Home News Forum Articles
  Welcome back Join CF
You are here You are here: Home | Forum | Trump gets fact checked

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most of the discussions, articles and other free features. By joining our Virgin Media community you will have full access to all discussions, be able to view and post threads, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own images/photos, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please join our community today.


Welcome to Cable Forum
Go Back   Cable Forum > General Discussion > Current Affairs

Trump gets fact checked
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-07-2020, 22:24   #151
Damien
Remoaner
Cable Forum Team
 
Damien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 29,766
Damien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver bling
Damien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver bling
Re: Trump gets fact checked

The pardon or ability to commute sentences is really dodgy but I think the main problem is when people use it for their friends and family as is the case with Clinton and Trump. Most of the time it does seem to be used reasonably responsibly.

What they should certainly do is remove the ability to pardon anyone between the November election and Inauguration if you are on the way out. Clinton's pardoning of his brother happened just before Bush took over. Obama's pardoning of Chelsea Manning happened just before Trump.

Each President seems to have one dodgy Pardon when they know it's their last time at it.
Damien is offline   Reply With Quote
Advertisement
Old 12-07-2020, 04:22   #152
TheDaddy
cf.mega pornstar
 
TheDaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,538
TheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver bling
TheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver blingTheDaddy has a lot of silver bling
Re: Trump gets fact checked

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick View Post
Trump doesn't need protecting, he was acquitted in his Impeachment trial by the Senate. Had he commuted the sentence of Stone while the Robert Mueller investigation had been still live, then I would be nodding in agreement with you.

But Stone claims he was setup, also said his trial was met with unconstitutional blocks to his defense.

You need to re-read what I wrote, he has not pardoned him, he has commuted his sentence, the conviction remains on file. A Pardon removes all federal convictions and sentence is dropped, if time is still being served in a U.S Penitentiary.

You go look at who and what past presidents have pardoned, Bill Clinton pardoned his own brother.

There is no review of pardons. There have been historical attempts to curb the presidential pardon power, to no avail. This issue, too, was brought up in the Constitutional Convention, that pardons must be granted with the consent of the US Senate, but the measure was defeated on the vote of eight states to one.

The President need not provide a reason for a pardon and the courts and Congress have no legal authority to approve, disapprove, reject, or accept a pardon. Currently, the only way to change the pardon power is by constitutional amendment.

Clinton pardoned his older brother, Roger, for obvious familial reasons. He pardoned a pair of Hasidic Jews convicted of defrauding the government, restoring their civil rights but leaving monetary penalties intact.

In a controversial move, he pardoned fugitive financier Marc Rich, after application for clemency, in part, from the state of Israel, which had benefited from Rich's philanthropic gestures, a Federal Prosecutor was appointed to investigate this pardon, however they were later replaced by one and only, James Comey, who expressed that there were no illegalities in Clinton's pardon of Marc Rich.

President Gerald Ford pardoned President Nixon of any wrong-doing in order to put a close to the Nixon era for good.

President Jimmy Carter, pardoned all the Vietnam War draft dodgers to help in the long healing process the nation endured after that war.
Was he protecting him before or after his acquittal?

Judging by how close the Bush Gore election was I'm hardly going out on a limb by saying Clinton pardoning Rich got Bush over the line into the White House. Another one that springs to my mind is Casper Weinberger over Iran Contra, that had a certain kind of stench about it to.

---------- Post added at 04:22 ---------- Previous post was at 04:20 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien View Post
The pardon or ability to commute sentences is really dodgy but I think the main problem is when people use it for their friends and family as is the case with Clinton and Trump. Most of the time it does seem to be used reasonably responsibly.

What they should certainly do is remove the ability to pardon anyone between the November election and Inauguration if you are on the way out. Clinton's pardoning of his brother happened just before Bush took over. Obama's pardoning of Chelsea Manning happened just before Trump.

Each President seems to have one dodgy Pardon when they know it's their last time at it.
If I lived there the question in my mind would be, is it being used how it was intended to be when created, if it isn't it should be ammended or scrapped imo
__________________
Sports Babble
TheDaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2020, 11:37   #153
downquark1
cf.mega poster
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Age: 33
Services: Plusnet FFTC
Posts: 4,670
downquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appeal
downquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appealdownquark1 has a bronzed appeal
Re: Trump gets fact checked

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien View Post
Probably should be in the future. It's odd the clearance to run for the President seems to have less disclosure than most other checks for high-level jobs. Obviously those jobs don't require it gets released to the public but they're the ones 'hiring' you in the end.
There's a difference between releasing information to the public and the authorities. High judges have all sort of personal information combed over but that doesn't mean the newspapers get it.
__________________
"Knowledge is Power. Power Corrupts. Study Hard. Be Evil."
downquark1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2020, 12:58   #154
Mick
Cable Forum Team
 
Mick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 13,102
Mick has a nice shiny starMick has a nice shiny starMick has a nice shiny star
Mick has a nice shiny starMick has a nice shiny starMick has a nice shiny starMick has a nice shiny starMick has a nice shiny starMick has a nice shiny starMick has a nice shiny starMick has a nice shiny star
Re: Trump gets fact checked

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien View Post
The pardon or ability to commute sentences is really dodgy but I think the main problem is when people use it for their friends and family as is the case with Clinton and Trump. Most of the time it does seem to be used reasonably responsibly.

What they should certainly do is remove the ability to pardon anyone between the November election and Inauguration if you are on the way out. Clinton's pardoning of his brother happened just before Bush took over. Obama's pardoning of Chelsea Manning happened just before Trump.

Each President seems to have one dodgy Pardon when they know it's their last time at it.
But an interesting fact arose just before Trump Impeachment trial at the beginning of the year. Former presidents can still be Impeached, the power to do so is in the Constitution, however, the primary objective of "Impeachment", is to remove from office, it would be extremely rare for it to be exercised after a president left office.

If Congress, in 1974 had imagined the possibility of President Richard Nixon, rehabilitating his reputation to a point where he may have thought to have a chance at holding a future office however much very unlikely it sounds, there is an absolute chance, a bipartisan House and Senate steaming ahead with an impeachment and trial, in order to bar that possibility through a judgement of disqualification.

---------- Post added at 12:58 ---------- Previous post was at 12:29 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDaddy View Post

If I lived there the question in my mind would be, is it being used how it was intended to be when created, if it isn't it should be ammended or scrapped imo
I do not agree it should be scrapped but it does seem that the pardon power oversteps the balance of powers of the other two branches of government, the legislature, House and Senate and Judicial branch, the Supreme Court, however, could a Supreme Court rule a pardon null and void, probably not, because the Supreme Court is bound by the written Constitution, that's why an amendment is required to change the system.

The Pardon and Commutation powers when used correctly do serve a purpose, Trump granted Clemency to one time drug trafficker, an African American woman, Alice Johnson, who was sentenced to life imprisonment with no chance of parole, in 1996, upon her release, she had already served over 21 years in prison, an absolute excessive sentence IMO. A campaign was sought to get her released, a petition was filed for her release, while President Obama was in office. Her application was denied just before Obama left office.
Mick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2020, 13:29   #155
Damien
Remoaner
Cable Forum Team
 
Damien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 29,766
Damien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver bling
Damien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver blingDamien has a lot of silver bling
Re: Trump gets fact checked

Yeah, I think there is a role for pardons in the case of genuine injustices being corrected. Sometimes it's also used by a President to signal a change in policy. I.E Obama also pardoned a bunch of people who were serving long term sentences for drug possession who were basically caught out by the three-strikes rule. People could end up with lifetime sentences for minor drug possession charges.
Damien is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:10.


Server: curium.zmnt.uk
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.