Euthanasia?

[MadGamer]

I can see this thread being closed as it is starting to go off topic.

Originally Posted by paulyoung666

and there is if you want to travel to switzerland , dignitas

I meant in england.

Really though all of us can say this and that but its all debate until you are in that one moment and you cant say anything. When the moment comes all your moral objections or convictions that we have been discussing are out of the window in that one moment and then it is a test of your personaility.

Do you love that enough to let them go? Do you love them so much you cant let them go? Can you kill someone? Could you live with yourself if you did?

All those questions can only be answered once our emotions are actually being tested in the real event, one we all hope we are not in . As the person or as the person being asked.

I fail to see how anyone can speak with such conviction? If you know someone who has been in pain and died it is still not the same as being asked to kill them.

I reakon we should debate the pros and cons of allowing medical assistance in depth in extreame cases. Not a debate on the legal meaning of Euthanasia.

[Tezcatlipoca]

Originally Posted by Wayne A

I can see this thread being closed as it is starting to go off topic.

Really?

Although there have been some off-topic posts, it seems, to me, that the thread is still discussing euthanasia.

So it won't be getting closed. Unless things get too personal or heated again, in which case it may be closed briefly for a cooling off period. But it seems to be calm at the moment.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Jerrek

Actually, yes I have seen "somebody." It still didn't bring murderous thoughts up in my mind. NAh. I'm just not a murderer.

But you are willing to murder Jerrek, you've said so on many occasions before.

We aren't talking here about someone who doesn't know the sufferer, walking in, declairing "Well this chap's not going to have a good life, best top him now"

Lets say you get run over by a truck tomorrow, in a coma, vegetative state meaning no higher functions.
You're taken off the machines, your body still functions on a low level, you breath etc.
Your parents have to give up work to look after your motionless body, for years every time your mum comes into work your legs and arms, and feed you through a tube she breaks down and cries.
Assume euthenasia is allowed, with the appropriate judicial review of each case.
Now your parents know your wishes, you don't want to be euthenised, so they won't apply.
But lets say like me you'd rather not have your parents or loved ones go through that, so you let them know you'd rather die, why should your wishes be denied?

is yoour mind active when you are is a state like that

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Damien

is yoour mind active when you are is a state like that

I meant let them know before you get in that state, this is why people should talk about these things, and death, what you'd like to have for your funeral.
We shy away from talking about bad things, so people don't know what our wishes are

No, I wanted to know if your mind was active when your in that state? Do you know whats happing

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Damien

No, I wanted to know if your mind was active when your in that state? Do you know whats happing

In a vegetative state, as far as I know only your lower functions are active on a brain scan, so things like breathing, heart beating.
You don't respond to senses, and by respond I mean part of your brain lighting up registering it.
Your mind is dead, your body just hasn't followed it.

Personally, I would tell my family that if I'm in a state where I'm not concious or able to say I want to live, then end it for me.
So if I was in that state, they'd know what to do, if they so wished to follow my instructions.
It's not like I'm going to bitch and complain if they do it and I didn't want them to

Well, this may sound mean but thank god that your own mind isnt working. Fancy being like that and being able to move and so forth but knowing full well what is happening

Your mid is what you are without that, you are dead. why keep the organs alive?

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Damien

Well, this may sound mean but thank god that your own mind isnt working. Fancy being like that and being able to move and so forth but knowing full well what is happening

Your mid is what you are without that, you are dead. why keep the organs alive?

Some people can't differenciate between the two.
Also, there's the power of denial, if someone's body is still alive, then you don't have to come to terms with them not being around

good point

I am actually very lucky my gran died on natrual cases and my french grandparents are still alive and well (france is a lot healther, I wonder why?) my granddad died of a heart attack but that was years and years before I was born

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Damien

good point

I am actually very lucky my gran died on natrual cases and my french grandparents are still alive and well (france is a lot healther, I wonder why?) my granddad died of a heart attack but that was years and years before I was born

My Nan (on my dad's side) was hit by a car back in the late 30's.
They used her as a guinea pig moving some muscles from her back down to her leg to try and rebuild them.
She was in pain most of her life, no where near enough to euthanise her tho!
But at the end, when she went the same way as elvis, I was glad, because her suffering was over.

[Jerrek]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

But you are willing to murder Jerrek, you've said so on many occasions before.

I never never said I'm willing to murder.

Lets say you get run over by a truck tomorrow, in a coma, vegetative state meaning no higher functions.
You're taken off the machines, your body still functions on a low level, you breath etc.
Your parents have to give up work to look after your motionless body, for years every time your mum comes into work your legs and arms, and feed you through a tube she breaks down and cries.
Assume euthenasia is allowed, with the appropriate judicial review of each case.
Now your parents know your wishes, you don't want to be euthenised, so they won't apply.
But lets say like me you'd rather not have your parents or loved ones go through that, so you let them know you'd rather die, why should your wishes be denied?

Stop feeding the person... Afterall, we're removing the machines, and that includes a tube to feed the person. The person will die naturally.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by Jerrek

I never never said I'm willing to murder.

Perhaps you should go through some of your previous posts in other threads, or reps you've given people.

Originally Posted by Jerrek

Stop feeding the person... Afterall, we're removing the machines, and that includes a tube to feed the person. The person will die naturally.

Lovely, you're so caring that rather than give them a quick death from a lethal injection, you'll let them slowly waste away?
Do you know how awful starving to death is?
Your body starts "eating" itself.

Jerrek, like many of us here you have not been put in the sititutation so making such agurmentive posts on such a emotional issue so stop bring this topic into angryness and bitterness.