Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

[davews]

Originally Posted by SimonHickling

Well the latest contact I have been given form BT just answered some questions. I have no explicit agreement to quote, so the gist of it was to avoid profiling

1. Use HTTPS
2. Use HTTP authentication
3. Block Googlebot
4. Tell us what your sites are an prove you are the owner.

I have replied as follows and copied my MP in for good measure. My MP has so far seemed quite supportive on the issue, but we'll see how it goes.


If anyone would care to provide anything they think worth mentioning in the next installment, I'm open to suggestions.

And you can add to your comments:

None of those methods are available to those who use free hosting provided by their ISP (ie BTOpenworld/Geocities/NTLWorld etc). We have no facility to use https or set up robots.txt.

(I have just noticed that one of the sites I am responsible for hosted elsewhere can be accessed by https. But that comes with a drawback in that the supplier of the space has a self-signed certificate which flags an insecure warning in many browsers. Nothing I can do about it myself but complain to the hoster, but people have already been doing that for years and failed to get it changed. I would prefer my visitors not to be put off by a certificate warning outside my own control..).

[mark777]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&id=714031

Vote it UP!

Alexander Hanff

Given the discussion a few days ago about digg and sandboxes, should we be doing this by clicking on the URL or should we be pasting it into a new browser window?

[AlexanderHanff]

Might be safer to do it straight from the browser as opposed to clicking.

Alexander Hanff

[popper]

Originally Posted by mark777

"EU mulls intervention over BT's secret Phorm trials"

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/06...t_phorm_trial/

---------- Post added at 14:21 ---------- Previous post was at 14:17 ----------



There had to be something hitting the share price.

LOL, we even got a direct cable forum thread URL reference directly on the main story.

thats good for driving the information home to new readers.

[SimonHickling]

Originally Posted by davews

And you can add to your comments:

None of those methods are available to those who use free hosting provided by their ISP (ie BTOpenworld/Geocities/NTLWorld etc). We have no facility to use https or set up robots.txt.

(I have just noticed that one of the sites I am responsible for hosted elsewhere can be accessed by https. But that comes with a drawback in that the supplier of the space has a self-signed certificate which flags an insecure warning in many browsers. Nothing I can do about it myself but complain to the hoster, but people have already been doing that for years and failed to get it changed. I would prefer my visitors not to be put off by a certificate warning outside my own control..).

Just sent this :

I've just realised that none of your options are available on many ISP "free" hosting. The robots.txt is held at the root level, https would only be available if the ISP provided it and made it the only way of accessing and many ISPs do not provide the option for http authentication to the users' folders.

Simon

[Rchivist]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

And yes, everyone should send a postal letter to Commissioner Reding applauding the news and reiterating their concerns over ICO's inaction on this issue and the wider issue of Phorm as a whole.

We have the ball in our court now, we are very much in the game and we need to take advantage of this news to make sure the Commissioner knows that this is a major public issue and not just a bunch of geeks whining.

Please, if ever there was a crucial time to write a real letter, now IS that time.

Alexander Hanff

Done -email converted to paper letter.

And request copied over to BT Beta, with a short list of relevant urls to include.

[AlexanderHanff]

Send your letters directly to her office at the EU Commission:

Viviane Reding
Member of the European Commission
BE-1049 Brussels
Belgium


Alexander Hanff

[Deko]

Mr Hanff

it would appear you can now say what you like about BT/PHorm as long as you make it too complicated to be understood by numptys

[Rchivist]

Originally Posted by Deko

Mr Hanff

it would appear you can now say what you like about BT/PHorm as long as you make it to complicated to be explained to anyone.

BTCustomers have known that for years - we experience that in every single communication with email or telephone support or complaint departments. Quite frequently with senior management too. We always seem to know more than they do, despite their Stealth management style.

---------- Post added at 17:25 ---------- Previous post was at 17:23 ----------

Originally Posted by SimonHickling

Just sent this :

Re: the ISP hosted webspace. I asked them that about a month ago - it was about the time Emma and I stopped writing to each other.

Never did get a reply. Think I heard the sound of a "doh!" as they read the email though.

[Dephormation]

Originally Posted by R Jones

What's the Error Console Pete? - I've got 2.1 version.

Sorry - should have explained... (Ctrl+Shift+J) or Tools menu, Error Console... (and click on Messages tab).

Its the same content you see in the log files, but without the hassle of loading the log file. Very handy if you want a quick double check. Doesn't require logging to be switched on.

[Rchivist]

Originally Posted by Dephormation

Sorry - should have explained... (Ctrl+Shift+J) or Tools menu, Error Console... (and click on Messages tab).

Its the same content you see in the log files, but without the hassle of loading the log file. Very handy if you want a quick double check. Doesn't require logging to be switched on.

Ta. Luvly jubbly.

[Dephormation]

Viviane Reding's web site is interesting; she has got a good grasp of the principles involved, and the issues at stake.

Makes Richard Thomas ICO web site look a bit rubbish. 'My first web site, with pictures, by Richard age 3'.

[mark777]

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&id=714031

Vote it UP!

Alexander Hanff

Bumping this forward.

If, like me, you have not used this before, it's the +/- to the left of the article title that you want, after you have registered. (Took me ages to work out!)

Please correct me if i'm wrong, as it means i've not voted yet.

(It's a b awful, unintuitive site imho)

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff

I got an email this evening. Emma is "disappointed" that I have declined to remove the comments about them misleading ICO...

Alexander Hanff

Disappointed eh? I bet she is. Probably a lot more than "disapponted" too!!!

Did BT mislead the ICO? You might very well say that my friend, but I... I could not possibly comment.

Hank

---------- Post added at 18:58 ---------- Previous post was at 18:39 ----------

Originally Posted by Dephormation

If Phorm spokesman Alex Laity said "we did go to the Home Office before launch" then he could not have been talking about the trials in 2006/7 because Simon Watkin at the Home Office said the following to me in an FoI response;

- Whether the Home Office were made aware of the secret trials conducted by Phorm in 2006/7

It wasn’t.

- Whether the Home Office authorised secret trials conducted by Phorm in 2006/7

The Home Office was not aware of the trials/tests.

- When you first started advising BT and Phorm (and other ISPs)

Asked for a view we gave that view to all parties who asked for it on or after 4 February 2008.

Phorm did not, repeat DID NOT, advise the Home Office before trialling the software in 2006/7. I'm still hopeful we might get more information about the Home Office involvement prior to the public announcement on February 14 2008.

Pete

Are you quoting the ICO / HO directly? Could they get away with questions about "Phorm" which refer to the time pre-their incarnation (i.e. when they were still 121media).

Hank

---------- Post added at 19:00 ---------- Previous post was at 18:58 ----------

Originally Posted by jelv

I've been using Google Alerts to monitor postings in any groups containing "webwise" or "phorm". What is very pleasing to see is that they are cropping up in more and more different groups - many to do with security. If Phorm's PR team were aiming to contain and manage "information" in the hope that in a few weeks the storm will have died down they have to date failed dismally!

Aye... and the reason they have failed so dismally is because there are soooo many more of us than they could afford to hire from PR agencies

In the battle for hearts and minds the ones on the right side of the law and "doing the right things" will win.

Hank

---------- Post added at 19:04 ---------- Previous post was at 19:00 ----------

Originally Posted by tarka

I have noticed getting the odd blank page when browsig too (I'm with BT but no longer tied in to a contract). The only site I can remember it happening on was cableforum when I have refreshed a page but it has happened on other sites. I didn't think anything of it until it was brought up here.

I had this too (and I am with BT - it started last night on Facebook) browser loading but blank pages when complete - I had to refresh to get it to re-get the page. Most times that sorted it out. It happened about 6 or 8 times in an hour or two. About 8:30 to 10pm.

Hmmm, have we spotted something significant perhaps?

Hank

[warescouse]

Originally Posted by Hank

cut...
I had this too (and I am with BT - it started last night on Facebook) browser loading but blank pages when complete - I had to refresh to get it to re-get the page. Most times that sorted it out. It happened about 6 or 8 times in an hour or two. About 8:30 to 10pm.

Hmmm, have we spotted something significant perhaps?

Hank

As I have mentioned before (but ignored). Somebody who has a little time please run Google Maps under packet analysis and compare a BT connection with another none BT one.

There are so many Ajax type calls going on under Google maps on one single page call, I have a strong gut feeling it would show up any Phorming going on in a comparison. Don't forget BT for all we know could be testing the system right now without servicing any advert behaviour. They could be part testing simple redirects etc without the full Webwise / Phorm system in place.

That's what I would do in any stage one. Test as much as you can before the full roll-out. They could do some testing that could be within some legal boundaries, just to test latencies etc.