"Bloke in the Pub" says "Stick with ntl" - Page 6

Hans Gruber · 25-09-2005, 13:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill C

In that case how is it that everyone seems to think that NTL can do it. Just read the posts where users complain because they dont have 10 meg yet.

You can't base replies to people on what others have said, everyone here is an individual and has an individual opinion.

Russ · 25-09-2005, 15:21

Anyone else here feel they can trust Bill's word over that of the "bloke in the pub"?

(No offence intended to BITP, it's just that Bill is very rarely wrong about this sort of thing, in fact I can't remember a time when he got it wrong

)

25-09-2005, 15:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russ D

Anyone else here feel they can trust Bill's word over that of the "bloke in the pub"?

(No offence intended to BITP, it's just that Bill is very rarely wrong about this sort of thing, in fact I can't remember a time when he got it wrong

)

well given that Bill is basing his opinion on his experience as an NTL employee, albeit filtered by a non-disclosure agreement, I would believe him every time.

Plus having seen the piccies from the LAN party, I would be loth to argue with him, about anything

25-09-2005, 17:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russ D

Anyone else here feel they can trust Bill's word over that of the "bloke in the pub"?

(No offence intended to BITP, it's just that Bill is very rarely wrong about this sort of thing, in fact I can't remember a time when he got it wrong

)

__________________

Quote:

Originally Posted by homealone

well given that Bill is basing his opinion on his experience as an NTL employee, albeit filtered by a non-disclosure agreement, I would believe him every time.

Plus having seen the piccies from the LAN party, I would be loth to argue with him, about anything

Marge · 25-09-2005, 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by homealone

Plus having seen the piccies from the LAN party, I would be loth to argue with him, about anything

Having spoke to Bill on the phone, I wouldn't argue with him either

If Bill says today is Thursday, then it's Thursday

Ignition · 25-09-2005, 20:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hans Gruber

Doesn't sound like too much more work than switching from ADSL to ADSL2+. Analogue will be switched off around that time anyway.

Fair bit of difference between using existing kit which can be upgraded with a simple software / firmware upgrade and having to complete replace the kit, which is exactly what would have to happen.

I am of course ignoring the fact that you'd need several times as many uBRs, that the Telewest dude didn't promise anything he merely said 'potentially' even though ZDNet twisted it all nicely, etc, etc.

Frankly I've no time for this. UKOnline / Be / BT / Bulldog could release over 100Mbit using existing technology, VDSL2, doesn't mean it's going to happen.

Also just out of interest where exactly is this money going to come from, Telewest are not a money making company still, unlike ntl, presumably they are going to merge with ntl then spend their money?!

Sorry this is nonsense, I've known a cable operator that has offered 10Mbit for over 3 years, nothing revolutionary about that, and DOCSIS 3 is still on paper (though ignore me if you want I'm just a member of the body that approves these things).

Either way I've little time for this, you could stick a gigabit to every home right now if you had the money via fibre and 2nd generation passive optics, doesn't mean it's going to happen.

To be honest ntl will probably be in a position to offer 100Mbit down the coaxial network by end of 2006 and not via DOCSIS 3 to companies that are willing to pay the price.

Feel free to ignore me though, I mean what do I know compared the the 'bloke in the pub' I'm just some dude who has worked on cable and DSL networks for the past few years and has a working in-depth knowledge of both platforms

25-09-2005, 20:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ignition

Fair bit of difference between using existing kit which can be upgraded with a simple software / firmware upgrade and having to complete replace the kit, which is exactly what would have to happen.

I am of course ignoring the fact that you'd need several times as many uBRs, that the Telewest dude didn't promise anything he merely said 'potentially' even though ZDNet twisted it all nicely, etc, etc.

Frankly I've no time for this. UKOnline / Be / BT / Bulldog could release over 100Mbit using existing technology, VDSL2, doesn't mean it's going to happen.

Also just out of interest where exactly is this money going to come from, Telewest are not a money making company still, unlike ntl, presumably they are going to merge with ntl then spend their money?!

Sorry this is nonsense, I've known a cable operator that has offered 10Mbit for over 3 years, nothing revolutionary about that, and DOCSIS 3 is still on paper (though ignore me if you want I'm just a member of the body that approves these things).

Either way I've little time for this, you could stick a gigabit to every home right now if you had the money via fibre and 2nd generation passive optics, doesn't mean it's going to happen.

To be honest ntl will probably be in a position to offer 100Mbit down the coaxial network by end of 2006 and not via DOCSIS 3 to companies that are willing to pay the price.

Feel free to ignore me though, I mean what do I know compared the the 'bloke in the pub' I'm just some dude who has worked on cable and DSL networks for the past few years and has a working in-depth knowledge of both platforms

Nicely Put.

Chrysalis · 25-09-2005, 20:11

docsis3 if I am right also requires customers cable modems replacing.

Ignition · 25-09-2005, 20:17

For the techies:

Currently standard DOCSIS build networks built to US standards offer the frequency band between 5 and 42MHz for upstream traffic.

This band supports the PPV, interactive, return traffic for VOD, etc, etc.

This band is noisy due to 'beats' or harmonic 'reflections' of various things, from power cables to baby monitors to street lights, which means some of it is unusable.

After all of that garbage you're going to have perhaps 20MHz which is usable, and the most advanced and efficient system in use at the moment offers 4 bits per Hz or a total of 80Mbit per network area of which 25% goes byebye due to overheads. There are more efficient systems however these require cleaner quality networks, and also place a greater strain on the lasers carrying the upstream traffic as the higher up you go with the modulation the more load it imparts on the lasers, that's not including the extra load from carrying multiple signals simultaneously.

Downstream wise presently the standard 'Service Control Group' for a cable modem card which presently supports a maximum bandwidth on the Telewest platform of 38Mbps will be around 600 cable modems, 100 cable modems per 3.2MHz 4.8/9.6Mbit upstream.

To supply these guys with 100Mbit will in theory maintaining present contention require 60 modems per 38Mbps equivalent service control group, 10 downstreams serving each 600 homes taking service.

Of course it's easy, honest guv, especially when BT, Bulldog etc have had accessible ADSL2+ kit for a couple of years.
__________________

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

docsis3 if I am right also requires customers cable modems replacing.

Yep every customer taking a service requiring DOCSIS 3 would require a modem swap.

Hans Gruber · 25-09-2005, 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ignition

Feel free to ignore me though

Will do

bilal · 27-09-2005, 17:34

saw http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/article/ds24757.html about telewest hoping to launch 100mbit by the end on next year. Im guessing ntl will follow suit, or are already thinking of following suit. Everyone apologize to the bloke in the pub

marky · 27-09-2005, 17:42

Maybe zdnet heared it from a bloke in the pub

icanadvise · 27-09-2005, 19:48

What a shame that the people who are in the know run a different forum and wont comment
I asked there about another development and was politely told by an admin that the other forum would not comment (although they clearly did know)
Big shame!!!!Bill can you not ask a key individual to comment here?

slowcoach · 27-09-2005, 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by bilal

saw http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/article/ds24757.html about telewest hoping to launch 100mbit by the end on next year. Im guessing ntl will follow suit, or are already thinking of following suit. Everyone apologize to the bloke in the pub

The "Bloke in the Pub" can take the flak, just so long as everyone remembers who told them first, AGAIN!
Then there is the rumour that all the speed upgrades from other ISP's are a direct result of them reading the "Bloke in the Pub" messages..... could be.

Robc66 · 27-09-2005, 20:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by slowcoach

The "Bloke in the Pub" can take the flak, just so long as everyone remembers who told them first, AGAIN!
Then there is the rumour that all the speed upgrades from other ISP's are a direct result of them reading the "Bloke in the Pub" messages..... could be.

Lets all make up stories so they give us great speeds then