23-12-2018, 20:53
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#5596
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The Invisible Woman
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: between Portsmouth and Southampton.
Age: 71
Services: VM XL TV,50 MB VM BB,VM landline, Tivo
Posts: 40,159
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone
There is nothing silly about important UK policies being ignored and put on the back burner because of Brexit.
l am more interested in these important policies and how we can improve things in these important areas for the people of this country rather then a internecine civil war in both HMG and the opposition which is effectively putting most of these important policies on the back burner until this Brexit shambles is sorted out which might be never..
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__________________
Hell is empty and all the devils are here. Shakespeare..
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23-12-2018, 20:55
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#5597
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Architect of Ideas
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,232
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Re: Brexit
Well... someone brought blue passports into the conversation which can only be for nostalgia. Even though Croatia use blue and are in the EU.
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23-12-2018, 21:13
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#5598
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The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: floating in the ether
Posts: 11,985
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mick
By the same token - whenever we see a scare story from the Project fear department, they need to back up their "opinion".
Works both ways.
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Funny that isn’t it, a recent example on here, just last night, is proof that is sometimes difficult to achieve !
__________________
The wheel's still turning but the hamsters dead.
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23-12-2018, 21:58
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#5599
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cf.mega pornstar
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,782
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carth
Not much different than most of the stuff linked to by the remain camp then, just somebodies opinion . .
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Every one has an opinion, doesn't make them right. It's a strange quirk occurring at the moment that hauliers who go to Switzerland and experience delays at the border are treated the same as some berk who has never left Coventry and given the same amount of air time on telly to espouse their views.
Someone else's opinion that's been ignored is Patrick Minford who said manufacturing would largely be eliminated post brexit, wonder who voted for that? I do kind of get the Minford ignoring though to be fair, he has been wrong before after all, let's hope he is again for the sake of them oop north
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23-12-2018, 23:17
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#5600
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,188
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDaddy
Someone else's opinion that's been ignored is Patrick Minford who said manufacturing would largely be eliminated post brexit, wonder who voted for that? I do kind of get the Minford ignoring though to be fair, he has been wrong before after all, let's hope he is again for the sake of them oop north
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Now 75, Patrick Minford tends to be heard through Economists for Free Trade (formerly Economists for Brexit).
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23-12-2018, 23:19
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#5601
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cf.mega pornstar
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,782
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1
Now 75, Patrick Minford tends to be heard through Economists for Free Trade (formerly Economists for Brexit).
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That's him, smug Jacob's pal
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24-12-2018, 02:39
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#5602
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cf.geek
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 956
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
Funny that isn’t it, a recent example on here, just last night, is proof that is sometimes difficult to achieve !
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Post 5565 is a prime example of why it's hard to achieve and is the reason I didn't want to take part in that debate. I was making one point and that was all.
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24-12-2018, 02:49
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#5603
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Architect of Ideas
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,232
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mythica
Post 5565 is a prime example of why it's hard to achieve and is the reason I didn't want to take part in that debate. I was making one point and that was all.
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Indeed.
Dismissing possibilities that are “could” out of hand on that basis ignores one important element which is “likelihood”. If 100 things are in a list of bad things that could reasonably happen it’d take a stroke of luck for none to happen.
Similarly we “could” strike excellent trade deals outside the EU with no evidence we will.
It’s obvious the leave campaign has one last stand which is to deny a public vote on the basis it’s anti-democratic and fight for the same outcome. Engaging in the merits of leaving or remaining is a recipe for defeat.
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24-12-2018, 09:51
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#5604
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Simples
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: RG41
Services: 1 Gbps; Hub 4 MM; ASUS RT-AX88U; Ultimate VOLT. BT Infinity2; Devolo 1200AV
Posts: 11,955
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman
Indeed.
Dismissing possibilities that are “could” out of hand on that basis ignores one important element which is “likelihood”. If 100 things are in a list of bad things that could reasonably happen it’d take a stroke of luck for none to happen.
Similarly we “could” strike excellent trade deals outside the EU with no evidence we will.
It’s obvious the leave campaign has one last stand which is to deny a public vote on the basis it’s anti-democratic and fight for the same outcome. Engaging in the merits of leaving or remaining is a recipe for defeat.
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The usual ploy to use democracy to usurp democracy. We had a Referendum in 2016 and the government of the day committed to implement the result. It was even in their pamphlet:
https://assets.publishing.service.go...for-the-uk.pdf
"This is your decision. The Government will implement what you decide."
__________________
Seph.
My advice is at your risk.
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24-12-2018, 11:38
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#5605
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: At the Leaving door
Posts: 4,050
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman
It’s obvious the leave campaign has one last stand which is to deny a public vote on the basis it’s anti-democratic
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One last stand? . . you make it sound like a 1956 western
It's obvious that Leave won the referendum, and just as obvious that Remain are trying every trick in the book to overturn the result.
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24-12-2018, 11:39
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#5606
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Architect of Ideas
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,232
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth
The usual ploy to use democracy to usurp democracy. We had a Referendum in 2016 and the government of the day committed to implement the result. It was even in their pamphlet:
https://assets.publishing.service.go...for-the-uk.pdf
"This is your decision. The Government will implement what you decide."
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This is the other trick: to imply that a further democratic vote is undemocratic. Which is impossible. It’s by definition an exercise in democracy.
David Cameron’s Government ceased to exist when he resigned. The Conservative Party further rolled the dice and lost out. They shouldn’t make promises they can’t keep, I agree, but it’s foolish to bind ourselves to that document unnecessarily on that basis.
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24-12-2018, 12:37
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#5607
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Woke and proud !
Join Date: Jun 2004
Services: TV, Phone, BB, a wife
Posts: 9,110
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth
The usual ploy to use democracy to usurp democracy. We had a Referendum in 2016 and the government of the day committed to implement the result. It was even in their pamphlet:
https://assets.publishing.service.go...for-the-uk.pdf
"This is your decision. The Government will implement what you decide."
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Do we upsurp democracy every time we have a general election ? Soon be 2019, 3 years since the Brexit vote, the electorate and opinions change, they are probably a lot more informed now than they were during the campaign of lies.
Hate and division seems to be the bright new future, I despair at the way the country is going, and not just because of Brexit. Poverty is increasing as are the number of homeless dying. Austerity and selfish attitude of many has taken its toll. Brexit is going to make things worse I'm afraid with an increasing rich/poor divide. Areas of the country that benefitted from EU help ie. most outside the SE, will be hit hard. Boris and Jacob will be ok though...
Anyway, let's have a Brexit armistice for Xmas ! Peace and goodwill to all men and all that cobblers ! I'm off for a walk in the sunshine to desperately try and think of happy things
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24-12-2018, 12:45
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#5608
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,188
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Re: Brexit
Happy Christmas one and all on the Brexit thread. I may not have agreed with everything everyone said but it wouldn't be a debate otherwise!
Thanks to the moderators for their hard work in keeping us all in check and here's to a good break and interesting 2019.
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24-12-2018, 12:54
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#5609
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Simples
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: RG41
Services: 1 Gbps; Hub 4 MM; ASUS RT-AX88U; Ultimate VOLT. BT Infinity2; Devolo 1200AV
Posts: 11,955
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman
This is the other trick: to imply that a further democratic vote is undemocratic. Which is impossible. It’s by definition an exercise in democracy.
David Cameron’s Government ceased to exist when he resigned. The Conservative Party further rolled the dice and lost out. They shouldn’t make promises they can’t keep, I agree, but it’s foolish to bind ourselves to that document unnecessarily on that basis.
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Another Remain contrivance. It's the public who voted to leave the EU. That binding vote has to be delivered by May's continuity government.
Btw, no vote is undemocratic; it's the use of democracy to usurp democracy that's undemocratic.
__________________
Seph.
My advice is at your risk.
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24-12-2018, 12:58
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#5610
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Architect of Ideas
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,232
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Re: Brexit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth
Another Remain contrivance. It's the public who voted to leave the EU. That binding vote has to be delivered by May's continuity government.
Btw, no vote is undemocratic; it's the use of democracy to usurp democracy that's undemocratic.
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It wasn’t binding. It was unconstitutional, and unfortunate, for Cameron to give that impression. No matter how many people believed it has no legal effect.
Democracy can never usurp democracy in our Parliamentary system. It’s impossible for a second vote to be unlawful if this Parliament enables it.
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