Home News Forum Articles
  Welcome back Join CF
You are here You are here: Home | Forum | Crisis in the NHS

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most of the discussions, articles and other free features. By joining our Virgin Media community you will have full access to all discussions, be able to view and post threads, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own images/photos, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please join our community today.


Welcome to Cable Forum
Go Back   Cable Forum > General Discussion > Current Affairs

Crisis in the NHS
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-02-2019, 22:25   #556
Damien
Remoaner
Cable Forum Team
 
Damien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 29,018
Damien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered stars
Damien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered stars
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carth View Post
I thought computers were going to streamline everything, and make the NHS faster and more efficient.

I guess nobody factored in the cost of new and 'improved' systems every year
. . . and then there's a TV at every bedside, many of which don't get used.

Sometimes I swear the world is going backwards in the name of progress
TBF It's likely a nightmare to build a proper, built for purpose, IT system for the entire NHS. Which isn't helped by the 'everything must be done on the cheap' tender process. We really need a NHS-wide patient database that follows us everywhere.

There is also talk of mass collecting all these records, making them anonymous, and using all the data to better inform diagnoses and treatment procedures. The NHS is uniquely positioned to do this as well. No other country, at least anywhere near our size, does their medical system this way but given the leaps we might make with large data sets we could really benefit from it.
Damien is online now   Reply With Quote
Advertisement
Old 12-02-2019, 05:35   #557
denphone
Still alive and fighting
 
denphone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: In the land of beyond and beyond.
Services: XL BB, 2 V6 boxes , XL TV.
Posts: 51,111
denphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver bling
denphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver bling
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien View Post
TBF It's likely a nightmare to build a proper, built for purpose, IT system for the entire NHS. Which isn't helped by the 'everything must be done on the cheap' tender process. We really need a NHS-wide patient database that follows us everywhere.

There is also talk of mass collecting all these records, making them anonymous, and using all the data to better inform diagnoses and treatment procedures. The NHS is uniquely positioned to do this as well. No other country, at least anywhere near our size, does their medical system this way but given the leaps we might make with large data sets we could really benefit from it.
If we go by the last NHS IT fiasco l doubt they will have another try in a hurry.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24130684

https://www.computerweekly.com/opini...-for-IT-failed
__________________
“The only lesson you can learn from history is that it repeats itself”
denphone is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-02-2019, 08:17   #558
Damien
Remoaner
Cable Forum Team
 
Damien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 29,018
Damien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered stars
Damien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered starsDamien is seeing silvered stars
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Well they will have to try again eventually. It doesn't have to be one monolithic system but there should be a NHS-wide patient database imo.
Damien is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-02-2019, 08:34   #559
denphone
Still alive and fighting
 
denphone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: In the land of beyond and beyond.
Services: XL BB, 2 V6 boxes , XL TV.
Posts: 51,111
denphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver bling
denphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver blingdenphone has a lot of silver bling
Re: Crisis in the NHS

l agree with everything you said but given the track record thus so far the chances of a decent enough NHS-wide database ever coming to fruition are not good.
__________________
“The only lesson you can learn from history is that it repeats itself”
denphone is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-02-2019, 09:52   #560
tweetiepooh
Virgin Media Employee
 
tweetiepooh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Winchester
Services: Staff MyRates BB: VM XXL TV: VM XL Phone : VM XL
Posts: 1,801
tweetiepooh has reached the bronze age
tweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze agetweetiepooh has reached the bronze age
Re: Crisis in the NHS

I used to write code for the NHS many years back and we had our own patient system, had ward terminals where staff needed to swipe a barcode on their badges to login in. It didn't store patient clinical data though we were working on that. This was all in the good old DOS days. It all worked. Each month we supplied data back to a central clearing house who passed back to the sourcing NHS districts.

Each year the government changed the format for new submissions, including extra information and each year in May we ran our export for April and submitted the new data and each year big NHS areas that had expensive turnkey systems would ask us for the old format which we couldn't do as our systems no longer had the old data.

Also there were some huge manuals that defined how data items should be stored, e.g. values for gender, date formats, codes for GP. It show what information was needed for a patient, inpatient episodes, outpatient occurrences etc. It always seems obvious to me that GP's, hospitals etc can choose what ever system they want but it has to talk "NHS speak" to the outside. So the NHS/government defines how queries are made, how incoming data is formatted, and how answers are to be formatted. The developers of the various platforms have to implement the "interface", how they do it is up to them, it's irrelevant.
__________________
I work for Virgin Media but reply here in my own right. Any help or advice is made as a best effort basis. No comments construe any obligation on VM or its employees.
tweetiepooh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-02-2019, 17:56   #561
OLD BOY
Experience is everything
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wokingham
Services: 2 V6 boxes; Full House; Now TV, Amazon and Netflix; VM broadband and landline
Posts: 9,509
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
OLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze arrayOLD BOY has a bronze array
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carth View Post

I thought computers were going to streamline everything, and make the NHS faster and more efficient.

I guess nobody factored in the cost of new and 'improved' systems every year
. . . and then there's a TV at every bedside, many of which don't get used.

Sometimes I swear the world is going backwards in the name of progress
Well, if they were capable of specifying and procuring suitable systems to operate in the NHS, computers would make a tremendous difference.

The problem is, of course, that there is a lack of good computer experts in the NHS and every new system they introduce tends to be a disaster.
OLD BOY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-02-2019, 10:15   #562
1andrew1
cf.mega poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 6,483
1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal
1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Some good news for a change
Quote:
The NHS has seen a significant rise in the number of men applying to be nurses, following a recruitment drive aimed at changing attitudes towards a career long stereotyped as female-dominated.
Hundreds more men have applied to study nursing and midwifery since the start of last summer’s NHS England campaign, a 9% increase according to Ucas, the organisation that arranges university courses.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/...-study-nursing
1andrew1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-02-2019, 11:20   #563
Mr K
Lefty Liberal Remoaner
 
Mr K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Services: TV, Phone, BB, a goldfish
Posts: 5,274
Mr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appeal
Mr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appeal
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1 View Post
It's a start but more are leaving than joining. We're losing out to other EU countries for obvious reasons. Over 40,000 nursing vacancies at the moment.
Mr K is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 24-02-2019, 11:27   #564
Carth
cf.geek
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: At the Leaving door
Posts: 954
Carth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful one
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K View Post
We're losing out to other EU countries for obvious reasons.
I'm sure you're willing to share those reasons with us
__________________
The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it - 'T. Pratchett'
Carth is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 24-02-2019, 21:19   #565
Pierre
The Dark Satanic Mills
 
Pierre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: floating in the ether
Posts: 7,602
Pierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny star
Pierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny starPierre has a nice shiny star
Re: Crisis in the NHS

I just see the NHS as a big greedy, but loveable, black Labrador. It doesn’t matter how much you feed it, it’s still hungry. It will eat and eat and eat and eat.

Until you realise, the dog isn’t the issue, it’s you. You keep feeding it all the time and you think you’re doing the right thing.

No. Check what it needs, measure your portions. Find out exactly what it needs and feed it accordingly. You’ll have a nice trim and healthier dog that can run around and play all day. instead of a fat one that everyone loves, but doesn’t Do much.
__________________
The wheel's still turning but the hamsters dead.
Pierre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-02-2019, 09:16   #566
Mr K
Lefty Liberal Remoaner
 
Mr K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Services: TV, Phone, BB, a goldfish
Posts: 5,274
Mr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appeal
Mr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appeal
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
I just see the NHS as a big greedy, but loveable, black Labrador. It doesn’t matter how much you feed it, it’s still hungry. It will eat and eat and eat and eat.

Until you realise, the dog isn’t the issue, it’s you. You keep feeding it all the time and you think you’re doing the right thing.

No. Check what it needs, measure your portions. Find out exactly what it needs and feed it accordingly. You’ll have a nice trim and healthier dog that can run around and play all day. instead of a fat one that everyone loves, but doesn’t Do much.
So you think the NHS doesn't do much is a bit of a dog ?
Mr K is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 25-02-2019, 10:13   #567
mrmistoffelees
067
 
mrmistoffelees's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Middlesbrough
Age: 43
Services: Many
Posts: 2,520
mrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appeal
mrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appealmrmistoffelees has a bronzed appeal
Re: Crisis in the NHS

There's another angle to consider in the modernization of the NHS IT systems and it sits in the primary care aspect of things.

Many years ago i was involved in Choose & Book, ETP, PACS & The Spine. I was asked to observe the training of GP's on C&B and none of them wanted it, and none of them would use it. not so sure how much have things changed. But there was a ridiculous amount of resistance to change
__________________
Nerves of steel, heart of gold, knob of butter......
mrmistoffelees is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-02-2019, 18:56   #568
Mr K
Lefty Liberal Remoaner
 
Mr K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Services: TV, Phone, BB, a goldfish
Posts: 5,274
Mr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appeal
Mr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appealMr K has a bronzed appeal
Re: Crisis in the NHS

The Germans are nicking our Polish nurses! How dare they steal our immigrants ! Tbh, they probably won't take a lot of persuading given the abuse some get here.

Quote:
'Better weather, better pay': German hospital looks to lure UK's Polish nurses. Advert offering the ‘security of an EU state’ hopes to lure nurses worried about life in the UK post-Brexit
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...y_to_clipboard
Mr K is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 28-02-2019, 19:23   #569
Carth
cf.geek
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: At the Leaving door
Posts: 954
Carth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful oneCarth is the helpful one
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K View Post
The Germans are nicking our Polish nurses! How dare they steal our immigrants ! Tbh, they probably won't take a lot of persuading given the abuse some get here.
Nothing to worry about, apparently there are millions on non europeans flooding in as we speak
__________________
The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it - 'T. Pratchett'
Carth is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 28-02-2019, 19:32   #570
1andrew1
cf.mega poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 6,483
1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal
1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal1andrew1 has a bronzed appeal
Re: Crisis in the NHS

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees View Post
There's another angle to consider in the modernization of the NHS IT systems and it sits in the primary care aspect of things.

Many years ago i was involved in Choose & Book, ETP, PACS & The Spine. I was asked to observe the training of GP's on C&B and none of them wanted it, and none of them would use it. not so sure how much have things changed. But there was a ridiculous amount of resistance to change
Yes, the reaction to suggesting email is used reflects the resistance to overdue change. Like a lot of change management, it's the people not the technology that is the hurdle.
1andrew1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 15:32.


Server: xenon.zmnt.net
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.