Coronavirus

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Hom3r

This picture helps explain mask wearing simply

Well, if that’s the best they can do, it’s a pretty piss poor show, if you ask me.

---------- Post added at 20:30 ---------- Previous post was at 20:29 ----------

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

As an unqualified truth, you're right.

But before Covid there were ordinary colds that were caught through contagion. Not much staying indoors, no masks, no preaching.

That's where we should be now.

There’s a big difference between colds and Covid. A better comparison is flu.

---------- Post added at 20:35 ---------- Previous post was at 20:30 ----------

Originally Posted by jfman

How does anyone know without testing? What financial support is in place for those who have to isolate under your banner of "common sense"?

They don't.
None.

Thus completely unworkable.

As for Government dictats why is Boris on the front of the Daily Mail telling "millions" to get back to the office? I presume you oppose this call - it's for people and businesses to decide how they best work. Freedom, innit?

The government introduced the panic, and now they have to defuse it.

I think most people are intelligent enough to know when they have Covid-like symptoms, and with the government’s continuation of the 28-day rule for requiring a medical certificate for sickness absence, there is no excuse to go out there infecting everyone else.

Of course people should go back to the office. What’s stopping them?

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

There’s a big difference between colds and Covid. A better comparison is flu.

Not for everyone.

One of my daughters had a bit of a cold (or so she thought).
She did a test (work asked her to, and provided the test). It was positive.

She had nothing more than mild cold symptoms for a couple of days, and then was fine.

Everyone in my house has had it, except me, I seem to be immune, despite being sounded by the infected multiple times !

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

<SNIP>

There’s a big difference between colds and Covid. A better comparison is flu.
<SNIP>

In my personal experience, not with the Omicron variant. Most people I know who contracted Omicron suffered no more than a cold of double duration, the dominant feature being a runny nose.

[nffc]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Of course people should go back to the office. What’s stopping them?

Fundamentally nothing, but I know of plenty of companies who, deciding on how to cut costs during the pandemic (not that some people need a reason) have opted to reduce office space and in some cases remove whole offices, meaning the desk capacity is no longer sufficient to accommodate if every single office worker wanted to come in on a particular day.


Offices are becoming hot-desks which has downsides for storing kit, ergonomics, etc etc.



Boris can say what he likes, but they ushered it in (and were on about it pre-covid); flexible/hybrid working is here to stay, and the benefits in travelling times help the environment too, if someone doesn't have to travel any distance into work that's less traffic and less pollution, when the job can be done sufficiently from home. Doing this also makes it easier for those who can't of course.


I think that a fair amount of office workers will still (semi-permanently) be going into the office some days a week, maybe 2 or 3, and maybe when certain meetings take place, doing the rest from home, where this previously was five. The pandemic has shown most of us can do this. Personally I feel I work better from home as opposed to a busier, noisier office, it's quieter.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by nffc

Fundamentally nothing, but I know of plenty of companies who, deciding on how to cut costs during the pandemic (not that some people need a reason) have opted to reduce office space and in some cases remove whole offices, meaning the desk capacity is no longer sufficient to accommodate if every single office worker wanted to come in on a particular day.


Offices are becoming hot-desks which has downsides for storing kit, ergonomics, etc etc.



Boris can say what he likes, but they ushered it in (and were on about it pre-covid); flexible/hybrid working is here to stay, and the benefits in travelling times help the environment too, if someone doesn't have to travel any distance into work that's less traffic and less pollution, when the job can be done sufficiently from home. Doing this also makes it easier for those who can't of course.


I think that a fair amount of office workers will still (semi-permanently) be going into the office some days a week, maybe 2 or 3, and maybe when certain meetings take place, doing the rest from home, where this previously was five. The pandemic has shown most of us can do this. Personally I feel I work better from home as opposed to a busier, noisier office, it's quieter.

... until the kids get home from school/nursery!

[nffc]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

... until the kids get home from school/nursery!

True point, but I don't have/want smellies so that doesn't really affect me

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

The government introduced the panic, and now they have to defuse it.

The pandemic introduced the panic on a global scale, I’m not sure the current government have the competence to introduce panic.

I think most people are intelligent enough to know when they have Covid-like symptoms, and with the government’s continuation of the 28-day rule for requiring a medical certificate for sickness absence, there is no excuse to go out there infecting everyone else.

That is only helpful for anyone getting sick pay and ignores the attendance management policies of many companies that - if you got infected twice a year and took a week off - would penalise “common sense”.

Of course people should go back to the office. What’s stopping them?

Efficiency?

I’m surprised that give your supposed love of freedom - and trust in people to demonstrate common sense - that you lack the trust in people, their managers and their organisations to determine their most appropriate work location.

Why is this worthy of government dictat but not public health?

There’s no going back to 2019, ever. For the man with the 2035 vision of the future I’m surprised working practices look like 1995.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by jfman

The pandemic introduced the panic on a global scale, I’m not sure the current government have the competence to introduce panic.



That is only helpful for anyone getting sick pay and ignores the attendance management policies of many companies that - if you got infected twice a year and took a week off - would penalise “common sense”.



Efficiency?

I’m surprised that give your supposed love of freedom - and trust in people to demonstrate common sense - that you lack the trust in people, their managers and their organisations to determine their most appropriate work location.

Why is this worthy of government dictat but not public health?

There’s no going back to 2019, ever. For the man with the 2035 vision of the future I’m surprised working practices look like 1995.

I should imagine all office workers will be at home by 2035 doing nothing and not earning anything as AI will be doing the jobs they had and robots for the manual workers.

Universal Credit will turn into Universal Income and the perverbial shit will hit the fan.

Interesting times ahead I doubt I'll live to see it though.

[tweetiepooh]

Well I'll be 70 in 2035 but since retirement age by then will be 85 still plugging away at something they don't or can't trust to automation yet.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by tweetiepooh

Well I'll be 70 in 2035 but since retirement age by then will be 85 still plugging away at something they don't or can't trust to automation yet.

But at least by 2035 you will be able to cash in your pension, downsize your house and enjoy a fully electric, self-driving, French car.

[tweetiepooh]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

But at least by 2035 you will be able to cash in your pension, downsize your house and enjoy a fully electric, self-driving, French car.

Pensions will be reduced by some factor yet to be arranged. State pension age is now 80. House is not that big anyway and being good parents want somewhere to host visits. Don't trust French self driving car not to go all revolutionary and start to drive on the wrong side of the road. Hydrogen fuel much better idea than electric.

[1andrew1]

Didn't realise the scale of this inquiry.

The damning testimony NHS staff have submitted to the Covid inquiry

The Covid inquiry, yet to get underway, is likely to be the biggest public inquiry in terms of disclosure, ever. It is also likely to take several years to complete. Millions of documents will be combed through and testimonies listened to in order to establish the country’s preparedness and response to the coronavirus pandemic....

Some of the main findings that will be submitted to the inquiry are:

• Many medics think "healthcare workers died due to insufficient PPE".
• They feel they were "systematically exposed to Covid without being able to properly mitigate the risk".
• The chronic lack of staffing is said to have "left the medical profession too often exposed, suggesting not all deaths were inevitable".
• Some believe had the NHS "gone into the pandemic with more staff, it's possible deaths in the profession may have been lower."
• Doctors surveyed found nearly half of the respondents thought risk assessments were either "mostly or completely ineffective".
• One recalls the risk assessment being "just an arbitrary piece of paper to be filled in to make people feel they were doing something when in all honesty ethnic minorities were dying more".
• Doctors "have been left exhausted, demoralised and unwell".

https://www.itv.com/news/2022-05-18/...-covid-inquiry

[Pierre]

A few important words

Think, feel, is said, thought, suggesting

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

A few important words

Think, feel, is said, thought, suggesting

No more clap for the NHS, let's just deny their lived experience.

The evidence is already out there - downgrading of the need for FFP3 or equivalent masks to surgical masks on the basis of lack of supply, as opposed to the appropriateness of their use.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by jfman

let's just deny their lived experience.

Lived experience, you’re a bit late to the party jumping on that expression.

“Lived Experience” (what other experience is there?) Is subjective. It is a persons perception of an event. A report must deal in facts and only facts.

I don’t deny their experience, but it comes with an articulated lorry full of bias.

If I was in court, I would not want to be convicted on how someone felt. This inquiry could indeed lead to more serious actions if it is found that anyone was criminally negligent.

So, I don’t deny their “lived experience” I just don’t factor it, into any report.