Coronavirus (OLD)

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by Julian

Try again? Are you 6 years old?

If you had any clue as to what is going on you might be in a position to comment.

Your anti-government stance is as tiresome as it is predictable.

I have had care homes on the phone today in tears pleading for supplies which we cannot fulfill due to the NHS stealing all the supplies.

The NHS have somehow managed to lose/waste PPE.

Mrs K is a staff nurse in a hospital (and has underlying health issues) so yes I know exactly what is going on. Maybe we should get down there and help out. We could maybe save PPE by not using it? No? Me neither, she's either mad or a saint, haven't decided yet.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by Mr K

Mrs K is a staff nurse in a hospital (and has underlying health issues) so yes I know exactly what is going on. Maybe we should get down there and help out. We could maybe save PPE by not using it? No? Me neither, she's either mad or a saint, haven't decided yet.

I've decided who is mad and who is a saint.

The truth will come out in the end as to the handling of this crisis.

Originally Posted by Hugh

Trying to blame nurses and doctors seems a bit off.

I don't believe he mentioned Doctors & Nurses ?

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

I've decided who is mad and who is a saint.

The truth will come out in the end as to the handling of this crisis.

There will be an inquiry for sure. Maybe two to separate out the scientific approach and another about resourcing.

I think the Government will largely be ok on how they handled the scientific advice and approach the situation. I suspect they will probably do badly when it comes to things like PPE and testing. Especially when it comes to care homes and social care generally.

[Julian]

Originally Posted by Paul

I don't believe he mentioned Doctors & Nurses ?

Exactly

Having taken all the PPE available in the UK the numerous managers have failed to get it to where it is needed.

That is not a government issue that is overpaid people mismanaging the resource

---------- Post added at 00:36 ---------- Previous post was at 00:22 ----------

Originally Posted by Mr K

Mrs K is a staff nurse in a hospital (and has underlying health issues) so yes I know exactly what is going on. Maybe we should get down there and help out. We could maybe save PPE by not using it? No? Me neither, she's either mad or a saint, haven't decided yet.

Huge respect to your wife working on when she could be off work for 12 weeks as a vulnerable person.

She will be reliant on the procurement team and distribution to ensure the front line staff have their PPE.

It is that link which is clearly broken.

Meanwhile people's loved ones are dying in care homes where there is no access to PPE at all.

I think the problem is that it is expected that, during a world-wide shortage of PPE, and an unforeseen requirement for PPE in Care Homes (the supply requirement went from a couple of hundred Trusts to over 58,000 organisations), there would/should be enought for everyone - this is a massive shift in requirements in a time of crisis, and a complex supply chain, mostly from overseas.

Could things have been done better - probably; does it help blaming people until we know the facts - probably not.

There have been shortfalls in lots of places - an example would be in Care Homes, where the group that my mum-in-law is in got supplies of PPE early in the crisis, whilst other Care Home organisations didn't; the other care homes shouldn't be blamed for not being as forward thinking as the one mum's in, because at the beginning very few people thought it would come to this. Should all the GP Surgeries, which are in effect private businesses, be blamed for not having ordered PPE equipment earlier?

In the vast complexity of Health and Social Care, whatever the Government does, it won't be enough - review afterwards, critique constructively during, but blaming is inappropriate at this stage, imho (especially without evidence, as in the comments about NHS managers).

From the Times

Why isn’t this enough to satisfy demand?
The government has acknowledged that distribution of the equipment remains a challenge. At the weekend Matt Hancock, the health secretary, said that it was impossible to know when supplies of PPE would meet demand across the NHS and social care sectors. There are almost 1.6 million NHS staff and demand for PPE is at unprecedented levels. Many pieces of kit can only be used once or must be disposed of after a single session on a ward. Mr Hopson has said that supplies coming in from China have been “erratic”, with boxes labelled as containing gowns actually full of face masks and other equipment failing UK safety tests. “If everything had been flowing exactly as had been ordered and if all of the material had properly passed its safety test, there would not be an issue,” he said.

What about other countries?
The World Health Organisation has said that supplies of PPE are stretched across the globe as a result of the Covid-19 pandemic. It said that prices have surged, with the cost of surgical masks rising six-fold, some respirators trebling and gowns doubling. Supplies have been hampered by the fact that it can take months to produce and deliver supplies, meaning prices are inflated by some countries.

[denphone]

Yes definitely things could have been done better but you are right a contructive very wide ranging review of that there is no doubt afterwards as this was another example of muddled disjointed thinking in the link below.

https://www.ft.com/content/5f393d77-...7-416efbc575ec

Originally Posted by denphone

https://www.ft.com/content/5f393d77-...7-416efbc575ec

Not much use unless you are an FT subscriber.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by Paul

Not much use unless you are an FT subscriber.

A google search for "Muddled thinking punctures plan for British ventilator" will let you read the article without subbing.

[denphone]

Originally Posted by Paul

Not much use unless you are an FT subscriber.

Have you typed the link into Google search.

Not the point.
If you provide a link, it needs to work, not require google searches.

[Taf]

JustGiving makes a profit from donations to people like Tom Moore. 5%, 10% or 15%!

And all payments processed through JustGiving are still be subject to standard card processing fees of 1.9% plus 20p.

https://metro.co.uk/2020/04/15/justg...iser-12561876/

Virgin Money Giving, another popular online platform for donating to charity, charges a 2% platform fee and 2.5% payment processing fee, which the donor can choose to cover. If not, the charity will pick up the tab.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/...t-has-profited

[denphone]

Originally Posted by Taf

JustGiving makes a profit from donations to people like Tom Moore. 5%, 10% or 15%!

And all payments processed through JustGiving are still be subject to standard card processing fees of 1.9% plus 20p.

https://metro.co.uk/2020/04/15/justg...iser-12561876/

Virgin Money Giving, another popular online platform for donating to charity, charges a 2% platform fee and 2.5% payment processing fee, which the donor can choose to cover. If not, the charity will pick up the tab.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/...t-has-profited

If it is true then that is quite a sum as the latest figure is about £23 million which this wonderful man raised.

[Sephiroth]

... and we're waffling on about JustGiving's take.

[Julian]

Originally Posted by Hugh

I think the problem is that it is expected that, during a world-wide shortage of PPE, and an unforeseen requirement for PPE in Care Homes (the supply requirement went from a couple of hundred Trusts to over 58,000 organisations), there would/should be enought for everyone - this is a massive shift in requirements in a time of crisis, and a complex supply chain, mostly from overseas.

Care homes have always had a PPE requirement covered quite adequately by a network of suppliers. Only now with supplies being stolen en route is there an issue.