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Brexit Development(s) Discussion
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Old 29-10-2019, 20:26   #1786
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by Chris View Post
At least half a dozen of the ones still expelled from the party are those who voted for Stella Creasey’s thoroughly pointless amendment this afternoon. They’re the usual hard remainer contingent, Ken Clarke, Guto Bebb etc.
They're not worth keeping,they put people off voting Tory.
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Old 29-10-2019, 21:04   #1787
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

I am going to vote for the STUFF-IT PARTY...
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Old 29-10-2019, 21:05   #1788
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
This Parliament has overstepped it’s remit. The legislators have taken on the role of the executive. In any other Parliament a vote of no confidence would have been taken on this government and a GE would have been undertaken months ago.

This Parliament is not fit for purpose.


You can’t have another democratic exercise on that question as the result of the first democratic exercise has not been undertaken.

The opposition parties demanded a GE because May had not won a GE and May duly agreed because she thought she’d walk it. Parliament, you know that great democratic institution voted for a GE.

Funny that Johnson, also not elected via a GE, and Parliament think that’s fine, and won’t test him in a GE? Go figure.

there’s no rules anymore. Bercow and the remainer Parliament have ripped up the conventions. We need a new speaker and a new Parliament.
Eh?

What actually happened...
Quote:
When Theresa May announced on 18 April that she planned to call a "snap" general election, it surprised almost everyone.

It had been only two years since the last UK-wide poll, won by Mrs May's predecessor, David Cameron. And under the relatively recent Fixed-Term Parliaments Act, another general election had not been due until 2020.

On top of that, when she had been asked whether she was tempted to capitalise on her healthy poll ratings and go to the country, Mrs May had given an emphatic "no".

"I think the next election will be in 2020... I'm not going to be calling a snap election" she told the BBC's Andrew Marr in September 2016 .

But that all seemed to change over the course of the Easter break.

As Britain went back to work on the day after Easter Monday, Mrs May stood on the steps of Downing Street to deliver her surprise call for an election.

Her stated reason was to strengthen her hand in Brexit negotiations. With official Brexit talks with the EU due to start in mid-June, Mrs May claimed Labour, the SNP and the Lib Dems would try to destabilise and frustrate the process in Parliament.

"If we do not hold a general election now, their political game-playing will continue," Mrs May said in her address to the country, "and the negotiations with the European Union will reach their most difficult stage in the run-up to the next scheduled election."
Senior Tories had urged Mrs May to call an early election, taking advantage of the Conservatives' healthy opinion poll lead over Jeremy Corbyn's Labour.

Her statement does not mention "opposition parties demanding an election", nor can I find anything to support that proposition.

Nice try at revising history/reality, though...
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Old 29-10-2019, 21:12   #1789
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

On the other hand, she was absolutely right about the opposition parties attempting to destabilise the process. It’s just a pity that

1. She completely boleauxed up the election
and
2. So weakened herself that the hardliners on her own backbench (on both sides of the Brexit divide) decided to use the chaos to try to push her towards their own favoured outcome.
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Old 29-10-2019, 21:26   #1790
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris View Post
On the other hand, she was absolutely right about the opposition parties attempting to destabilise the process. It’s just a pity that

1. She completely boleauxed up the election
and
2. So weakened herself that the hardliners on her own backbench (on both sides of the Brexit divide) decided to use the chaos to try to push her towards their own favoured outcome.
Agreed, but that’s not what Pierre stated.

---------- Post added at 20:26 ---------- Previous post was at 20:16 ----------

12th of December it is then.
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Old 29-10-2019, 21:49   #1791
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
12th of December it is then.
Corbyn vs Boris?

or

Libs (stay) vs Farage (leave)?

Or a mishmash that will result in a hung parliament with no-one willing to do deals?
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Old 29-10-2019, 22:33   #1792
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Agreed, but that’s not what Pierre stated.

---------- Post added at 20:26 ---------- Previous post was at 20:16 ----------

12th of December it is then.
After a lot of pointless posturing over the date and a very silly attempt to change the age of franchise (which is in itself worthy of serious consideration but obviously not something to be thrown around right now).

And the 438 votes in favour must surely be very close to the two thirds majority that would have carried it yesterday? Truly this parliament has become a joke and makes a laughing stock of its own high reputation and history. It needs thoroughly hosing down.
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Old 29-10-2019, 23:15   #1793
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris View Post
After a lot of pointless posturing over the date and a very silly attempt to change the age of franchise (which is in itself worthy of serious consideration but obviously not something to be thrown around right now).

And the 438 votes in favour must surely be very close to the two thirds majority that would have carried it yesterday? Truly this parliament has become a joke and makes a laughing stock of its own high reputation and history. It needs thoroughly hosing down.
67.4% of all 650 MPs.
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Old 30-10-2019, 01:10   #1794
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by Chris View Post
“I’d rather” is an expression of how one feels about certain things, not a commitment to do one or the other.

Besides, he’s trying very hard to implicate Parliament as the cause of the delay, rather than he himself.
Were any of these commitments?

We are getting ready to come out on October the 31st...Do or die, come what may” (25 June, TalkRadio interview)

“Kick the can again and we kick the bucket, my friends, that's the sad reality" (27 June, Tory leadership hustings)

“We are going to fulfil the repeated promises of Parliament to the people and come out of the EU on October 31, no ifs or buts” (25 July, first speech as Prime Minister)

“There are no circumstances in which I will ask Brussels to delay. We are leaving on 31 October, no ifs or buts” (2 September, speaking in Downing Street)

“I am confident of getting a deal. We will leave on 31 October in all circumstances. There will be no further pointless delay.” (3 September, speech in Commons)

"I will not negotiate a delay with the EU and neither does the law compel me to do so” (19 October, speech in Commons)
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Old 30-10-2019, 08:03   #1795
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 View Post
Here's a Boris policy that is toxic:

Trump’s Plan For The NHS: Channel 4 Dispatches



Oh dear, the truth is coming out just in time ...
If you actually read the report, it is Trump's policy, not BJ's. If the report is correct, that is.

Government response:

In a statement to Dispatches, the Department for International Trade said: “The NHS is not, and never will be, for sale to the private sector, whether overseas or domestic‎…The sustainability of the NHS is an absolute priority for the government. We could not agree to any proposals on medicines pricing or access that would put NHS finances at risk or reduce clinician and patient choice.”


Last edited by OLD BOY; 30-10-2019 at 08:10.
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Old 30-10-2019, 09:10   #1796
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Eh?

Nice try at revising history/reality, though...
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/142900...eliver-brexit/

Quote:
But Labour and Lib Dem MPs called for an immediate General Election, claiming voters must have the final say on whether Mrs May should be in No10.
Theresa May set to be UK PM after Andrea Leadsom quits http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36763208

Quote:
Labour, the Lib Dems and the Greens are calling for a snap general election, rather than waiting for the contest scheduled for 2020 under the Fixed Term Parliaments Act.
Labour's election co-ordinator, Jon Trickett, said: "It is crucial, given the instability caused by the Brexit vote, that the country has a democratically elected prime minister. I am now putting the whole of the party on a general election footing."
Mr Farron, Lib Dem leader, said: "With Theresa May's coronation we need an early general election.
I’m not revising anything, are you seriously suggesting that there were not demands for an election after May became PM?
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Old 30-10-2019, 09:16   #1797
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post
If you actually read the report, it is Trump's policy, not BJ's. If the report is correct, that is.

Government response:

In a statement to Dispatches, the Department for International Trade said: “The NHS is not, and never will be, for sale to the private sector, whether overseas or domestic‎…The sustainability of the NHS is an absolute priority for the government. We could not agree to any proposals on medicines pricing or access that would put NHS finances at risk or reduce clinician and patient choice.”
As the adage goes "Well they would say that, wouldn't they"?

Major theme for this GE, "Can you trust the Tories with .. basically, anything?" *







* cue response with variations on Corbyn, Labour, Marxist, etc.
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Old 30-10-2019, 09:19   #1798
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post
If you actually read the report, it is Trump's policy, not BJ's. If the report is correct, that is.

Government response:

In a statement to Dispatches, the Department for International Trade said: “The NHS is not, and never will be, for sale to the private sector, whether overseas or domestic‎…The sustainability of the NHS is an absolute priority for the government. We could not agree to any proposals on medicines pricing or access that would put NHS finances at risk or reduce clinician and patient choice.”
Whilst I hope this is the case. I believe that in any trade talks with the US that the NHS will in some way or another be opened up to them.

We're going to be doing a lot of negotiating from a position of weakness so to speak. So, regardless of it's access to the NHS, Visas etc.

We're going to end up giving quite a lot away i suspect.
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Old 30-10-2019, 09:50   #1799
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
* cue response with variations on Corbyn, Labour, Marxist, etc.
Well, yes..........

---------- Post added at 08:50 ---------- Previous post was at 08:47 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Agreed, but that’s not what Pierre stated.
Ooh Sir, Sir...Pierre said there were demands for an election when May became PM, and I say there weren’t.


Stop telling tales in class Hugh, anyway Pierre is correct.
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Old 30-10-2019, 10:04   #1800
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
Were any of these commitments?

We are getting ready to come out on October the 31st...Do or die, come what may” (25 June, TalkRadio interview)

“Kick the can again and we kick the bucket, my friends, that's the sad reality" (27 June, Tory leadership hustings)

“We are going to fulfil the repeated promises of Parliament to the people and come out of the EU on October 31, no ifs or buts” (25 July, first speech as Prime Minister)

“There are no circumstances in which I will ask Brussels to delay. We are leaving on 31 October, no ifs or buts” (2 September, speaking in Downing Street)

“I am confident of getting a deal. We will leave on 31 October in all circumstances. There will be no further pointless delay.” (3 September, speech in Commons)

"I will not negotiate a delay with the EU and neither does the law compel me to do so” (19 October, speech in Commons)
I'm afraid they all are. An inconvenient truth that the Brexit Party will doubtless shine a light on.
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