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Brexit Development(s) Discussion
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Old 23-12-2019, 09:55   #2056
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by Mr K View Post
Think you've strayed from the thread a bit there old chap, and are being a bit anti-semitic. Guess different rules apply if its Ed Miliband.
What? Jeez.
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Old 23-12-2019, 09:58   #2057
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post
That's absolute tosh, Mr K. The fact that we will trade more with China will not impact on human rights in that country.

It is typical of the bleeding heart liberals to confuse issues like this and interfere with the affairs of other countries.

You need to remember that it wasn't long ago when our prisoners were making mailbags, and before that were sentenced to hard labour for many offences. We may have moved on, but other countries still need to progress, as they will with time. We do not make the laws in other countries and we need to climb down from our high horses.

---------- Post added at 08:43 ---------- Previous post was at 08:34 ----------



That the economy would suffer (it has not), that the EU negotiations would not get beyond phase 1 (which they did), that we would never get a withdrawal agreement past Brussels (which we did), that Boris would never get rid of the backstop (which he did within three months...).

I'm not sure which of your predictions on this subject you think have come to pass. Yes, the pound has dropped in value, but that will recover when there is certainty in the minds of investors.

Your views are influenced a lot by economic forecasts, but you don't seem to accept that time and time again, these have been proved wrong, based as they are on negatives, without proper consideration of the positives.
Brexit hasn't happened yet OB, and may not truly happen for years. The economic damage will the become apparent then and the years after, all too late of course.

---------- Post added at 08:58 ---------- Previous post was at 08:56 ----------

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Originally Posted by Sephiroth View Post
What? Jeez.
You did read djfunkdup's post, didn't you ??
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Old 23-12-2019, 10:13   #2058
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post
That's absolute tosh, Mr K. The fact that we will trade more with China will not impact on human rights in that country.

It is typical of the bleeding heart liberals to confuse issues like this and interfere with the affairs of other countries.

You need to remember that it wasn't long ago when our prisoners were making mailbags, and before that were sentenced to hard labour for many offences. We may have moved on, but other countries still need to progress, as they will with time. We do not make the laws in other countries and we need to climb down from our high horses.

---------- Post added at 08:43 ---------- Previous post was at 08:34 ----------



That the economy would suffer (it has not), that the EU negotiations would not get beyond phase 1 (which they did), that we would never get a withdrawal agreement past Brussels (which we did), that Boris would never get rid of the backstop (which he did within three months...).

I'm not sure which of your predictions on this subject you think have come to pass. Yes, the pound has dropped in value, but that will recover when there is certainty in the minds of investors.

Your views are influenced a lot by economic forecasts, but you don't seem to accept that time and time again, these have been proved wrong, based as they are on negatives, without proper consideration of the positives.
To be fair, any real impact, one way or another, of Brexit won't happen just yet. The only aspect of EU negotiations that has started is the non-binding Political Declaration. The EU is now kicking up a fuss over the "level playing field" being removed. The backstop is still there, just in a modified form.
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Old 23-12-2019, 10:34   #2059
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by Mr K View Post
Brexit hasn't happened yet OB, and may not truly happen for years. The economic damage will the become apparent then and the years after, all too late of course.
The economic damage was said to be the immediate consequence of a 'leave' vote, Mr K.

I'm still not sure why you think there will be long term economic damage when Brexit is all about increasing trade and divorcing ourselves from the constraints of the EU.

Incidentally, I will say again, trade with the EU will continue.
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Old 23-12-2019, 11:06   #2060
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY View Post

That the economy would suffer (it has not), that the EU negotiations would not get beyond phase 1 (which they did), that we would never get a withdrawal agreement past Brussels (which we did), that Boris would never get rid of the backstop (which he did within three months...).

I'm not sure which of your predictions on this subject you think have come to pass. Yes, the pound has dropped in value, but that will recover when there is certainty in the minds of investors.

Your views are influenced a lot by economic forecasts, but you don't seem to accept that time and time again, these have been proved wrong, based as they are on negatives, without proper consideration of the positives.
Old Boy, firstly thank you for your comprehensive answer. However, I make the following responses:
1) Brexit has not happened yet so projections of what will happen to the economy are still valid. What we do know is that the £ has fallen in value since the referendum result, investment has dropped but unemployment remains low. Forecasts do include positives but you fail to acknowledge the analysis done by Her Majesty's Treasury and instead adopt a conspiracy theory that they are all Remainers. I must remind you that every civil servant I've spoken to has been keen on Brexit as it has increased job opportunities for them!
2) I'm not sure what you mean about Phase 1 negotiations - I've never mentioned this.
3) I've also never predicted we wouldn't get a withdrawal agreement in place. Are you confusing me with someone else?
3) Regarding the backstop, I pointed out that that it was impossible for the UK to have a hard Brexit and for there to be no hard border between Northern Ireland and the Republic.
What is happening is that Northern Ireland is effectively following EU rules so the border will be between GB and Northern Ireland. This was something that the EU offered Theresa May but she declined it as she felt it split the Union plus the DUP would never approve it. See here https://flipchartfairytales.wordpres...johnsons-suez/

---------- Post added at 10:06 ---------- Previous post was at 10:03 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K View Post
Brexit hasn't happened yet OB, and may not truly happen for years. The economic damage will the become apparent then and the years after, all too late of course.

---------- Post added at 08:58 ---------- Previous post was at 08:56 ----------



You did read djfunkdup's post, didn't you ??
Spot on Mr K.
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Old 23-12-2019, 20:14   #2061
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by 1andrew1 View Post
1) Brexit has not happened yet so projections of what will happen to the economy are still valid.
No projections are valid. Nobody can predict the future. Given the recent run of predictions/ projections on all manner of economic and political outcomes, only a fool would weigh into an argument citing such.

And that is not aimed you specifically, but anyone that claims they know Brexit will be a success or failure, and both outcomes will be a matter of relativity, measured across many benchmarks such that in 5, 10, 15 years both sides will say they were right and will quote many fact, figures and percentages to back their argument........such is the way of things.

I doubt many of us will notice any difference whatsoever.
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Old 23-12-2019, 23:27   #2062
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

6 posts removed that absolutely had no relativity to the thread topic.

Members are also reminded that if you cannot be civil to each other, then such posts will also be removed.
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Old 28-12-2019, 14:54   #2063
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

John Bercow SNUBBED: Ex-Speaker becomes first in 230 years NOT to get a seat in Lords

According to a report by the Mail Online, the move is seen as “revenge” from Prime Minister Boris Johnson over Mr Bercow's handling of Brexit.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/12...er-peerage-spt
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Old 28-12-2019, 15:02   #2064
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

To be fair he was warned pretty clearly earlier this year that this would happen, if he kept on innovating and selectively applying Commons precedents in order to allow the legislature to appropriate responsibilities that properly belong with the executive. IMO his actions went way beyond defending the power of Parliament and strayed into partisanship. He’s reaping his reward now.
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Old 28-12-2019, 16:19   #2065
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by papa smurf View Post
John Bercow SNUBBED: Ex-Speaker becomes first in 230 years NOT to get a seat in Lords

According to a report by the Mail Online, the move is seen as “revenge” from Prime Minister Boris Johnson over Mr Bercow's handling of Brexit.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/12...er-peerage-spt
It's possible that just it's a matter of timing. He resigned not that long ago. Too soon for this set of honours?
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Old 28-12-2019, 17:19   #2066
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by nomadking View Post
It's possible that just it's a matter of timing. He resigned not that long ago. Too soon for this set of honours?
That makes sense. I suspect Johnson's had enough to do than worry about who gets what honours.
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Old 28-12-2019, 17:20   #2067
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by papa smurf View Post
John Bercow SNUBBED: Ex-Speaker becomes first in 230 years NOT to get a seat in Lords

According to a report by the Mail Online, the move is seen as “revenge” from Prime Minister Boris Johnson over Mr Bercow's handling of Brexit.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/12...er-peerage-spt
Good! I’m sure his pension will be fine, he doesn’t need it topped up with a peerage.
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Old 28-12-2019, 17:37   #2068
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Originally Posted by nomadking View Post
It's possible that just it's a matter of timing. He resigned not that long ago. Too soon for this set of honours?
Nope. They could have done it on a moment’s notice had they wanted to - you don’t have to wait for the new year or birthday honours to create peers.

That said, the final proof, if it be needed, will come when Bercow fails to be elevated to the Lords in the birthday honours this coming June.
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Old 28-12-2019, 18:02   #2069
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

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Nope. They could have done it on a moment’s notice had they wanted to - you don’t have to wait for the new year or birthday honours to create peers.

That said, the final proof, if it be needed, will come when Bercow fails to be elevated to the Lords in the birthday honours this coming June.
The people receiving the honours get advance notice, so that will reduce the time frame.
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Old 28-12-2019, 19:19   #2070
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Re: Brexit Development(s) Discussion

Just goes to what farcical political cobblers the honours system is. IDS has been knighted, for what??? Services to the benefits system !?

Anyway all victims of Universal Credit now know his home address
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a9262486.html
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The government has accidentally posted the home addresses of more than 1,000 New Year's honour recipients.

The list included celebrities such as Elton John as well as some of the country's most senior police officers and politicians.

The list was briefly posted to a government website, allowing anyone who visited the page to download it as a spreadsheet.
Oops !
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