reiterate the point Webwise can never know who you are or where you've browsed. All that is ever stored is a random number, advertiser categories eg sport or travel and a timestamp. You can permanently opt out by blocking cookies from the domain, www.webwise.com.

You don't need to know who we are, you're assigning us a number - a new identification. You don't need our name when you're giving us a new one for your own purpose. Therefore, you do know who we are.

You don't explain how you place us into one of those advertiser categories. Do you just pick it at random...no, you don't.
You use data taken from our activity...go on, admit it. You'll feel much better afterwards...

[Florence]

Originally Posted by ~$ su

I see another kind of nonsense here.

Phorm aren't doing anything that isn't already done by other companies and hasn't been done for many years.

You try being an ISP and not having certain information about your customers on your servers and databases when all their traffic is going through you.

If you don't like what Phorm and VM are doing, complain, opt-out, or use a proxy.

It's that simple.

This is an interestng first post, a few questions..

How long have you been a VM customer, do you value your online privacy?

[popper]

Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam

Again to reiterate the point Webwise can never know who you are or where you've browsed. All that is ever stored is a random number, advertiser categories eg sport or travel and a timestamp. You can permanently opt out by blocking cookies from the domain, www.webwise.com.

HI PhormUKPRteam, nice to see you didnt go missing after all LOL.

regarding your (phorm supplyed and aproved information to you as one of their PR personel)

"You can permanently opt out by blocking cookies from the domain"

NOT true.

you are fully aware from previous statements this is infact untrue, as infact blocking cookies DOES NOT permanently opt the user OUT of this Phorm system.

blocking this cookie you speak of, infact forces the Phorm installed Kit to pass the already collected and processed data past the Profiler, onward to allow the Phorm company to then collect any profits they may have with the advertisers.

you infact NEED a cookie to so called Opt-out and even then,it mearly stops the passing of the collected and processed potentially personal data from the Phorm supplyed 'profiler', flowing into the 'add picking' part of the Phorm system.

your also aware, with or without the Phorm supplyed site cookie, a users personal IP number and other potentially personal data is always flowing into the Phorm supplyed Profiler once its installed into the ISPS data center and activated (such in any trials etc).

your also fully aware after reading these sites and posts and emails etc, that infact the only way to really opt out, once this Phorm kit is installed and activated, is to send your ISP a 'data protection act notice' removing their right to send the data subjects personal data in any form to any such profiler electronic device.