Coronavirus

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Why vaccinate a section of the population that don’t need it?

What’s the evidence base for your claim?

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by jfman

What’s the evidence base for your claim?

Do your own research, the evidence is clear that children do not not die or get a serious illness from any variant of COVID.

All the adult groups should be vaccinated, but to suggest we should vaccinate kids that don’t need it to protect adults that should already have had it, is bonkers.

There are still millions of adults in at risk groups globally that have still not not received a vaccine. Any vaccines should be sent to them, not to healthy western kids that don’t need it.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Do your own research, the evidence is clear that children do not not die or get a serious illness from any variant of COVID.

All the adult groups should be vaccinated, but to suggest we should vaccinate kids that don’t need it to protect adults that should already have had it, is bonkers.

There are still millions of adults in at risk groups globally that have still not not received a vaccine. Any vaccines should be sent to them, not to healthy western kids that don’t need it.

No child has died? A clearly false claim. As is the claim that children do not get serious illness.

Did you even read the JCVI advice, or is your Friday evening sojourn into the Covid thread simply another attempt to offer baseless speculation as fact, simply because you are - and have always been - opposed to vaccinating children.

There’s plenty of evidence from Israel to demonstrate the reduced risk of hospitalisation of vaccinated children compared to the unvaccinated. That’s before considering the impact on transmission.

Then again, you won’t have read that alongside your conspiracy theories in the bowels of the internet, would you?

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by jfman

No child has died?

Quite clearly not what I said, try harder to feign indignation.

As is the claim that children do not get serious illness.

Well that’s what the “science” says……..

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01897-w

The studies did not evaluate rates of less-severe illness or debilitating ‘long COVID’ symptoms that can linger months after the acute phase of the infection has past. “The low rate of severe acute disease is important news, but this does not have to mean that COVID does not matter to children,” says paediatrician Danilo Buonsenso at the Gemelli University Hospital in Rome. “Please, let’s keep attention — as much as is feasible — on immunization.”

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Quite clearly not what I said, try harder to feign indignation.

Well that’s what the “science” says……..

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01897-w

Hang on Pierre those were literally your own words.

the evidence is clear that children do not not die or get a serious illness from any variant of COVID.

A completely unqualified statement. If you meant to say “most”, “the majority”, “the vast majority” then that was notably absent from your posts.

How am I supposed to treat your “claims” with any credibility, and counter them, if you lack the ability to coherently communicate them yourself?

Thanks for sharing a link that proves a non-zero risk to children from severe infection or death. That’s very helpful.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Hugh

quote Hugh

No data, but if you can provide me data on less severe illness ( which is very much a vague term) or long Covid (equally vague) in kids, we can talk about it.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

No data

Pretty much sums up your night, Pierre.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by jfman

Hang on Pierre those were literally your own words.

Alright, I’ll put my hands up when wrong. I thought I had qualified that but I hadn’t. Quite clearly a very small number of children have died, and of that very small number and even smaller number of otherwise healthy kids.

According to the report I subsequently posted it was 2 in every 1 million…………….2 in every 1 million.

---------- Post added at 21:58 ---------- Previous post was at 21:58 ----------

Originally Posted by jfman

Pretty much sums up your night, Pierre.

I’ve got lots of data, where’s yours?

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

I’ve got lots of data

So much data you can’t even summarise the key point, evidently.

Death isn’t the only negative outcome of Covid, as I’m sure you are aware and have read extensive evidence of.

I’m sure you are also aware that the 2 in a million figure is based on using the whole population as a denominator where there were extensive period of lockdown and the vast, vast majority of children were not infected. It’s essentially a bullshit figure.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by jfman

So much data you can’t even summarise the key point, evidently

2 in 1 million……….. summarised.

Death isn’t the only negative outcome of Covid, as I’m sure you are aware and have read extensive evidence of.

I am, and as I just advised to Hugh, if you can provide “data” on those negative outcomes in regards to kids we can talk about it. So now you have an opportunity to provide your “ data”. Have about it.

Do you also think we should vaccinate U.K. and western kids before we vaccinate adults and other at risk groups globally?

Which was the thrust of my original post that as usual you chose to ignore before going off you usual malarkey

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

2 in 1 million……….. summarised.

Plucking a sentence from an article while not fully understanding it makes for a poor, but not unexpected given the author, summary.

Do you also think we should vaccinate U.K. and western kids before we vaccinate adults and other at risk groups globally?

Yes. Would you prefer we went into lockdown?

You claim to not, yet scoff at every reasonable proposal to prevent it. As the self-styled privileged Pierre, we understand you are completely unaffected by restrictions but for others it’s important that they are left behind in a sustainable (and not ideological) way.

The UK vaccines are a drop in the ocean compared to the billions the world requires. The solution is in removing the patents and increasing manufacture, not leaving western countries loitering below the herd immunity threshold and on the brink of restrictions.

Here’s something interesting:

Originally Posted by Pierre

Many people are parents, and only the most stupid don’t vaccinate their kids.

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/show...postcount=2891

I wholeheartedly agree. Who are these behavioural scientists to deny Great British parents the right to vaccinate their kids with a safe and effective vaccine.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by jfman

Plucking a sentence from an article while not fully understanding it makes for a poor, but not unexpected given the author, summary.

I understand just fine, you perpetual juvenile digs, are just that, and don’t embolden you no matter how delusionally you think they may

Yes. Would you prefer we went into lockdown?

you have data that not vaccinating children will do this. Please share?

You claim to not, yet scoff at every reasonable proposal to prevent it. As the self-styled privileged Pierre, we understand you are completely unaffected by restrictions but for others it’s important that they are left behind in a sustainable (and not ideological) way.

Juvenile dig again. I once mentioned I was lucky (and privileged through hard work) to live in a semi-rural area, work from home, and escape much of woes of lock down.

I mentioned it once, whereas you mention it virtually every time you respond to a post from me.

Which is fine, it just helps me frame who you are. Jealous, envious and insecure. You need to believe in yourself and stop lashing out people that you think are doing better than you.

I believe in you.

The UK vaccines are a drop in the ocean compared to the billions the world requires.

12.7 million under 16s in the U.K. 26million doses that could go elsewhere.

That could fully vaccinate Rwanda.

The solution is in removing the patents and increasing manufacture

There is already a manufacturing and supply line, just need to direct it, where it’s needed. Which is not at people that don’t need it

---------- Post added at 22:49 ---------- Previous post was at 22:41 ----------

Originally Posted by jfman

Here’s something interesting:

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/show...postcount=2891

I wholeheartedly agree. Who are these behavioural scientists to deny Great British parents the right to vaccinate their kids with a safe and effective vaccine.

Is that your attempt at a “ gotcha”, god that’s so sad. Also not relevant at all.

As in that post, I’m not anti-vaccine. My kids are all vaccinated because there is a verifiable medical need for them to be. For their own health.

The discussion here is if there is such a need in regards to COVID because the studies are unequivocal that the risk to health to kids is negligible.

You’re so sad.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

I understand just fine, you perpetual juvenile digs, are just that, and don’t embolden you no matter how delusionally you think they may

If you cannot see the link between lockdown and that low figure then you simply do not understand it. Upon challenge, you plucked a a single sentence out of an article that sounds good.

Juvenile dig again.

Somewhat ironic from the man who thinks everyone on furlough is sitting watching Jeremy Kyle.

Which is fine, it just helps me frame who you are. Jealous, envious and insecure. You need to believe in yourself and stop lashing out people that you think are doing better than you.

I believe in you.

Yet here you are with nothing better to do of a Friday evening that haphazardly jump into the Coronavirus thread, make spurious claims you can’t back up then double down on them.

12.7 million under 16s in the U.K. 26million doses that could go elsewhere.

That could fully vaccinate Rwanda.

There is already a manufacturing and supply line, just need to direct it, where it’s needed. Which is not at people that don’t need it

If we can’t vaccinate everyone in a reasonable timescale then we are resigned to new variants, new boosters. Until manufacturing is at 8 billion doses a year, with associated distribution chains it will be woefully inadequate.

Pretending we can just send 26 million doses to Rwanda and they’d have the infrastructure to safely store and distribute the Pfizer vaccine is folly. All those AstraZeneca vaccines on the other hand...

Is that your attempt at a “ gotcha”, god that’s so sad. Also not relevant at all.

As in that post, I’m not anti-vaccine. My kids are all vaccinated because there is a verifiable medical need for them to be. For their own health.

The discussion here is if there is such a need in regards to COVID because the studies are unequivocal that the risk to health to kids is negligible.

You’re so sad.

The studies are not unequivocal in any way, shape or form. Nor is it an attempt at a gotcha, it’s just sorry to see how you’ve slipped from a reasonably considered post into fundamentally anti-vax nonsense. For no real purpose whatsoever.

That said, it’s undoubtedly a positive that your own kids are vaccinated. I don’t see what’s problematic about extending that right to other parents.

I suspect this will be irrelevant anyway, as the Government finds evidence to justify it.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by jfman

If you cannot see the link between lockdown and that low figure then you simply do not understand it. Upon challenge, you plucked a a single sentence out of an article that sounds good.

so the fact that only 2 kids in 1 million are likely to die from COVID. What bit of that fact don’t you understand? And what is the link between lockdown and that figure as there is no causation between them. It is based on cases, regardless of lockdown.

Somewhat ironic from the man who thinks everyone on furlough is sitting watching Jeremy Kyle.

A sweeping generalisation based on my mental projection of you. If you don’t watch Jeremy Kyle, I apologise.

Yet here you are with nothing better to do of a Friday evening that haphazardly jump into the Coronavirus thread, make spurious claims you can’t back up the double down on them.

I really don’t know if you’re being super ironic, or ………………

If not, you should find an open mic spot because you’re hilarious.

If we can’t vaccinate everyone

well, back on topic, well done. The whole point of this discussion is we don’t need to vaccinate “everyone”

in a reasonable timescale then we are resigned to new variants, new boosters boosters or vaccines? I know you were confused recently Until manufacturing is at 8 billion doses a year, with associated distribution chains it will be woefully inadequate.

indeed, and until we hit level, if indeed we ever do, we should focus on vaccinating those that actually need it.

Pretending we can just send 26 million doses to Rwanda and they’d have the infrastructure to safely store and distribute the Pfizer vaccine is folly. All those AstraZeneca vaccines on the other hand...

the point is, it can go elsewhere than the U.K.

Unless you have a U.K. first agenda, which is a bit Trumpian. Unexpected even for you.

The studies are not unequivocal in any way, shape or form.

Yes, yes they are. You are, of course, free to post any study that proves healthy
Kids, under 18’s are at risk of death of COVID.

I’m sure the western world would immediately take note, you could make a name for yourself.

Nor is it an attempt at a gotcha,

. If it walks like a duck.

it’s just sorry to see how you’ve slipped from a reasonably considered post into fundamentally anti-vax nonsense. For no real purpose whatsoever.

Well the whole point was that it wasn’t anti-vax…………the opposite in fact .but hey I’m sure everyone else will understand.

That said, it’s undoubtedly a positive that your own kids are vaccinated. I don’t see what’s problematic about extending that right to other parents.

My kids are vaccinated against MMR and others. They were not vaccinated from chickenpox. Because one set can cause major issues and the other is just a mild illness but can cause scarring. If it was proven to be a fundamental necessity for the health of my child to be vaccinated from Covid, i wouldn’t hesitate. That has not been proven.