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PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ignored
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Old 21-11-2020, 21:45   #91
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by jfman View Post
Itís not a childish response itís a verifiable fact. Youíre assuming sheís competent because sheís a Tory and it suits your narrative.
If I close my eyes I can hear and picture that being shouted at me by a 6 year old, whilst stamping their feet.

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Yet she appears to find herself encountering problems that other Conservative Ministers, dare I say more competent Ministers, have not.
I have no idea what problems she, nor any other ministers may encounter, perhaps she May encounter more problems Han her male counterparts- I donít know. I canít comment on her competence ( you must have some insight I donít )
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Old 21-11-2020, 21:51   #92
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
If I close my eyes I can hear and picture that being shouted at me by a 6 year old, whilst stamping their feet.
Very good.

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I have no idea what problems she, nor any other ministers may encounter, perhaps she May encounter more problems Han her male counterparts- I don’t know. I can’t comment on her competence ( you must have some insight I don’t )
You would have been as well stopping after "I have no idea" because you don't - you're simply engaging in speculation from a narrative (without evidence) that Civil Servants were somehow either racist or sexist towards her. As you said they're male, pale and stale.

Yet you have no evidence, at all, or any of this. Yet the person who carried out the investigation and had evidence called it a breach of the Ministerial Code. I note that no Civil Servants are being referred for breaches of the Civil Service Code as a result.

I would say, and I don't meant this as a personal criticism, that the person who independently assessed the evidence is more qualified than you to reach a judgement.

In my first exchange with you today on this you managed to bring up Jeremy Corbyn. Who has absolutely nothing to do with anything. However it was clear from that point you are viewing this subject through an entirely political prism. From that point you conceded you have no genuine intenton to consider the merits of any complaint, or otherwise, simply because it's a Conservative Minister.

I guess I'm curious where would you draw the line for a Conservative Minister's conduct? What would you make the burden of proof?

And the same for a Labour minister I suppose.

Last edited by jfman; 21-11-2020 at 21:57.
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Old 21-11-2020, 23:57   #93
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

Enough !
Any more outbursts from the children, and you'll be sitting on the naughtly step.
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Old 22-11-2020, 01:14   #94
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by Paul View Post
Enough !
Any more outbursts from the children, and you'll be sitting on the naughtly step.
Hopefully 2 meters apart, and in groups of no more than 6
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Old 22-11-2020, 12:46   #95
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
If I close my eyes I can hear and picture that being shouted at me by a 6 year old, whilst stamping their feet.



I have no idea what problems she, nor any other ministers may encounter, perhaps she May encounter more problems Han her male counterparts- I donít know. I canít comment on her competence ( you must have some insight I donít )
The insight is in The Times today, we can wait till January to see if she's out of a job. Don't know why you're sticking up for her, she thinks you're lazy and wrote it in a book, not some British workers were lazy or a najority but all of us, although that said perhaps we should remember she was supremely competent and qualified to pocket one thousand pounds an hour from arms manufacturers, wonder if they got value for money
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Old 22-11-2020, 12:56   #96
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by TheDaddy View Post
The insight is in The Times today, we can wait till January to see if she's out of a job. Don't know why you're sticking up for her, she thinks you're lazy and wrote it in a book, not some British workers were lazy or a najority but all of us, although that said perhaps we should remember she was supremely competent and qualified to pocket one thousand pounds an hour from arms manufacturers, wonder if they got value for money
The report's been languishing on BoJo's desk since March. It's been released now presumably because it's an opportune time to bury bad news as the country focuses on Covid and Christmas. I therefore doubt that she will lose her job, just her reputation.
One feature of BoJo is that he expects completely loyalty from his Ministers. In return he gives it back.
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Old 22-11-2020, 13:53   #97
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by TheDaddy View Post
The insight is in The Times today, we can wait till January to see if she's out of a job. Don't know why you're sticking up for her, she thinks you're lazy and wrote it in a book, not some British workers were lazy or a najority but all of us, although that said perhaps we should remember she was supremely competent and qualified to pocket one thousand pounds an hour from arms manufacturers, wonder if they got value for money
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/p...ence-csbxdggt3
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Old 22-11-2020, 18:09   #98
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDaddy View Post
The insight is in The Times today, we can wait till January to see if she's out of a job. Don't know why you're sticking up for her, she thinks you're lazy and wrote it in a book, not some British workers were lazy or a najority but all of us, although that said perhaps we should remember she was supremely competent and qualified to pocket one thousand pounds an hour from arms manufacturers, wonder if they got value for money
Not so much sticking up for her but willing to give the BoD, and only because I have first hand experience of Mrs Pierreís experiences in a male dominated sector.

It may be mis-placed, we may or may not see.

---------- Post added at 17:09 ---------- Previous post was at 17:04 ----------

Oh so she said the words F****** Useless. But we donít know why or at who or anything other than she said those words.

Iíve said those words at work many times.
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Old 22-11-2020, 18:18   #99
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
Not so much sticking up for her but willing to give the BoD, and only because I have first hand experience of Mrs Pierre’s experiences in a male dominated sector.

It may be mis-placed, we may or may not see.

---------- Post added at 17:09 ---------- Previous post was at 17:04 ----------



Oh so she said the words F****** Useless. But we don’t know why or at who or anything other than she said those words.

I’ve said those words at work many times.
Quote:
She would tell officials their work was f***ing useless?”
I have never told anyone in any of my teams that - that would be inappropriate and bullying.
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Old 22-11-2020, 18:19   #100
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
Not so much sticking up for her but willing to give the BoD, and only because I have first hand experience of Mrs Pierre’s experiences in a male dominated sector.

It may be mis-placed, we may or may not see.
Worth noting that the majority of civil servants are female, 53.9%. This ranges from 45.2% female in some grades up to 57.2% in others. But doubtless the higher grades are the male-dominated ones. Based on this data, I wouldn't call it a male-dominated sector.

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...sion-dashboard
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Old 22-11-2020, 18:45   #101
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
Oh so she said the words F****** Useless. But we don’t know why or at who or anything other than she said those words.

I’ve said those words at work many times.
Absolute whataboutery.

---------- Post added at 17:45 ---------- Previous post was at 17:40 ----------

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Originally Posted by 1andrew1 View Post
Worth noting that the majority of civil servants are female, 53.9%. This ranges from 45.2% female in some grades up to 57.2% in others. But doubtless the higher grades are the male-dominated ones. Based on this data, I wouldn't call it a male-dominated sector.

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...sion-dashboard
https://www.gov.uk/government/organi...nt-secretaries

Plenty of women on the boards of various entities described under “our governance” on the Civil Service’s own website.

I’m sure if any of the women (or men) on that list referred to someone working for them as f- useless they’d find themselves falling below the standards required in their posts.

We don't all live by the standards of the building site.

Last edited by jfman; 22-11-2020 at 18:55.
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Old 22-11-2020, 18:58   #102
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by Hugh View Post
I have never told anyone in any of my teams that - that would be inappropriate and bullying.
Inappropriate ? Quite possibly but "bullying" ? Nope.
You've been listening to too many snowflakes Hugh.

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Originally Posted by jfman View Post
Absolute whataboutery.
Not really.
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Old 22-11-2020, 19:00   #103
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by Paul View Post
Inappropriate ? Quite possibly but "bullying" ? Nope.
You've been listening to too many snowflakes Hugh.


Not really.
I think he meant sowhataboutery.
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Old 22-11-2020, 19:14   #104
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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I have never told anyone in any of my teams that - that would be inappropriate and bullying.
I didnít say I had, I said I had used those words - i didnít say in what way I had used them. Much like what the times article said.
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Old 22-11-2020, 19:14   #105
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Re: PM's adviser on ministerial code resigns over his advice on Priti Patel being ign

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Originally Posted by Paul View Post
Inappropriate ? Quite possibly but "bullying" ? Nope.
You've been listening to too many snowflakes Hugh.

Not really.
While it might conform to the standards of other workplaces it's undoubtedly bullying/harassment in the Civil Service.

The fact it's a minister, of questionable competence according to whoever is briefing the Times this morning, is neither here nor there.
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