Child grooming gang found guilty

[Russ]

Yep whatever.

[nomadking]

Telford (town of 170,000)

An investigation has claimed up to 1,000 children could have suffered in "Britain’s worst known abuse scandal" over the last 40 years - where sex gangs allegedly targeted girls as young as 11.

A police investigation called *Operation Chalice identified more than 100 potential victims abused between 2007 and 2009.
Cops also said there could be as many as 200 perpetrators – but just nine were caged and the case was then closed.

191 people missing from the crime statistics.

March 2018 The Sunday Mirror reveals there could be up to 1,000 victims of the scandal and links five deaths to the abuse.

All that in one town. As somebody in a documentary said, if you haven't cases in a town, you haven't looked.
Police were touring the takeaways at night to warn young girls.
It isn't just White girls they targeted.

Programme shown in the UK on BBC TV's 'Network East' in 1988 - report entitled 'Gang Warfare In Birmingham' - about Sikh girls and Indian girls in Birmingham,UK being targeted by Pakistani-Muslim sex gangs and attempts by the Sikh organisation 'Shere Panjab' to protect Sikh and Indian girls..............

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Russ

I saw a discussion on Twitter about this yesterday where someone pointed out that 80% of these gangs are made up of Asian men, somebody else’s replied saying “No, the common denominator is it always seem to be based in Yorkshire. It’s nothing to do with race”.

Absolute madness.

That quaint Yorkshire town of Rochdale............

[mrmistoffelees]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...-office-report

Nazir Afzal, the former chief crown prosecutor in the north-west, who brought prosecutions over the Rochdale grooming gangs, welcomed the report. “It confirms that white men remain the most common offenders, which is something rarely mentioned by rightwing commentators,” he said.

“However, it is not shy in reflecting that south Asian and British Pakistani men are disproportionately found in high-profile cases.

[nomadking]

What else could be expected when you redefine terms.

The broad definition of child sexual exploitation in gangs and groups is this:
1) gang – mainly comprising men and boys aged 13 – 25 years old, who take part in many forms of
criminal activity, such as knife crime or robbery, who can engage in violence against other gangs,
and who have identifiable markers such as territory, a name, sometimes clothing etc. While
children can be sexually exploited by a gang, this is not the reason why a gang is formed.
2) By contrast, child sexual exploitation by a group involves people who come together in person
or online for the purpose of setting up, co-ordinating and/or taking part in the sexual exploitation
of children in either an organised or opportunistic way.
...
Definition of ‘gangs’ and ‘groups’
This Inquiry is not intended to cover all models of child sexual exploitation. It focuses specifically
on child sexual exploitation linked to gangs and groups (CSEGG). The full definitions for gangs and
groups that have been used in the Inquiry are as follows:
1) Gang: A relatively durable, predominantly street-based, social group of children, young
people and, not infrequently, young adults who see themselves, and are seen by others,
as affiliates of a discrete, named group who (1) engage in a range of criminal activity and
violence, (2) identify or lay claim to territory, (3) have some form of identifying structural
feature, and (4) are in conflict with similar groups.
2) Group: Two or more people of any age, connected through formal or informal associations
or networks, including, but not exclusive to, friendship groups.

If you're going to define a "gang" as mainly being 13-25 years old, then of course the age is going to be under 30.

The "Asian gangs" come under that "group" heading and are very distinct from that definition of "gang". Again, using "Two or more people" as a measure widens the criteria, that is well outside these "Asian gangs".


Don't see how you can equate 2 paedophiles that perhaps met in prison, having just one victim, with a "gang" of 8 people with dozens of victims that are trafficked out to dozens of men. The two are not remotely similar.

The nearest non-"Asian" connection seems to be:-

Operation Lenten in North Wales started in 2014, following concerns raised by Flintshire Justice Service and Social Services about children going missing and being picked up by vans.
Offenders were known to the police for crimes such as fraud, burglary, and vehicle offences, but not for child sexual abuse and exploitation. Offenders were from a White Traveller background and in contrast to other operations we looked at, offender networks were described by law enforcement partners as tight-knit, and offending as organised rather than opportunistic.

Whilst the base studies. the report is based upon covers a very wide range of situations, it cannot be used as a whole to make these specific comparisons.

[mrmistoffelees]

So in effect you're saying that Nazir & Pritti are wrong? Is that correct?

[Carth]

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees

So in effect you're saying that Nazir & Pritti are wrong? Is that correct?

I think what he's saying is that the 'definitions' of certain criteria are so widespread that you could interpret it any way you want in order to 'prove' what you're saying . . as is usually the case

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees

So in effect you're saying that Nazir & Pritti are wrong? Is that correct?

It's yet another report that has been misapplied.
Not long ago another report on gun crime came out. Yet again it was misused. The term "gun crime" covers an awful lot, ranging from marginally unsafe storage of validly registered shotguns to ownership and use to kill, in connection with several fully automatic weapons. Hardly the same are they? Yet they were conveniently lumped together to dilute the number of those responsible for the more serious gun crimes.
This misuse of reports and studies has been happening for some time. They widen the scope of definitions to include as many people as possible when there actually distinct groups.

A classic example is use of the term BAME, to avoid separating out the distinct parts of that group. Use in this context of the term "Asian" is also misleading, not many Sikhs, Hindus, Chinese, Japanese etc, involved.

You would expect the majority of offenders to be white in a country that is 90% white.

If you read the report (or skim it) they don't make any real other insights into if one group is overrepresented due to poor data collection.

Still, I think this is better than basing your impression on media reports.

[Pierre]

http://news.sky.com/story/calderdale...ictim-12304695

I don’t know if this is a new one or a re-reporting of an existing one. I live in Calderdale so think I would have known about it.

Anyway, same old same old.

I wonder if those gentlemen that demonstrated outside Batley Grammar schools so passionately about the effect of their children being exposed to pictures of Mohammed will do so for a child raped by the worshippers of Mohammed?*


* that is an assumption on my part, but I expect to be accurate.

[Julian]

IT CONTINUES

[Mad Max]

Originally Posted by Pierre

http://news.sky.com/story/calderdale...ictim-12304695

I don’t know if this is a new one or a re-reporting of an existing one. I live in Calderdale so think I would have known about it.

Anyway, same old same old.

I wonder if those gentlemen that demonstrated outside Batley Grammar schools so passionately about the effect of their children being exposed to pictures of Mohammed will do so for a child raped by the worshippers of Mohammed?*


* that is an assumption on my part, but I expect to be accurate.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by Damien

You would expect the majority of offenders to be white in a country that is 90% white.

If you read the report (or skim it) they don't make any real other insights into if one group is overrepresented due to poor data collection.

Still, I think this is better than basing your impression on media reports.

I think an easy way to demonstrate this is to do a Google search for "Grooming gang in court" and see how many pages you need to go back through before you find such a gang made up of predominantly white men.

You're kind of left with 2 possible scenarios: that Google is involved in a wide-scale conspiracy to ensure only Asian-based gangs show highest in the rankings, or that the overwhelming number of these grooming gangs involve Asian-heritage men.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Russ

I think an easy way to demonstrate this is to do a Google search for "Grooming gang in court" and see how many pages you need to go back through before you find such a gang made up of predominantly white men.

You're kind of left with 2 possible scenarios: that Google is involved in a wide-scale conspiracy to ensure only Asian-based gangs show highest in the rankings, or that the overwhelming number of these grooming gangs involve Asian-heritage men.

"Asian"? How many Japanese, Chinese, Russian, Mongolian, Korean, etc are involved? The common factor isn't being "Asian".


As the somebody in a documentary a while back said, "If you haven't found a similar gang in a town, you haven't looked".

[Russ]

It’s because I find it easier to type “Asian” than “Indian/Pakistani/Bangladeshi” etc.