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Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
View Poll Results: Will you be opting out of the Virgin Ad Deal?
Yes, Definitely. 958 95.51%
No, I am quite happy to share my surfing habits with anyone. 45 4.49%
Voters: 1003. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 19-02-2008, 23:03   #136
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

The thing about the terms and conditions is it contains this section:

We and/or Virgin Media Payments may at any time improve, modify, amend or alter the terms of this agreement and/or the services and their content if:

1. there is any change or amendment to any law or regulation which applies to us or Virgin Media Payments or the services we provide to you;
2. we decide that the services should be altered for reasons of quality of service or otherwise for the benefit of our customers or, in our reasonable opinion, it is necessary to do so;
3. for security, technical or operational reasons;
4. the programming or content provided to us by any of our programme and service providers is altered;
5. we decide to offer certain programmes as Pay-Per-View or programmes on demand;
6. if the changes or additions are minor and do not affect you significantly or we wish to have all our customers on the same terms and conditions; or
7. in all other events, where we reasonably determine that any modification to our system or change in our trading, operating or business practices or policy is necessary to maintain or improve the services which we provide to you.
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Old 19-02-2008, 23:14   #137
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob View Post
Looking at the vm website they have a specific address for privacy issues:

Attached is a letter I've just sent them. Anyone is welcome to copy or amend it.
Thanks Rob. You're a star. Is there a privacy issues e-mail address, or is it snail-mail only?
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Old 19-02-2008, 23:28   #138
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

I've only found the snail mail one so far:

http://allyours.virginmedia.com/html...acypolicy.html

---------- Post added at 23:28 ---------- Previous post was at 23:19 ----------

It's also worth noting Virgin Media's own Code of Practice - a plain speaking document that really can't be that much more explicit in it's wording:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Virgin Media Code of Practice Feb 08

5.8 Confidentiality of Customer Information
We will treat any information we have about you in confidence and will not disclose it to anyone except yourself, or in accordance with any instructions you have given us. However, there are circumstances in which we may be required by law to disclose information. Such requests normally come from Statutory Authorities, for example, Police Forces, Customs and Excise etc. Any such disclosure will be strictly controlled and will be made fully in accordance with current UK legislation, in particular the Data Protection Act 1998.
I specifically observe the phrase "any information"
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Old 20-02-2008, 00:25   #139
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

So their Privacy Policy contradicts their Code of Practice?

Im sure that little loophole will be altered.

Either way, if this comes into practice, then its obviously a breach of contract.
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Old 20-02-2008, 00:46   #140
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

I think that I will be saying bye bye VM soon..they never learn.
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Old 20-02-2008, 00:50   #141
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

I wonder if Watchdog will be looking into this?
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Old 20-02-2008, 00:51   #142
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

Is there any way to get out of the contract based on this news?
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Old 20-02-2008, 08:37   #143
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

Quote:
Originally Posted by petersamson View Post
Is there any way to get out of the contract based on this news?
Until it is implemented, certainly not. If it's implemented, without a robust procedure that means that the customer's information is not disclosed, then as far as I am concerned it will be a breach of contract by VM for infringement of my rights and I will vot with my feet.whether they like it or not.
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Old 20-02-2008, 08:53   #144
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

Quote:
Originally Posted by petersamson View Post
Is there any way to get out of the contract based on this news?
Wont there be an opt out? If thats the case i dont think it would be a way of getting out of contract
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Old 20-02-2008, 10:47   #145
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

That depends on whether an opt out procedure is sufficient to guarantee privacy.

Remember this is not about the display of the ads, it's the information that is being passed so the ads can be created. A cookie that blocks the ad display is thus woefully inadequate.

In any case, the extent of this invasion of privacy means that, according to every bit of guidance I can find, the spirit of the law is an opt in procedure is needed, not opt out. Unfortunately this may be a grey area where the legislation didn't quite envisage this form of transmission of electronic privacy data.
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Old 20-02-2008, 12:18   #146
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

Ekkk - This is getting all complicated... can someone please help me out.

It seems that by "opting out" at webwise that a dummy cookie is placed on your PC which will deflect all ads. Alternatively, you can block cookies from OIX.net. OK... fine with that per se.... BUT it seems that Virgin will STILL be selling my surfing habits to these Phorm characters, its just that I will be mitigating the affects by blocking cookies. This is unacceptable to me. Are Virgin offering the option for us to opt out of Virgin selling data to Phorm?

Sorry to those that get annoyed at posts like these, I have tried to follow the thing through but its too complicated for a newb like me.

THANKS
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Old 20-02-2008, 12:22   #147
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

Spleeny, that is it in a nutshell. As far as I can see your details will continue to be sold, and privacy invaded, even if you have followed the "opt out" procedure so far outlined.
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Old 20-02-2008, 13:49   #148
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

AFAIK this would be illegal under the Data Protection Act unless we give consent for it to happen. Although consent can be simply failing to reject the changes to the T&C’s.

I think I’m going to write a letter explicitly withdrawing permission to pass on my data to any third party.
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Old 20-02-2008, 14:01   #149
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob View Post
Until it is implemented, certainly not. If it's implemented, without a robust procedure that means that the customer's information is not disclosed, then as far as I am concerned it will be a breach of contract by VM for infringement of my rights and I will vot with my feet.whether they like it or not.
No offence Rob, but implemented, thinking about it, planning it etc, they (VM) DO NOT give a hoot about their customers, IF they DID, then surely some bright spark somewhere in the whole company would have bought up the fact that at the moment it is ILLEGAL for vm to pass on any of it's customers details, and IMO, as they are seriously considering this, then it just proves they will do ANYTHING and I do mean ANYTHING to make more money for themselves!

I wish I could get my hands on the no-good piece of trash at vm that agreed to this, Id shake the twerp till he couldnt do anything
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Old 20-02-2008, 14:06   #150
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Re: Virgin Media Ad Deal [Updated: See Post No. 77 & 102]

I feel sure that many people reading this topic may conclude that spying on our web usage albeit with supposed anonymity is no big deal.

I would suggest that a Google on "AOL privacy violation" will show what a mess they got themselves into when their practises became public. A 60+ year old woman was easily identified from search practises and it was the unique anonymous collection of data that pointed to her. If for example you input your full name in a genealogy search then every data entry applicable to the anonymous identifier is obviously from that individual.

For my part I care not what assurances are given of data security because there have been far too many instances of seriously important data losses and leaks from government and local authority departments to even trust them let alone a bunch of fly by night advertising sharks.

IMO it is absolutely appalling that a service provider, who already struggles to give what it charges for, should violate privacy for financial gain. The USA has been through this process (privacy intrusions) and the sharks have been thrown out just for the process to start over here. I bet we are naive and apathetic enough to let them get away with it.

The was an example of choice of targeted ads and that was Opera. Free with ads and pay for without. IMO NTL have a choice = free with ads or pay for without which of course has no chance.

I am angry because I pay a load of money for a service which is way below par and they now advocate exploitation
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