What did hit the Pentagon?

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by gazzae

So what happened to the plane?

That's kind of my point... I don't think there was a plane at all....
All the disasters that happen in America which luckily get cuaght on camera by some 'amateur' filming. Why didn't this get caught like everything else? Where's the debris from the plane? Where are the holes in the building the wings would've made? Why didn't the whole of the front collapse under the pressure of a 747 crashing into it? Where the damage to the lawn? It looks like damage from the inside out to me, not the other way round.... Far too dodgy for me.....

[gazzae]

Originally Posted by orangebird

That's kind of my point... I don't think there was a plane at all....
All the disastrers that happen in America which luckily get by some 'amateur' filming. Why didn't this get caught like everything else? Where's the debris from the plane? Where are the holes in the buildsing the wings would've made? Why didn't the whole of the front collapse under the pressure of a 747 crashing into it? Far too dodgy for me.....

What about the funerals of the 64 people on board, were they fake?

[JediMaster]

Originally Posted by gazzae

What about the funerals of the 64 people on board, where they fake?

Maybe they did die on Flight 77. But not how the GOVT say it happend.

Imagine saying they blew it UP? There would be so many things to answer, so they Cover it up

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by gazzae

What about the funerals of the 64 people on board, were they fake?

No - but do you know the 64 people on board - do you know they were on a plane, and not working at the Pentagon? Do you know they were real funerals, and not staged?

[gazzae]

Originally Posted by JediMaster

Maybe they did die on Flight 77. But not how the GOVT say it happend.

Imagine saying they blew it UP? There would be so many things to answer, so they Cover it up

Why cover it up though, surely having to blow the plane up to save the lives of people on the ground they could have coped with that. I'm sure the american public would have understood that after what else happened.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by orangebird

No - but do you know the 64 people on board - do you know they were on a plane, and not working at the Pentagon? Do you know they were real funerals, and not staged?

Ok, I've tried to stay out of giving an opinion in this thread but I can't let that one pass, so in the words of the late great Graham Chapman, "Stop that - this is get silly"

[danielf]

Originally Posted by JediMaster

Maybe they did die on Flight 77. But not how the GOVT say it happend.

Imagine saying they blew it UP? There would be so many things to answer, so they Cover it up

Errm, but where's the debris? Surely someone would have noticed?

[gazzae]

Originally Posted by orangebird

No - but do you know the 64 people on board - do you know they were on a plane, and not working at the Pentagon? Do you know they were real funerals, and not staged?

Sorry but I find it hard to believe that they staged these funerals, got the people, the clergy, the media to go along with it, and so far have gotten away with it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...&notFound=true
In sanctuaries overflowing with mourners, through sadness laced with patriotism, two passengers on American Airlines Flight 77 were remembered yesterday in Arlington and Landover -- a prelude to the nearly 200 local memorial and funeral services compelled by Tuesday's terrorist attacks on this nation.

Only a few miles fromwhere the hijacked plane crashed full-throttle into the Pentagon, the elite of the Republican Party assembled at the Cathedral of St. ThomasMore to eulogize Barbara K. Olson. The lawyer and prominent political commentator died with characteristic resolve, calmly placing two calls on her cellular phone to tell her husband what was happening.
[...]
Across the river, at First Baptist Church of Highland Park, nearly 1,000 paid homage to James Daniel Debeuneure. The fifth-grade District teacher was aboard the flight with one of his students, bound for California on a National Geographic Society field trip designed for the best and the brightest.
[...]
At least three other memorials were held yesterday across the Washington region, for passengers Karen A. Kincaid and Diane and George Simmons as well as Navy contractor Khang Nguyen. Kincaid, a Washington lawyer, was heading to Los Angeles in part to continue work on a wireless communications project to aid organ transplants. Diane Simmons was going on to Honolulu with her husband so the two could sprinkle her father's ashes at Pearl Harbor.

[gazzae]

Originally Posted by JediMaster

Maybe they did die on Flight 77. But not how the GOVT say it happend.

Imagine saying they blew it UP? There would be so many things to answer, so they Cover it up

Plus why would they cover it up, only for cheney to say it was an option they would take?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...&notFound=true

As military jets took off, he said, "The president made the decision. . . .that if the [hijacked] plane would not divert or if they wouldn't pay any attention to instructions to move away from the city, as a last resort, our pilots were authorized to take them out. Now people say, you know, that's a horrendous decision to make. Well, it is. You've got an airplane full of American citizens. . . .captured by terrorists, headed, and are you going to, in fact, shoot it down, obviously, and kill all those Americans on board? And you have to ask yourself, if we had had combat air patrol up over New York and we'd had the opportunity to take out the two aircraft that hit the World Trade Center, would we have been justified in doing it? And I think absolutely we would have."

Originally Posted by Pierre

Why can't it be terrorists?????

However, if it was some kind of military hardware they would have to say to the public it was missile that terrorists bought and it could easily happen again and we wouldn't be able to stop it.

If you were in office what would you rather say?

Well if i was Bush, and i wanted to invade iraq claiming they might sell missiles to terrorists then a missile from terrorists hitting the pentagon would come in handy. Why would they cover something up that is clearly something the goverment would have loved to happen?

Also where the hell would terrorists launch a missile from? Where would they get it? Its bloody difficult to buy and launch a missle without anyone twigging.

Originally Posted by orangebird

I reckon the Pentagon was bombed from the inside out, which is why the plane crashing into it was invented. How embarrassing would it be for US Security to admit terrorists got inside the Pentagon with explosives?

Doubt it, the pentagon is reinforced theres no way a internal explosion would go though 3 buliding of reinforced walls in such a perfect direction

A plane would be going stright and would have enough force

The Questions that need to be asked is:

Who did it?

Why did they do it?

Why would the goverment cover it up?

[Wolf]

ok just watched it and wowee what a puzzle. speechless

Why are people so eager to believe cover-ups!

I donââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t like bush (as many of you well know) but this is pushing the bloody limit. How can people who are so quick to attack governments when they release figures of success or make a speech be so quick to believe a cock and bull story using rather stupid evidence (which since they donââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t have any actual knowledge of plane crashes they take at face value)

Donââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t you think that other plane experts would have pointed out if there were a problem? What motive would the government have for a cover up? If even happened one hour after the twin towers where attacked, what kind of chance is that?

This isnââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t a cartoon you know, when a plane hits a building it doesnââ‚ƚ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢t leave a hole that is the exact same as the plane with wing marks and everything. Next you will be telling me that people run though walls leaving a exact outline of themselves (like a cartoon)

This is the stupidest, dumbest theory i have EVER heard. At least other theories give a motive and a different story! Not some rubbish that you cant see a plane imprint on the wall or that you cant see the plane on the grass...

Itââ‚ ¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s an explosion! When that happens things donââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t say intact and also the plane went 3 buildings in!

Its human nature to want to know more but there isnââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t any evidence what-so-ever to back up this sadistic fantasy from some screw-ball with far too much time on their hands and no friends. People actually died and people have lost dads, mums, children, brothers and sisters you cannot forget the plane that was hijacked, nor the people who died on it. You cannot dismiss evidence if it doesnââ‚ƚ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢t suit your needs and then make up and distort other evidence if it DOES back up your story.

Give me:

1) A motive
2) What caused the explosion if it wasnâ₠¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢t the plane?
3) Why did the government cover it up?
4) What happened to that plane and the victims?

Originally Posted by Pierre

Just a theory, I don't have any answers.

Or any real evidence...

No, but I am a Chartered Civil Engineer and do have some structural knowledge reading the website you advised me to read. The Pentagon advised on how they had recently reinforced the structure of the building. Sufficient enough to stop a plane, but not it's nose. I do note that they have now changed that to engine.

Sorry, who's this "they"? The only people I'm aware of who are asserting that the *nose* of the plane went right through are the conspiracy theorists.

As to why only *one* engine penetrated, as a Civil Engineer consider if one hit a structural support and the other just a blank wall, one would lose a lot more momentum than the other, wouldn't it?

And by the way, NO I don't think we landed on the moon either.

Originally Posted by gazzae

There was a program on ages ago about crash tests. I remember they were doing tests like a train crashing to one of the containers they use to transport nuclear waste.

O/T for this thread, but that "test" was actually pretty damn worthless!

The train had a very soft nose, the container was not placed in a situation where there was any resistance to movement (eg a bridge pier, tunnel wall or other such objects), the train "rode up" over the container after the initial impact etc, all of these were *not* representative of the sort of situation container like this could face in a real accident.

See http://homepage.ntlworld.com/hentis/Opsma****.html for details.

EDIT: Oh, ye gods! The link is supposed to say "Op smash it" but it's been censored because there's four letters that spell something rude!

Maybe a near-by zoo put a hippo into a cannon and sshot him at the pentagon