Coop Bars Christian Voice For Anti-Homosexual Views

[cookie_365]

Number of issues getting mixed up together, I think.

Well, this CV organisation doesn't like me very much, does it, though I can't remember meeting any of them so I'm not sure what I did to upset them

I'm not too bothered about them losing their bank account, but on the other hand suppose the bank had a Christian ethos and forced, say, the Pride organisers to close their account because of their 'pro-homosexual' views? I'd be pretty angry about that.

Companies have got a right to choose who they do business with, but what if no other bank wants to do business with them? I can't see its right that they shouldn't be able to have a bank account because of their (legal) views. Whose responsibility is that?

I don't want to be asked about my politics/sexuality/beliefs when I go to open a bank account, I just expect to get treated the same as any other customer. In this case it's an organisation rather than an individual, but the principle is the same.

I think the best message the Co-Op could have sent would have been to say 'you may be a bunch of bigots, but we're not, we accept anyone for who they are, so we'll continue your account and treat you just like our other customers, because that's the difference between nice ethical people like us and nasty bigots like you'.

Incidentally, no-one's mentioned the right of Co-Op staff to be treated with dignity and respect. I wonder if these CV people had got the sense/courtesy to keep their bigotry to themselves if they ever found themselves dealing with a bank employee who was/they thought was gay?

[Russ]

Originally Posted by punky

Maybe not CV, but plenty of their ilk blow up abortion clinics and attack doctors, etc.

Well seeing as this is about CV and not 'their ilk', that argument seems a little impotent at the moment.

Originally Posted by angyl

Attacking arguments by crying "politically correct" or "the PC brigade" is intellectually vaccuous. Can we have an intelligent discourse or I'll start on about hangers and floggers

Intellectually vaccuous until you see rules being changed purely on the basis of being politically correct and 'appeasing the opressed' as I see this to be.

Originally Posted by greencreeper

Well terrorism isn't really any of those things - it's the fear of those things.

So have CV been suspected of doing any of those things? Have they threatened violence, death etc? If not then I can't see how they spread the fear of anything.

Originally Posted by cookie_365

Incidentally, no-one's mentioned the right of Co-Op staff to be treated with dignity and respect. I wonder if these CV people had got the sense/courtesy to keep their bigotry to themselves if they ever found themselves dealing with a bank employee who was/they thought was gay?

Unfounded assumption - we don't know if any CV member has caused any hassle or problems for any gay staff member, although some people would like to think they had.

When did I become angyl? Or is that just a politically correct way of demonstrating I'm in touch with my feminine side
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Originally Posted by Russ D

Intellectually vaccuous until you see rules being changed purely on the basis of being politically correct and 'appeasing the opressed' as I see this to be.

Well you'd better define politically correct then -there is a liberal conundrum with this topic, hence the tenor of my initial post and the interesting debate that should ensue. Pulling the old PC rabbit out of the hat adds nowt. And appeasing the opressed? Hmmm.

Unfounded assumption - we don't know if any CV member has caused any hassle or problems for any gay staff member, although some people would like to think they had.

Where I believe the Co-op is on firm ground is the difficulty gay members of staff may have serving a client so deeply homophobic. As a comparison, a black person serving a Ku Klux Klan member?

[Russ]

Originally Posted by andyl

When did I become angyl? Or is that just a politically correct way of demonstrating I'm in touch with my feminine side

You become angy when I have a 2 year old child climbing over me when I post
__________________

Originally Posted by andyl

Well you'd better define politically correct then -there is a liberal conundrum with this topic, hence the tenor of my initial post and the interesting debate that should ensue. Pulling the old PC rabbit out of the hat adds nowt. And appeasing the opressed? Hmmm.

The oppressed group here being homosexuals?

Originally Posted by andyl

Where I believe the Co-op is on firm ground is the difficulty gay members of staff may have serving a client so deeply homophobic. As a comparison, a black person serving a Ku Klux Klan member?

AFAIC as long as the KKK member you're referring to keeps his opinions to himself or a CV member being served by a gay employee keeping shtum about his/her views then I don't see a problem with that encounter/transaction.

How would a gay Co-op Bank member of staff who knows anything about CV feel when someone visits a branch with, say, a cheque book identified as "Christian Voice Current Account"? The organisation publicises it's views.

PS. It was the 'appeasing' I was perplexed at.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by andyl

How would a gay Co-op Bank member of staff who knows anything about CV feel when someone visits a branch with, say, a cheque book identified as "Christian Voice Current Account"?

Probably similar to how I'd feel if I worked in a bank and was serving a skinhead in a Arsenal top (I'm a Man United supporter). Unlikely reference? Possibly but I'm sure not all the CV would have such ferocious views.

Originally Posted by andyl

PS. It was the 'appeasing' I was perplexed at.

Why? It's almost customery for companies to make decisions which favour the oppressed in society.

[allieyoung666]

Originally Posted by Russ D

Probably similar to how I'd feel if I worked in a bank and was serving a skinhead in a Arsenal top (I'm a Man United supporter). Unlikely reference? Possibly but I'm sure not all the CV would have such ferocious views.



Why? It's almost customery for companies to make decisions which favour the oppressed in society.

You say that comment Russ as if you resent the oppressed in todays society

[Russ]

Originally Posted by allieyoung666

You say that comment Russ as if you resent the oppressed in todays society

Absolutely not - what I do resent is token gestures disguised as responsible decisions.

[allieyoung666]

very true

[punky]

Originally Posted by andyl

Where I believe the Co-op is on firm ground is the difficulty gay members of staff may have serving a client so deeply homophobic. As a comparison, a black person serving a Ku Klux Klan member?

As many probably know, I spend a lot of time out in Florida. There still are too many dumbarses walking around with confederate crap on themselves. I was standing at the counter of a certain fast food establishment, waiting for a special order to be cooked, so I let the line through. The guy behind me was a redneck with a confederate t-shirt and confederate bandana. You would have thought the civil war was still on. The redneck was very rude and disrespectful to the black server, but he did nothing, said nothing served him and that was that. I said to the black guy: "You really have to put up with s**t?", he just sort of shrugged and said it didn't bother him.

That black guy was great. You can't stop people being racist, but you can deny them the pleasure of hate by rising above it. The same applies for sexuality issues.

[Flubflow]

The Christian Voice org is totally out of step with society, the government and the law in terms of sexual orientation discrimination. They must surely realise that they have no hope of reversing or stopping what has already gone on. Their homophobic pronouncements seem to be made as a modern day recruitment drive for other homophobes to join their clan rather than some embarrassing biblical reference that they otherwise might only bring out in closed meetings or low key theological discussions. The effect of what they loudly proclaim just divides our society rather than bring it together.

I think it is perfectly apt that a company that aligns itself with diversity and tolerance should get rid of anyone with such outdated biggoted views as the CV.
I find it quite obtuse that the CV think that they are ones that are being discriminated against on religious grounds. One gets the impression that some religious groups are incapable of looking inward and think that the best form of defence is to attack.

Originally Posted by Russ D

Probably similar to how I'd feel if I worked in a bank and was serving a skinhead in a Arsenal top (I'm a Man United supporter). Unlikely reference? Possibly but I'm sure not all the CV would have such ferocious views.

Supporting United or Arsenal is a lifestyle choice

Why? It's almost customery for companies to make decisions which favour the oppressed in society?

And what colour is the sky in your world. Business, generally, is interested only in business. The Co-op may well be making a pitch to an 'ethical' market but customary for companues to favout the oppressed - that is complete and utter crap. If so, then we would not have poverty.
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And Russ, anyone who joins CV without understanding what they stand for is clearly not intelligent enbough to be allowed a bank account without a guardian's signature.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by andyl

And Russ, anyone who joins CV without understanding what they stand for is clearly not intelligent enbough to be allowed a bank account without a guardian's signature.

You think the only people who join them are those who agree 100% with everything they stand for?

Come on....seriously, tell me you don't really think that?

Originally Posted by Russ D

You think the only people who join them are those who agree 100% with everything they stand for?

Come on....seriously, tell me you don't really think that?

Their anti-homosexuality stance is pretty explicit so they'd have to be pretty numb not to spot it and therefore agree with it. So, yes, I'd say 100% agreement with that viewpoint.

[Russ]

Originally Posted by andyl

Their anti-homosexuality stance is pretty explicit so they'd have to be pretty numb not to spot it and therefore agree with it. So, yes, I'd say 100% agreement with that viewpoint.

Interesting...you surprise me.