Brexit

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Mr K

See your Brexit holiday has been cut short, yet again

It was a one night stand 👼

Well, as long as we can still take the piss out of Farage

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by denphone

Utterly pathetic IMO.

Papers are suggesting it's a distraction for the Equality and Human Rights Commission investigation. Could be onto something. Anyway, back to Brexit.

[Mr K]

Good News Brexiteers ! Bercow is staying on after all

John Bercow defies Eurosceptics with vow to stay on as Speaker

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...y_to_clipboard

Originally Posted by ianch99

Uncomfortable, isn't it? More people signed the petition to end Brexit than voted for the Nigel Farage Party ..

*drops mic*

And more than 13 Million Remainers from Referendum in 2016, did not vote for "Bollocks to Brexit", Liberal Democrats last week, your meaningless point is?

Seems you have dropped the mic on your head because a petition of six million does not beat 17.4 Million. The petition creator pleaded to get that tally beaten - they failed and rightly so.

You should be the uncomfortable one knowing that 10 million people, all Remainers did not sign that petition in the end and you should be all grown up enough to acknowledge that democracy is measured at the ballot box, not pathetic e-petitions.

---------- Post added at 21:25 ---------- Previous post was at 21:22 ----------

Originally Posted by Damien

Well, as long as we can still take the piss out of Farage

As long as we can still take the piss out of Vince Cable, who cannot get the profanity laden slogan right, turn up for a debate on time and even get his facts right, no problem.

But seriously - this kind of debate is becoming child like and it needs to stop and it will stop.

Originally Posted by Mick

As long as we can still take the piss out of Vince Cable, who cannot get the profanity laden slogan right, turn up for a debate on time and even get his facts right, no problem.

I mean there is probably loads to take the piss out of Vince Cable with.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Damien

I mean there is probably loads to take the piss out of Vince Cable with.

He's stepping down soon anyway. Just the Labour Party that needs a change at the top now.

[Carth]

Originally Posted by Mr K

See your Brexit holiday has been cut short, yet again

probably happy with what he had, didn't need an extension (unlike others)

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Taf

Turnout was just below 37% in the UK.

South East of England was 39.36% (36.3% in 2014).
West Midlands was 31.1% (32.4% in 2014).
North West was 33.1% (33.3% in 2014).
South Westwas 40.5% (37.4% from 2014).
The Eastern region was 36.4% (36.6% in 2014).
Wales was 37.3% (32% in 2014).

So perhaps over 63% didn't vote as they expect Brexit to actually happen, so why vote for an MEP?

Add that percentage to The Brexit Party vote and there is a landslide for leaving the EU.

Anyone can "play" with the figures, to suit their agenda.

I very nearly didn't vote, just didn't see the point, it was literally due to a large queue of traffic at the top of my road that made me stop and go in and I was tempted to vote kipper, the only one canvassing outside the was an old boy, he'd been stood there all day and I admired him for it, sadly not quite enough to change sides again but credit to him, no one else bothered and it's not like he didn't know it was going to be one last hurrah for them.

Originally Posted by Mick

It was a Seismic shift - it is a new party which is now the largest party sitting in the European Parliament. The mistake you're making is saying it's UKIP, it's not - for a start it has candidates from a whole range of political beliefs, from those on left, to those on right. It also had a diverse range of ethnic candidates, which was far from the case in UKIP.

BP is not UKIP.

---------- Post added at 11:04 ---------- Previous post was at 10:54 ----------

Liberal Democrats caught in a lie - they claim now after the vote that Labour is a Remain so they can fudge the argument that Remain won more votes, but they campaigned on a ticket which said a vote for them, is a vote to stop brexit and it said "Conservatives, Labour, Brexit Party and UKIP" is a vote for Brexit.

See the image of the leaflet....

https://twitter.com/IainDale/status/1133310925300273152

Mmm liberals and leaflets have history,.anyone remember the straight choice and how "straight" Simon Hughes turned out to be

Originally Posted by papa smurf

It's A trench, classic warfare preparations readying themselves to destroy the enemy from within it's own borders.


29 MEP'S did anyone else get that many?

A trench, bit like a grave then...

[Angua]

Originally Posted by papa smurf

It's A trench, classic warfare preparations readying themselves to destroy the enemy from within it's own borders.


29 MEP'S did anyone else get that many?

I'll give you the 29 Brexit MEPs and the 5 Anti EU MEPs.

As this time round there are more pro EU MEPs with 39.

[1andrew1]

Those on the purer ends of the Remain and Leave positions won't agree with her, but I think this piece from Sky's Beth Rigby is insightful. It's worth reading the whole article but this is part of her conclusion.

The British public I suspect aren't that bothered about the intricacies of the deal - will Britain be able to strike free trade deals, will it be a customs arrangement or a customs union, will our regulations have to be aligned or can we diverge - but they are bothered about whether our political class can exit the EU without precipitating a political crisis which leads to a general election or second referendum.
Everyone needs to get out of their silos and try to move onto common ground. They might not have liked the messenger, but Theresa May was right: Brexit involves compromise and the Tories need to take themselves back from the abyss.

https://news.sky.com/story/sky-views...omise-11730565

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Those on the purer ends of the Remain and Leave positions won't agree with her, but I think this piece from Sky's Beth Rigby is insightful. It's worth reading the whole article but this is part of her conclusion.

https://news.sky.com/story/sky-views...omise-11730565

I agree, Andrew. Compromise is, however, a dirty word now. The populist approach which places spin over substance is dominant. So many people, for different reasons, are happy with a Hard Brexit. Most are not questioning how will it impact their personal situation. They are just repeating the dogma sound bites but not asking the really important questions e.g. "Show me exactly why I will not be poorer?"

For a nation that had a global reputation for pragmatism and common sense, we have basically lost it, big style.

---------- Post added at 09:44 ---------- Previous post was at 09:31 ----------

Originally Posted by Pierre

After all this time and i’m Concerned that you and others still just don’t get it.

After 3 years, all those that voted Brexit ( and there will be some that have changed their mind, conversely there will also be Remainers that have changed their mind....i’m One) are so annoyed that you can take the piss out of Farage, you can make all the pro-Remain / anti -Brexit points etc, etc. It’s irrelevant, they want the result of the referendum enacted, and will support anyone that can deliver it.

The time for debating the pros and cons of Brexit is over, it’s been done. If you don’t know or understand what it entails now you never will. People have had enough time and positions are now well and truly entrenched.

Any “confirmatory vote” on any deal presented, would only work if the vote was accept the deal or leave with no deal.

Any other 2nd referendum would only invoked to potentially reverse the first. In my opinion I don’t believe that would be correct but if that is the direction that was taken I believe it would only be legitimate if it was on the exact same question as the first.

I’d be happy to run that again, but only if it was decided that to win Remain had to win by a margin of victory was higher than the first.

Otherwise, it wouldn’t settle the argument, that probably wouldn’ Either, but you get where i’m Coming from

Your argument, such as it is, is predicated on a basis on certainty and entitlement.

Certainty:

The Leave voters believe, not beyond reasonable doubt but beyond *any* doubt that they have right on their side. History tells us that is a recipe for things that nations tend to regret.

Entitlement:

They believe that an ill judged and ill conceived referendum result gives the Leave side an incontrovertible mandate to impose a national structural & economic change based on a vote that had no minimal turnout and a legal result that could be decided by a single person's vote. They also think they have no need to accommodate the wishes and concerns of 48% of the electorate that voted Remain. The 'Winner Takes All" attitude is why we are in this mess.

On both counts, no surprise here, I think they are wrong. They have every right to believe they are correct and I have every to believe (and articulate) why they are wrong.

I totally "get it" ..

Originally Posted by ianch99

I agree, Andrew. Compromise is, however, a dirty word now. The populist approach which places spin over substance is dominant. So many people, for different reasons, are happy with a Hard Brexit. Most are not questioning how will it impact their personal situation. They are just repeating the dogma sound bites but not asking the really important questions e.g. "Show me exactly why I will not be poorer?"

For a nation that had a global reputation for pragmatism and common sense, we have basically lost it, big style.

No need to worry - according to a Brexit Party candidate (now MEP), it will only be "short-term".

https://www.indy100.com/article/brex...-years-8919786

Femi:

I'm really hung up on something that you said earlier. You said 'Brexit at any cost'

Please tell the people who are struggling in this country, that you want Brexit at any cost.

Campbell then asked Harris to try and elaborate on her comment and it wouldn't exactly fill your heart with hope and prosperity, even if you were the most staunch of Brexiteers.

Well...I don't...I mean...are you looking for a number...or?

I think short term there will be an effect on the economy. Short-term yes.

Campbell:

How long is short term?

Harris?

How long is short term? I don't know. The next 30 years?

[tweetiepooh]

Me thinks (and sorry I haven't trawled through all posts to check this) that the results of the EU elections can be summarised as "Leave or don't leave, there is no May".

Yes there are negotiations and compromise on exactly how but a result is needed and it should follow the desires from the referendum.

[nomadking]

The notion of Brexit contains certain core principles. The so-called compromises violate one or more of those core principles. That is not coming to a compromise. A Customs Union would violate more than one of those core principles.


Also bear in mind that the WA is NOT a final agreement. It could get worse, especially if Corbyn got hold of things.