smoking and the pub

[Saaf_laandon_mo]

Originally Posted by Ellie

I agree, all this new law will never stop kiddies being forced to breath in smoke from their irresponsible parents day after day after day at home

Yeah thats the truly sad thing. I have so many friends who have young kids, some new born, many beeing toddlers, and just smoke in their company irregardless. Its actually stopped us going round with our little un cause it just means either me or the missus will be in the garden with our little one while everyone's lighting up.

Im all for the ban, especially in restaurants, where I just feel its blatantly rude to light up while others are eating.

[etccarmageddon]

this ban - is it to protect non smokers and innocents (kids) from passive smoking or to stop smokers from smoking - or is it both?

I can see a lot of trouble ahead with this.

[etccarmageddon]

yeah when you impose your will on people and force them to do something because you think you know better etc etc then you will probably make something that would be practical to implement become more resisted.

---------- Post added at 12:11 ---------- Previous post was at 12:10 ----------

my point is, you need to get the 'smokers' on side and complete blanket ban which as a non smoker I wont lose any sleep over is not the way of pleasant persuading.

[ian@huth]

A complete ban will be good news for the supermarkets. There is a lot on the news at the moment about them expanding the lines they offer and how they are affecting small specialised shops. I would expect their sales of alcohol to increase when the complete ban comes into effect. That group of smoking card players who go along to their local virtually every night of the week for a game of cards, a few pints and a smoke will possibly decide to congregate in each others homes and get their booze from Tesco or whoever.

In our younger days we used to meet up with friends in our local two or three times per week. After a while this turned into meeting up in one of our homes instead. There was a large group of us and several months after we started doing this we did meet up in our old local one night and found the landlord was moving to another pub. He said that after we all stopped going in the atmosphere of the place changed and other regulars drifted off elsewhere changing what was a busy lively pub into a nearly empty quiet place most of the time.

If people do look elsewhere when they cannot smoke in the pub they could be moving the smoke from a large space with reasonable ventilation into much smaller spaces with no ventilation. This would affect any non-smokers which may move with them more than previously and possibly bring much more smoke into homes where children live. Smoking outside pubs when smokers pop out for a drag will put smoking more in the sight of children passing by which would have been unnoticed if they were shut away inside.

[etccarmageddon]

I suspect if you cant smoke in pubs it will mean you drink more.

[marky]

I smoke myself, and i'm all for not smoking in pubs, ive no doubt landlords will welcome the cleaner air and no more cig burns on the carpets and pool table.

[Pierre]

Whilst I don't agree with a "total" ban, we have it. Once again New Labour shows itself not to be the champion of the working class or the common man but if fact as near to a far right dictatorship as this county can have.

A government that effectively legalises cannabis and then bans smoking - you couldn't make it up.

All this will mean is people will go out in groups of friends and then every 20-30mins the group will be split with the smokers going outside. Not conducive for a good night out.

Bars that have beer gardens will do great business, those that don't will suffer.

Bars that do have beer gardens will buy those big patio heaters - great for the environment.

Councils will have to clean the streets virtually daily - rise in council tax.

Also non-smokers who think they've won - beware. This government has shown it is good at least at one thing, and that is removing civil liberties.

Today it is smoking, next it may be alchohol, junk food, dangerous sports, barbeques, fast cars and fast bikes, comedy, free speech the list goes on - and they're not listed to be funny.

I think it's a sad day for the country.

Originally Posted by Pierre

Whilst I don't agree with a "total" ban, we have it. Once again New Labour shows itself not to be the champion of the working class or the common man but if fact as near to a far right dictatorship as this county can have.

Working class? Come on, Labour saw the light and ditched that tired old class war rhetoric when it finally realised you can't govern on tribal lines any more. There may well be large swathes of the country where men in flat caps would vote for a monkey provided it was wearing a red rosette, but that has little impact in the corridors of power. There is no working class any more. There are Chavs (who work as little as possible) and the rest of us.

A government that effectively legalises cannabis and then bans smoking - you couldn't make it up.

You are making it up. They have done neither of these things. Not by a very long way.

All this will mean is people will go out in groups of friends and then every 20-30mins the group will be split with the smokers going outside. Not conducive for a good night out.

The experience from Ireland is that this happens to an extent, but also that people smoke less in an evening, so 20-30 minutes may be an exaggeration.

Bars that have beer gardens will do great business, those that don't will suffer.

Exactly how many months of the year would you choose to sit in a beer garden anyway? It may make a difference, but it won't be vast.

Bars that do have beer gardens will buy those big patio heaters - great for the environment.

And they will suffer higher business costs as a result, thus cancelling out their advantage over the pubs with no beer garden.

Councils will have to clean the streets virtually daily - rise in council tax.

Councils will use powers they already have to make a Street Litter Control Notice, thereby either resolving the problem or resulting in a fine of up to £2,500 on the business. Solution: The pub organises to sweep the pavement, to avoid getting fined, and Council Tax is unaffected.

Also non-smokers who think they've won - beware. This government has shown it is good at least at one thing, and that is removing civil liberties.

Today it is smoking, next it may be alchohol, junk food, dangerous sports, barbeques, fast cars and fast bikes, comedy, free speech the list goes on - and they're not listed to be funny.

I think it's a sad day for the country.

Parliament - and it is Parliament, not the Government, because there was a free vote on this issue - has recognised the right of workers to earn a living in an environment clear of toxic airborne pollutants caused by smoking. You started your post by banging on about the working class, you should be celebrating this extension of workers rights.

[etccarmageddon]

so is the ban to protect people from passive smoking or to protect/deter smokers from their stupid habit or is it both?

Originally Posted by etccarmageddon

so is the ban to protect people from passive smoking or to protect/deter smokers from their stupid habit or is it both?

Officially, it is health and safety at work legislation, designed to protect workers from being exposed to harmful substances in the workplace, just the same as it was in Ireland. However many of the law's supporters in Parliament have been quite open about the fact they hope it will lead to more smokers deciding to quit as well.

[Derek]

Originally Posted by etccarmageddon

so is the ban to protect people from passive smoking or to protect/deter smokers from their stupid habit or is it both?

Seemingly to protect bar workers etc. from smoke in the workplace.

I'm just sitting waiting for the 1st challenge to the law from prison officers as prisoners are exempt.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by dezzo

Seemingly to protect bar workers etc. from smoke in the workplace.

I'm just sitting waiting for the 1st challenge to the law from prison officers as prisoners are exempt.

Yes, also the Houses of Parliament are exempt as well. So after all the chuffs that voted for the ban have finished tucking into their subsidised stuffed pidgeon breast, they can enjoy a smoke in the heated luxury of the corridors of power whilst the rest of you smoke outside.

Originally Posted by Pierre

Yes, also the Houses of Parliament are exempt as well. So after all the chuffs that voted for the ban have finished tucking into their subsidised stuffed pidgeon breast, they can enjoy a smoke in the heated luxury of the corridors of power whilst the rest of you smoke outside.

Are you reading the whole thread?

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/sh...postcount=1183

[etccarmageddon]

if it's a way of covertly getting smokers to quit why not just stop fannying around and ban the sale of cigs?