Brexit (Old) - Page 11

1andrew1 · 05-07-2018, 13:14

So, 10 years before any practical solutions in place. What will Theresa May do? Suggest we wait ten years whilst these solutions are developed and hold a referendum then? Or just call the whole thing off?

Quote:

NEW: Government circulated papers at Brexit meeting with 10 biz chiefs & key Cabinet mins on June 20, acknowledging a 5 year wait to develop customs systems... in turn told it would take a decade for a system suitable for small businesses in supply chains.

https://twitter.com/faisalislam/stat...eting-11426655

OLD BOY · 05-07-2018, 13:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

The incompetence of my guvmin is shocking. On a democratic basis, if there was to be no second referendum, one would have wanted the outcome to suit the Referendum result.

There is no doubt in my mind nor any Brexit supporters to whom I have spoken that leaving all the EU institutions is what Brexit means. Now the NI border outcome is enshrined in law and so the guvmin is unable to deliver Brexit - even if the EU were to stop saying "no".

I also have to say that Parliament is an unedifying spectacle. The main Opposition instead of mocking, should be helping; the Conservatives instead of entrenching, should back the Referendum result. I can't see a parliamentary way out of this even if May is toppled unless we hold a second Referendum.

Much as I hate the Brussels lot, I'd be almost as happy staying in and using picador sticks to keep them honest and keep the derogations we currently have.

Btw, I was never against EU freedom of movement. But I am totally against the EU Parliament having sovereignty over ours, which is the current EU policy of "ever closer union". An inner and outer EU wouldn't be a bad solution.

We're in a very difficult position. Brexit cannot now be delivered. A pity.

I think what TM is trying to prove is that 'no deal' is the only way of securing what the people of this country voted for. Brexit!

WTO, here we come! Then we wait for Brussels to crawl back, wanting to make some deals.

**Damien** · 05-07-2018, 14:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

WTO, here we come! Then we wait for Brussels to crawl back, wanting to make some deals.

I think we've overestimated our hand, hence the EU hardly coming to us in desperation. The idea that the EU will be begging for a trade deal seemed to inform our approach for the last few years and it wasn't happened.

Dave42 · 05-07-2018, 14:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

I think what TM is trying to prove is that 'no deal' is the only way of securing what the people of this country voted for. Brexit!

WTO, here we come! Then we wait for Brussels to crawl back, wanting to make some deals.

how fantasy island there OB you really need to come off it as I as said before the brexiteers be first ones to moan when country falls off cliff edge and there much worse off

denphone · 05-07-2018, 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99

In the latest development, the man who has to sell the “best of both worlds” plan that Mrs May is cooking up, says that he can't sell it

David Davis says May's new Brexit customs plan is unworkable

Davis 'tells May customs plan is unworkable' on eve of crunch Brexit meeting

Oh dear ..

Piss up in a brewery are the words that spring to mind..

Sephiroth · 05-07-2018, 14:12

Tragic (sort of) that where remainers and Brexiters meet in agreement is on the guvmin's/politicians' total incompetence.

OLD BOY · 05-07-2018, 14:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

I think we've overestimated our hand, hence the EU hardly coming to us in desperation. The idea that the EU will be begging for a trade deal seemed to inform our approach for the last few years and it wasn't happened.

Not at all. The electorate voted for Brexit - a straight divorce. It is the government that has been trying to get the best of both worlds, and why not try, indeed?

Whether or not the EU decides to sacrifice a limb so that it can feel satisfied with itself that it has given us a black eye and deterred others from attempting an escape will not alter the bright future we have outside the EU. We've done it before and we will do it again.

Industry will react positively to having the shackles of the EU removed. The government is here to aid those industries in the short term who are having difficulty in making a quick adjustment.

Sephiroth · 05-07-2018, 14:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Not at all. The electorate voted for Brexit - a straight divorce. It is the government that has been trying to get the best of both worlds, and why not try, indeed?

Whether or not the EU decides to sacrifice a limb so that it can feel satisfied with itself that it has given us a black eye and deterred others from attempting an escape will not alter the bright future we have outside the EU. We've done it before and we will do it again.

Industry will react positively to having the shackles of the EU removed. The government is here to aid those industries in the short term who are having difficulty in making a quick adjustment.

This is where we seem to disagree. Trying it on for "cake" is not the right way especially knowing what turds we would be dealing with.

**Damien** · 05-07-2018, 15:49

https://twitter.com/WikiGuido/status...72751377707014

Quote:

Number 10’s proposal is that there will be a “common rule book” between the UK and EU on all goods, including agri-foods. UK will commit by treaty to mirroring EU rules and face “consequences” if we ever seek to diverge on anything.

Lol ok

1andrew1 · 05-07-2018, 17:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

https://twitter.com/WikiGuido/status...72751377707014

Lol ok

If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck.
#BINO

---------- Post added at 17:55 ---------- Previous post was at 17:51 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

I think we've overestimated our hand, hence the EU hardly coming to us in desperation. The idea that the EU will be begging for a trade deal seemed to inform our approach for the last few years and it wasn't happened.

Absolutely and people like Old Boy are still only slowly coming to terms with this reality. Our biggest strength is money but we've not really played this card as Theresa May has been scared of the Eurosceptics.

Mr K · 05-07-2018, 18:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

https://twitter.com/WikiGuido/status...72751377707014

Lol ok

Yes that is an interesting one.

So we'll obey all the EU rules (but they'll be our own rules, honest !), but we'll face EU punishment if we divulge from them.

We'll be in a customs union but not the customs union

Well done Brexiteers, it's a revolution alright !

Can see someone in Govt. has common sense, shame about the rest of them.

ianch99 · 05-07-2018, 19:27

Andrew Neil is discussing a Spector blog that is claiming that Mrs May's "deal" will preclude a US trade deal

Breaking: James Forsyth in Spectator Coffee House: Theresa May’s Brexit paper could mean no US trade deal

I think that JRM and co. will try and bring Mrs May down over this if it true. This is their red line. Trading with the "rest of the world" is their essential hope ..

1andrew1 · 05-07-2018, 19:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by ianch99

Andrew Neil is discussing a Spector blog that is claiming that Mrs May's "deal" will preclude a US trade deal

Breaking: James Forsyth in Spectator Coffee House: Theresa May’s Brexit paper could mean no US trade deal

I think that JRM and co. will try and bring Mrs May down over this if it true. This is their red line. Trading with the "rest of the world" is their essential hope ..

Tomorrow is definitely a big day for Brexit. Can May be deposed and another leader like Rees-Mogg take over and continue the Brexit process? Or will the divisions be so great that an election is called?
What should happen is that Theresa May should instruct the moaning Eurosceptics to shut up or step down. The chances of her doing any kind of good deal with the EU are reduced every time whinging Rees-Mogg or blundering Bo Jo speaks.

Sephiroth · 05-07-2018, 20:01

If May cannot get cabinet agreement, then the matter might better be handed over to Parliament at this stage. An election should only be called if Parliament do anything more drastic that call for a second Referendum.

If the leaks about the "third way" are true, she cannot obtain agreement in Cabinet. So she's up Schmitt creek nix paddle.

What a pity that she has betrayed the Referendum result.

1andrew1 · 05-07-2018, 20:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

If May cannot get cabinet agreement, then the matter might better be handed over to Parliament at this stage. An election should only be called if Parliament do anything more drastic that call for a second Referendum.

If the leaks about the "third way" are true, she cannot obtain agreement in Cabinet. So she's up Schmitt creek nix paddle.

What a pity that she has betrayed the Referendum result.

The referendum result was a slim majority for leave, whatever that meant, not an overwhelming majority (ie 2/3) for a hard Brexit.
I contend she's honouring the referendum result.
Any hard Brexit will fail as industry will suffer in the long term and people didn't vote to be worse off.