smoking and the pub

[Nugget]

Originally Posted by Gareth

Maybe we should just ban pubs instead - that would be a lot simpler, in my opinion, as we'd all lose out!

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by clarie

If we are acknowledging that passive smoking is dangerous I can't see why there is even a debate here. Why should the dangerous habit of a minority be allowed to risk the healths of the majority. It is truly ridiculous and only allowed because smoking has been around for so long.

Non-smokers do not have to expose themselves to passive smoking.
So what's the problem?
Why the need for the ban?

Should we ban base jumping? It can lead to death, and although I can protect myself by not partaking in it, I may slip up and paticipate and risk my life!
Or how about underwear? People die in underwear incidents every year, I can protect myself by choosing to go commando, but what if my gf leaves her knickers on the floor and I trip on them and fall down the stairs to my death?

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Non-smokers do not have to expose themselves to passive smoking.
So what's the problem?
Why the need for the ban?

*sigh* Because the non-smokers say so.

[lippy]

Originally Posted by clarie

Why on earth would a non-smoker want to go into a sealed smoking room?

Why on earth eh!..but you come into pubs which (by law) allow smoking!

Stamp your feet all you want but you're not making much sense!

[clarie]

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Non-smokers do not have to expose themselves to passive smoking.
So what's the problem?
Why the need for the ban?

Honestly speaking we have been over this point so many times in this thread that I am not sure for the need to go there again. But to summarise:
a) Pubs are a place of work - the health of the staff must be considered. People seem to think it's fine and if the staff don't want to work in a smoky pub they don't have to, but others have pointed out that it's not always that easy.
b) Why should the choice of where I want to go be decided by whether or not I want to inhale someone else's smoke? Currently smokers dominate the pub-going population - even if they are not in the majority their combined smoke makes the whole place stink.
c) It may encourage some smokers to quit.

[Chris W]

Claire and Orangebird-

A warning from the Team has already been posted in this thread today- and obviously ignored by you two. If anyone continues to post off topic comments discussing each others posting style/ insults or anything else irrelevant then action will be taken against the people involved.

The Team do not post warnings in thread just for fun- you must pay attention them.

If you have a problem with each other that is not related to this topic, either take it to PM, or if there are posts from now on in this topic that need the Team's attention use the report post link. Perhaps the "ignore" option is worth considering as well...

[SlackDad]

Originally Posted by SlackDad

I know, before anybody reminds me, that you can't ignore one issue just because little is being done about another, but did this article (from Gareth's post) not at least make anybody think where the Government should have started?

Every year, according to a paper published by the British Medical Journal, some 54 bar staff in the UK die as a result of their exposure to other people's cigarette smoke. And every year, according to the EU, some 39,000 deaths in this country are caused or hastened by air pollution, most of which comes from vehicles. This is a problem three orders of magnitude greater than the one that has filled the newspapers for the past six months, and no one is talking about it.




Taken from here, (originally posted by Gareth).

Just me then. And I live on a busy street and my son hardly ever goes into pubs.

[clarie]

Originally Posted by lippy

Stamp your feet all you want but you're not making much sense!

How am I 'stamping my feet' and how am I not making much sense? Can you really imagine many non-smokers (people who choose not to smoke because of the negative effects) choosing to enter a room that is sealed and designed specifically for smokers, when there large part of the pub is smoke free?

Originally Posted by clarie

If we are acknowledging that passive smoking is dangerous I can't see why there is even a debate here. Why should the dangerous habit of a minority be allowed to risk the healths of the majority. It is truly ridiculous and only allowed because smoking has been around for so long.

Smoking is bad for your health, and yes passive smoking is also. Why we are debating the right to smoke or not to smoke in a public house is because a complete ban, that inflicts itself on individual freedom of choice, which is everybodys right, smoker or non-smoker, is bad. Smoking is not illegal, therfore you should have a democratic right as to your own personal choice.

[Gareth]

Originally Posted by SlackDad

Just me then. And I live on a busy street and my son hardly ever goes into pubs.

'fraid so, mate. It's a vote-loser not a vote-winner.

[clarie]

Originally Posted by NEONKNIGHT

Why we are debating the right to smoke or not to smoke in a public house is because a complete ban, that inflicts itself on individual freedom of choice, which is everybodys right, smoker or non-smoker, is bad. Smoking is not illegal, therfore you should have a democratic right as to your own personal choice.

With the ban you can still exercise your personal right to smoke in private or outside. As the situation currently stands, there is a large majority of smoking pubs, so the non-smokers who are in the majority, are not well catered for. The new legislation on pubs that serve food will hopefully be a step towards a total ban. But whatever happens, unless smoking becomes banned altogether, smokers will still have the right to continue their habit in private. Please remember that you are not currently allowed to smoke in shops, many cinemas, many shopping centres, and many airports, and no one seems to complain about that.

[Pia]

Can i just say... How long do any of you even spend in the pub??

Point is, if the ban is going to happen it will happen. None of the CF Members are going to be able to change it no matter how much they all bitch at each other.

We will get used to it, either way.

By the way, i'm getting a bit tired of reading 'smokers' like we are some alien universe. There's an awful lot of stereotyping and judging going on in this thread. Whether you are a smoker, drinker, gambler, shopaholic or heroin addict everyone is the same and should be treated so.
I can see the points about smoking, as it obviously is bad for your health, as are a lot of things.

I 've always said i wish they would up the price of a packet of fags to sbout £200 then it could be reserved for the rich, without making it totally illegal which would just encourage more shipping from overseas. etc..!

I am a smoker, a very considerate one by the way.

[SlackDad]

Originally Posted by clarie

But whatever happens, unless smoking becomes banned altogether, smokers will still have the right to continue their habit in private. Please remember that you are not currently allowed to smoke in shops, many cinemas, many shopping centres, and many airports, and no one seems to complain about that.

Good point but I suppose it has alot to do with tradition. Alcohol and smoking are closely associated in many people's minds, hence why when trying to give up it's a good idea not to go in a pub. Not so much because of the smoke but because of the psychological associations.

[orangebird]

Originally Posted by Pia

Can i just say... How long do any of you even spend in the pub??

Most evenings.....

[clarie]

Originally Posted by Pia

By the way, i'm getting a bit tired of reading 'smokers' like we are some alien universe. There's an awful lot of stereotyping and judging going on in this thread. Whether you are a smoker, drinker, gambler, shopaholic or heroin addict everyone is the same and should be treated so.

I hear what you're saying - I think it's happening a little both ways to be honest. Like 'smokers are ****, 'non-smokers are holier-than-thou snobs'. I think if the debate continues we should refer more to the habit itself than the person who does it. Earlier on there seemed to be some confusion that smokers would be excluded from non-smoking establishments, whereas in fact it is the act of smoking itself, rather than the person that is to be excluded.