200M Reselling VM broadband.

RichardCoulter · 22-06-2019, 23:22

Someone who lives in a very rural area (and is one of the few properties served by VM) would like to know if there is anything techically or legally stopping him from reselling his BB to his neighbours?

It would be slow, but faster than what they are currently using. It's a domestic contract, but he'd have no problem with upgrading to a business contract or a higher tier speed if need be.

If it's against any t&c's, how would they know? He could just have a very large family if excessive use was detected.

The only problem that I can think of is if something like illegal porn, pirating sites or terrorism related etc were used on the connection, but AFAIK it has to be proved that it was the actual subscriber that accessed this content- him being the bill payer isn't enough evidence on it's own.

Anyone?

jfman · 22-06-2019, 23:50

It’s against T&Cs, even for business subscribers.

spiderplant · 23-06-2019, 09:33

Does he really think asking random people on the internet is the best way to get legal advice on his proposed business venture?

Carth · 23-06-2019, 09:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiderplant

Does he really think asking random people on the internet is the best way to get legal advice on his proposed business venture?

well . . . twitter & facebook do seem to be the place to be for up to date information about everything these days . . and all of it is fact, not gossip . . . honest guv

ozsat · 23-06-2019, 09:55

So its OK to do 100mph in my car through a built-up area - as long as no-one knows?

If he wants to know - let him ask - or is it you?

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

If it's against any t&c's, how would they know?

RichardCoulter · 23-06-2019, 13:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiderplant

Does he really think asking random people on the internet is the best way to get legal advice on his proposed business venture?

Dunno who else he's consulted, I thought i'd ask on his behalf on here seeing as it's a forum concerned with VM BB.

---------- Post added at 13:13 ---------- Previous post was at 13:09 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozsat

So its OK to do 100mph in my car through a built-up area - as long as no-one knows?

If he wants to know - let him ask - or is it you?

I decided to ask off my own back to be helpful.

The example quoted is not comparable.

If nobody knows or isn't prepared to offer advice, that's fine, but helpful and pertinent replies only please.

jfman · 23-06-2019, 13:19

Would you prefer people just lied and told you it’s be fine?

ozsat · 23-06-2019, 13:46

The helpful reply is - you shouldn't be getting involved as you already seem to think it is not normal.

And if he really wanted to do it he would find out himself.

Something you could have done yourself as a VM customer is read the T&C yourself:

11. The following acts are also not permitted:
ii) re-selling, or making any charge for watching or using, all or any part of the services;

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

Dunno who else he's consulted, I thought i'd ask on his behalf on here seeing as it's a forum concerned with VM BB.

---------- Post added at 13:13 ---------- Previous post was at 13:09 ----------

I decided to ask off my own back to be helpful.

The example quoted is not comparable.

If nobody knows or isn't prepared to offer advice, that's fine, but helpful and pertinent replies only please.

nomadking · 23-06-2019, 13:57

Buy a cheap VM mobile phone and you get legitimate access to VM hotspots.

RichardCoulter · 23-06-2019, 15:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfman

Would you prefer people just lied and told you it’s be fine?

No. At the time of writing that, you were the only person who had offered any meaningful reply.

---------- Post added at 15:05 ---------- Previous post was at 15:02 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozsat

The helpful reply is - you shouldn't be getting involved as you already seem to think it is not normal.

And if he really wanted to do it he would find out himself.

Something you could have done yourself as a VM customer is read the T&C yourself:

11. The following acts are also not permitted:
ii) re-selling, or making any charge for watching or using, all or any part of the services;

It's not for you to say whether I should become involved or not. Thank you for answering my question about the t&c's though, that's what I was looking for and I can now pass on the information.

---------- Post added at 15:10 ---------- Previous post was at 15:05 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomadking

Buy a cheap VM mobile phone and you get legitimate access to VM hotspots.

Cheers for the tip, but I have a feeling that, as they live so rurally, that this either isn't an option or it's slower than the speeds he would be able to offer.

If he is found to be breaking the t&c's, he could well end up having his own fast BB cut off. That's before any technical, taxation and legal considerations are considered. I personally wouldn't risk it, but in the end it's a decision only he can take.

jfman · 23-06-2019, 16:02

Quote:

The only problem that I can think of is if something like illegal porn, pirating sites or terrorism related etc were used on the connection, but AFAIK it has to be proved that it was the actual subscriber that accessed this content- him being the bill payer isn't enough evidence on it's own.

Just on this point as the bill payer it’d probably reach the threshold for a warrant to search his property and seize/analyse and computer equipment which may not be returned for some time.

He may also be detained for questioning for an extended period if it was thought his excuse was unlikely, or that he was sharing his connection with neighbours to implicate them for crimes he was committing.

ozsat · 23-06-2019, 16:09

You asked for a helpful reply and I gave you a helpful reply. If you don't want answers you will not like then don't ask silly questions.

Don't expect much more if you asking about dodgy stuff. If it was something he could easily do then loads of people would be advertising their services.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

It's not for you to say whether I should become involved or not. Thank you for answering my question about the t&c's though, that's what I was looking for and I can now pass on the information.

---------- Post added at 16:09 ---------- Previous post was at 16:06 ----------

My understand is that "some time" could easily exceed 12 months - and would be very likely to be all computers and mobile phones.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfman

Just on this point as the bill payer it’d probably reach the threshold for a warrant to search his property and seize/analyse and computer equipment which may not be returned for some time.

He may also be detained for questioning for an extended period if it was thought his excuse was unlikely, or that he was sharing his connection with neighbours to implicate them for crimes he was committing.

RichardCoulter · 23-06-2019, 17:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfman

Just on this point as the bill payer it’d probably reach the threshold for a warrant to search his property and seize/analyse and computer equipment which may not be returned for some time.

He may also be detained for questioning for an extended period if it was thought his excuse was unlikely, or that he was sharing his connection with neighbours to implicate them for crimes he was committing.

I'm sure you're right.

---------- Post added at 17:52 ---------- Previous post was at 17:50 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozsat

You asked for a helpful reply and I gave you a helpful reply. If you don't want answers you will not like then don't ask silly questions.

Don't expect much more if you asking about dodgy stuff. If it was something he could easily do then loads of people would be advertising their services.

---------- Post added at 16:09 ---------- Previous post was at 16:06 ----------

My understand is that "some time" could easily exceed 12 months - and would be very likely to be all computers and mobile phones.

I asked a legitimate question and received some pertinent replies, everything else being unneccesary clutter.

Mythica · 23-06-2019, 18:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardCoulter

I'm sure you're right.

---------- Post added at 17:52 ---------- Previous post was at 17:50 ----------

I asked a legitimate question and received some pertinent replies, everything else being unneccesary clutter.

Surely you already knew that it was against the terms of Virgin Media which means you shouldn't really be asking the question in the first place.

roughbeast · 23-06-2019, 19:40

Well that was one of the most bizarre discussions we have had on here for some time - Telford posts notwithstanding.

Or was it?

I still run a Fonera Simpl router on my network. This provides a hot spot for any passing BT FON subscriber or FON subscriber. For my security they have to log on via the FON portal or automatically using their ID. The benefit for me is that I can run a FON app on my phone to log on to any of the millions of FON spots world-wide or BT FON hot spot in the UK. Essentially, I profit by payment in kind.

Strictly, I suppose, since I am not selling Virgin services for cash profit, I'm not breaking the rules. Do we agree? Others, running a FON hotspot, in a cafe for example, have sold access to their ISP's services via the FON portal. They got a slice of the profit. I'm not sure how FON got away with that.

The OP's proposal is quite different. He should advise his 'friend' not to proceed with selling access because it obviously breaks T&Cs. He shouldn't share it as a favour either. It leaves him at risk.