Coronavirus (OLD)

Originally Posted by papa smurf

Can she be fined both in England and scotland for breaking the rules in two different countries.

I would guess so

Maybe one force will decline to follow up on account of the other handling it but theoretically she broke two different laws in two different countries.

[pip08456]

Originally Posted by Damien

I would guess so

Maybe one force will decline to follow up on account of the other handling it but theoretically she broke two different laws in two different countries.

I would think travelling from Scotland to London while having symptoms would've breached Scottish law.

The return journey after recieving a positive result would've breached English law.
Of and in itself that is two different possible chrges.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by pip08456

She's also reported herself to the police. It will be interesting what action they will/will not take.

Looking at this article, she only reported it after being found out or forced to own up(eg being asked "why aren't you in London", and possibly had to be told to report it by the SNP's Westminster leader. "Will be" is future tense.

He said: "Margaret will be referring herself to the parliamentary standards commissioner as well as the police. I am tonight suspending the whip from Margaret."

All the people who travelled on the same trains(s) are going to be pleased at having to self-isolate for 14 days.
Link

If you've got an alert telling you that you've spent time near someone who has tested positive for coronavirus, then you will have to stay at home for 14 days. It can take up to 14 days for symptoms to appear. People in your household will not need to isolate unless you develop symptoms.

Wouldn't that also apply to those in the House of Commons?

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by papa smurf

Can she be fined both in England and scotland for breaking the rules in two different countries.

I hope so. What a hypocrite. She was outspoken in her criticism of Cummings.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

I hope so. What a hypocrite. She was outspoken in her criticism of Cummings.

At least he was:-
1) Not travelling on public transport
2) Not meeting anybody, ie he was self-isolating.
3) Was acting purely in the interests of a young child, who might have found themselves with 2 incapacitated parents.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by nomadking

At least he was:-
1) Not travelling on public transport
2) Not meeting anybody, ie he was self-isolating.
3) Was acting purely in the interests of a young child, who might have found themselves with 2 incapacitated parents.

We can't assume "purely" and self-isolating doesn't mean driving 300 miles! But compared to catching a train to Scotland his behaviour was saintly.

[Pierre]

Well I couldn’t give a toss about the SNP person. Same way I didn’t give a toss about Cummings, or Kinnock or anyone.

We’re now a week into the sudden rise of infections.

One the attached images shows a definitive second wave of infections.

The second attachment shows the deaths. By this time next week if the death rate hasn’t rapidly shot upwards by at least a factor of 10 then there is an obvious disconnect between infection rate and death rate compared to the first wave.

It will be argued that there was much less testing first time around. Which is right.

But then I would suggest then that the “infection rate”: is the wrong metric on which to use them “whack a mole” strategy, as it is obvious the infection rate does not correlate to death/ hospital rate.

For judging whether to put extra restrictions on an area must surely be on the capability of the area to manage hospital cases. If the hospitals can not handle any more Covid cases, close the area down.

But if there is plenty of capacity, crack on.

[RichardCoulter]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Restrictions largely ignored. Obviously businesses have shut at 10pm

But apart from that, the rule of 6 and pretty much every other rule has been ignored, and I can guarantee the the new rule of no houses mixing will new equally ignored.

I strongly suspect that you are right.

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

I don’t think it was Corbyn’s fault, to be honest. Diane Abbott said he was well within the maximum number allowed.

---------- Post added at 19:49 ---------- Previous post was at 19:47 ----------



She could have walked after all.

---------- Post added at 19:55 ---------- Previous post was at 19:49 ----------



Christmas will be interesting. People round here have no intention of keeping to groups of six for Christmas dinner. I don’t think they have enough inspectors to catch anything more than a very small minority of the population and I dare say that not many will want to work on Christmas Day!

Don’t the police need a warrant to come into your premises without permission?

Not neccessarily. The police can enter without a warrant in some cases e.g. if they have reasonable suspicion to believe that a crime is currently taking place. They are entitled to enter public houses at any time day or night (but not private living accomodation). Any letting rooms can be inspected unless they are currently occupied by guests.

---------- Post added at 23:01 ---------- Previous post was at 22:45 ----------

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

He's independent of political party so I guess he is protesting and hoping it will help his popularity, whilst knowing that the Government has the ultimate power here.

What I don't understand is how the Government could give lockdown instructions to the devolved nations. They have their own Parliaments which are now deciding on Covid rules, so it must be a devolved power, but the PM was able to ,rock down the whole of the UK last March

---------- Post added at 23:22 ---------- Previous post was at 23:01 ----------

Originally Posted by papa smurf

Coronavirus: Tougher rules for Liverpool, Warrington, Hartlepool and Middlesbrough - but one mayor vows to defy them

Tougher coronavirus restrictions are being imposed on four new areas - but one mayor says they are "damaging" and he will not accept them.



The rebellion is underway don't stand too close to the fan.

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavir...-them-12086656

Well, any law is only as valid as the number of people who respect it and are prepared to obey it. Rightly or wrongly, a lot of people are now flouting the restrictions out of ignorance, confusion, political protest or fatigue.

I had a phone call last week from the office that deals with anything I need whilst shielding. Unusually, I was asked questions about my experience of people wearing masks or not, complying with the restrictions in my neighbourhood or not etc.

I mentioned this to a friend who (along with his partner and two sons) are also getting paid to take Covid 19 tests every week for a year and he has received a similar phone call. I wonder if the Government is trying to subtly find out if people are taking any notice of them??

Payments for Covid 19 tests by the Government (for selected people) are as follows:

Swab nose and throat tests every week- £50 for first test, then £25 per subsequent test for each family member. In addition a blood test is taken once a month- extra £50 for first blood test, then £25 for each subsequent test per family member.

This is scheduled to last for 12 months, so it's a nice little earner for my friend as between him and his family they will receive £6420 over the year and this may be extended.

Ironically, he told me that he'd have been prepared to do it for free to know that him & his family were free of Covid. Now, imagine all the other people being paid to take tests and it won't be an insignificant sum, but what the heck, it's only taxpayers money and/or Government debt that will meet the cost!!!

[pip08456]

What I don't understand is how the Government could give lockdown instructions to the devolved nations. They have their own Parliaments which are now deciding on Covid rules, so it must be a devolved power, but the PM was able to ,rock down the whole of the UK last March

Power to decide their own covid response was given to them after the initial lockdown.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by Pierre

Well I couldn’t give a toss about the SNP person. Same way I didn’t give a toss about Cummings, or Kinnock or anyone.

We’re now a week into the sudden rise of infections.

One the attached images shows a definitive second wave of infections.

The second attachment shows the deaths. By this time next week if the death rate hasn’t rapidly shot upwards by at least a factor of 10 then there is an obvious disconnect between infection rate and death rate compared to the first wave.

It will be argued that there was much less testing first time around. Which is right.

But then I would suggest then that the “infection rate”: is the wrong metric on which to use them “whack a mole” strategy, as it is obvious the infection rate does not correlate to death/ hospital rate.

For judging whether to put extra restrictions on an area must surely be on the capability of the area to manage hospital cases. If the hospitals can not handle any more Covid cases, close the area down.

But if there is plenty of capacity, crack on.

It’d also be argued that treatments are better and care homes less exposed.

Infection rate alone is a bad metric to use. The direction of travel, who is getting infected, testing capacity and success or otherwise of contact tracing all have to be considered.

A random figure like say 10,000 cases a day wouldn’t be awful if we had high confidence we were finding and isolating them and their close contacts quickly. With testing capacity to make those available to those who need them quickly.

10,000 cases a day when it’s taking a week to get test results, many can’t book tests and we’ve a low confidence in track and trace is a different kettle of fish.

Scenario 1 can very quickly go out of control.

[1andrew1]

Delays in the government-funded testing programme mean schools both state and private are now going private for testing. Despite the £10bn the government's spent on it.

Schools are turning to private Covid-19 testing to avoid staff missing work because of delays in the government’s test and trace system.

Dozens of private schools and a small number of state schools say it is cheaper to pay for tests than fund supply teachers while staff self-isolate as they await results.

Dan Moynihan, the chief executive of Harris Academies, a chain of 48 state schools that have purchased a “small number” of tests for use in “a few cases”, said delays could mean that schools had to bring in supply staff for 4 or 5 days as symptomatic teachers waited for a result, at a cost of up to £200 a day — far more costly than a test.

“We’ve identified some clinics in London that'll give you the test for between £150-£180,” he said.

https://www.ft.com/content/74843919-...b-dddd93bce2b9

[tweetiepooh]

Me thinks the Corby/Johnson Snr incidents are not really a problem. Yes they break the letter of the law but may not break the spirit of the law and even to the letter the infringement is pretty minor. (Maybe Johnson Snr asked if he could enter without mask and shop was empty. So the dinner party had 7 or 8 people instead of 6, it's a bit like driving at 75 on the motorway in good conditions/light traffic etc, yes it breaks the law and you can be stopped but it's not what the law is really intended for.

We shouldn't need such precise laws for Covid, it should be enough to have them as enforcible guidelines and the police with ability to use discretion and handle accordingly where needed. But the plonkers would just keep push around the boundaries in more "dangerous" ways.

A certain Mr Trump seems to have caught it ...

[1andrew1]

Good straightforward US article on home-testing.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says it’ll be mid-2021 before a Covid-19 vaccine is available in quantities sufficient to “get back to our regular life.” Does that mean nine more months of lockdown? Not necessarily. There’s an alternative: repeated, frequent, rapid at-home testing. At least one such test, Abbott Labs ’ BinaxNOW, is already being produced for the government. Others are in development.

Details vary, but each is simple enough to be self-administered. With the BinaxNow test, you swab the front of your nose, insert the swab into one side of a small card, add saline to the other side, close the card, and see if the reader on the front lights up green or red. A phone app records a negative result for use as a digital passport.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/beat-co...nion_lead_pos9

[joglynne]

Although this video has been produced as a result of Mr Trumps admission to hospital it is a pretty good run down by Dr Mike Hanson who specializes in (and is board certified in) internal medicine, pulmonary disease, and critical care medicine.on the treatment of Covid-19 in hospital.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekOB...ctorMikeHansen

Thanks for the link go to our old friend Ignitionnet.