Sandboxie - A Virtual Protection

Originally Posted by Osem

So it seems the OP isn't using the product according to its creator's own instructions then. If so, his computer could already be infected with something couldn't it?

A legacy of happy childhood playtime I reckon...

Instead of making ridiculous statements, I suggest an easy outlet for you. Just forget Sandboxie and carry on with your constantly outdated AV. nobody minds, we can all be happy. And to even more astound you, the OP has used Sandboxie for 10 years exactly to the creators instructions and never had a serious infection in all that time.

Please don`t make silly speculations about my PC being infected. My PC is absolutely clean and has been for a very long time, thanks to Sandboxie.

Just for your personal education, I would point out as you obviously do not understand the first principles of virtual protection, that Sandboxie is the best stopper on the market to prevent incoming infections to your PC. Sandboxie does not prevent outgoing threats and that is why you back it up with an AV. Also for the occasions you have to access the web unsandboxed.

To tax your brain even further, do you know why a parachutist wears a reserve ?
Probably not but I will explain - to use in case the main parachute malfunctions.

[mart44]

I dunno Wittmann, Osem could be right. I'm old enough to be in my second childhood now with the distinct prospect of becoming uploaded to the cloud. Uninstalled a bit sooner than I'd like to be. Another session on the flatbed scanner will tell one way or the other. However, 'playing', as he refers to it, has always been an interest. Backed up with a couple of disk images, I'm happy to try more or less anything. Sort of thing I do enjoy truth be told.

---------- Post added at 10:54 ---------- Previous post was at 09:39 ----------

Wittmann, you advised me not to post a while back. Can I offer the same advice? I feel it's become pointless now. People have their views and nobody on either side will change their minds. I don't think Sandboxie, or perhaps even sandboxing in general, will be taken up. Not even with other measures in place.

I do like to try various softwares but even so, you can perhaps imagine the time that went into being able to say at least something about those programs that include sandboxes. When a post about them gets treated with sarcasm (taken to be that because of the wink) it kind of lets a person know it's time to stop.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Wittmann

Instead of making ridiculous statements, I suggest an easy outlet for you. Just forget Sandboxie and carry on with your constantly outdated AV. nobody minds, we can all be happy. And to even more astound you, the OP has used Sandboxie for 10 years exactly to the creators instructions and never had a serious infection in all that time.

Please don`t make silly speculations about my PC being infected. My PC is absolutely clean and has been for a very long time, thanks to Sandboxie.

Just for your personal education, I would point out as you obviously do not understand the first principles of virtual protection, that Sandboxie is the best stopper on the market to prevent incoming infections to your PC. Sandboxie does not prevent outgoing threats and that is why you back it up with an AV. Also for the occasions you have to access the web unsandboxed.

To tax your brain even further, do you know why a parachutist wears a reserve ?
Probably not but I will explain - to use in case the main parachute malfunctions.

You do like calling people names don't you. Very mature I must say.

As an ordinary PC user I posed a very simple and logical question that if you're not using the product you have so much faith in according to the maker's own instructions (i.e. with no other AV or updates) then how would you know your PC isn't infected with something lying there in the background? Now if I've misinterpreted your previous comments, please feel free to educate us all rather than blurting out insults.

Perhaps you could address yourself to the genuine questions people are raising in response to your OP rather than name calling. Thus far all you've done is refer people to another site and claimed a lack of technical knowledge when pressed for answers.

It's ironic that you talk about reserve parachutes but claimed you don't need one because Sandboxie does all.
As for the old 'I've never had a serious infection blah, blah,...' well neither have I since I first started using the internet via Win 98. Not bad for someone who clearly knows nothing and has stupidly only relied upon free AV, firewalls etc. over all those years eh?

[qasdfdsaq]

Originally Posted by Osem

As for the old 'I've never had a serious infection blah, blah,...' well neither have I since I first started using the internet via Win 98. Not bad for someone who clearly knows nothing and has stupidly only relied upon free AV, firewalls etc. over all those years eh?

Hah! I've had a serious infection. Of influenza. But yeah, there's a logical fallacy about claiming you're safe against something simply because it hasn't happened yet - I can't name it though. But to illustrate, I've never died yet. Does that mean I'm 100% safe against ever dying?

---------- Post added at 11:47 ---------- Previous post was at 11:45 ----------

Originally Posted by mart44

I don't think Sandboxie, or perhaps even sandboxing in general, will be taken up. Not even with other measures in place.

As mentioned earlier, advanced antivirus suites are already taking up sandboxing, including sandboxing the entire OS. It's not yet common, and comes with quite a lot of disadvantages, which is why it's currently only taken up by the most security-conscious of corporations.

---------- Post added at 11:49 ---------- Previous post was at 11:47 ----------

Originally Posted by Wittmann

To tax your brain even further, do you know why a parachutist wears a reserve ?
Probably not but I will explain - to use in case the main parachute malfunctions.

Except in your case you've claimed the main parachute is a waste of time and haven't worn it for 3 years.

[Osem]

Originally Posted by Wittmann

IMPORTANT - Sandboxie encloses the entire browser, plus any other programs or browsers you have on your PC by individual selection, even Email.

The sandboxes that other programs have are contained within either the program or within the browser.

No comparison whatsoever.

Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq

Wrong. Advanced antivirus programs sandbox Windows itself.

Originally Posted by Stuart
It also appears to offer little or no protection against attacks where a virus infects another machine on the network, then starts scanning that network for other machines it can infect. All they need is a network share with bad security and the ability to create processes on a remote machine. Both things that SandboxIE probably will not protect against, and therefore would be unable to sandbox the virus.

Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq

This is a very good point that I missed. Even if Sandboxie's protection of your own machine were 100% perfect, allowing web browsing through it by nature depends on allowing applications to send and receive network data. In addition to your example, they could also use remote code execution exploits against other machines on your network, not necessarily even PCs. They could infect your phones, tablets, consoles, and so forth, all from within the sandbox. And any virus out to steal your data could easily do so, and send that data back to it's creator, well before you close down the sandbox. Sandboxie could potentially block that by blocking local network access, but that's not it's job, that's the job of a firewall or IDS.

Originally Posted by Wittmann View Post
To tax your brain even further, do you know why a parachutist wears a reserve ?
Probably not but I will explain - to use in case the main parachute malfunctions.

Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq

Except in your case you've claimed the main parachute is a waste of time and haven't worn it for 3 years.

Some questions to be answered.

---------- Post added at 12:06 ---------- Previous post was at 11:55 ----------

Originally Posted by qasdfdsaq

Hah! I've had a serious infection. Of influenza. But yeah, there's a logical fallacy about claiming you're safe against something simply because it hasn't happened yet - I can't name it though. But to illustrate, I've never died yet. Does that mean I'm 100% safe against ever dying?

Course not, but I trust that when you finally depart to meet your maker you'll be buried in a sandbox.

[mart44]

To set a point straight before signing off from the thread. I now realise that Osem was joking rather than being sarcastic. I misinterpreted the intention because of general feeling in the thread. Apologies to him for that.

Mart

But yeah, there's a logical fallacy about claiming you're safe against something simply because it hasn't happened yet

Reverse Slippery Slope Fallacy....

[Osem]

Some interesting posts have been added to the Sandboxie thread, the last on page 1 made me chuckle.

http://forums.sandboxie.com/phpBB3/v...hp?f=5&t=20827

It'd be great if we could arrive at some form of consensus regarding this programme and how helpful it might be.

[Osem]

Having come across the SBIE forum earlier it seems our erstwhile OP learned something from this thread as he's now using AV in addition to Sandboxie. A good result for CF I'd say.

[techguyone]

Heh I missed this, first time round, the whole thing made me chuckle tbh.

Wittmann: Instead of making ridiculous statements, I suggest an easy outlet for you. Just forget Sandboxie and carry on with your constantly outdated AV

HE started the thread in the first place, made a poor choice of statement then spent the rest of the thread refusing to accept it - still made an amusing 10 mins reading it.

[Kymmy]

Probably one of the best techs versus wannabee threads in a long time.. Sandboxie standalone devotees are just fooling themselves.

[qasdfdsaq]

Oh wow, this thread. Oh the memories.

---------- Post added at 19:44 ---------- Previous post was at 19:32 ----------

Hah, just had a look at the thread over on SBIE's forums. I'd place even less faith in the product now given the lead developer seems to prefer siding with ignorant egomaniacs while being unaware of some pretty major features of competitors in his target market.

Trusting a security application whose lead developer doesn't know how other leading security applications work? No thanks.

[mart44]

Looks like there was enough interest in Sandboxie to go back and have another read about it. As quite rightly said, it is best to use Sandboxie in conjunction with other measures. I think what happened back in March set a poor opinion about Sandboxie. A little research outside of opinions on the forum may or may not dispel that. Perhaps research using the term 'sandboxie good bad'.

Sandboxie doesn't always run without a hitch. Work sometimes has to be done and updates issued as new operating systems, programs and browser versions are released. Also, the programs Sandboxie users want to run in sandboxes are so numerous that I think there will always be work needed to keep up with it. I'm not sure the developers need to have detailed knowledge of the workings of other programs but I think what does matter is that, when a problem is reported, it is actively worked on. This does look to be what happens.

I've been using Sandboxie for about 9 years. It has been necessary to stop using it when a browser or operating system update has temporarily broken it. However, I always return when the problem has been overcome. This being because I place a fair amount of faith in the program and the particular way it works.

I don't use Sandboxie to its full capabilities but just for browsing the Internet. Certainly my first line of defence against zero day threats and drive-by malware. If Sandboxie was to fail however, other layers of security are in place to hopefully deal with it. I have always run Sandboxie as part of a layered approach to security. Other Sandboxie users probably have too.

I don't want to enter into a lengthy 'It is good - No it isn't' debate since opinions are set but the fact that the program is now treated with ridicule here does go a bit against the grain, hence this post. I don't believe the program deserves it. Opinions about Sandboxie seem mostly positive elsewhere. I have to say that I take no notice either way. Sandboxie has indeed saved the day on a few occasions over the years and this is why I continue to use it.

[Osem]

The trouble with this area is that for ordinary people like me, it's really quite confusing. Of course I'd love a simple, all encompassing security product but there clearly isn't one. I believe this is the main reason why quite a lot of people don't seem to use AV at all whether that be on their computers or phones and tablets. Equally I feel it's understandable why people with little detailed knowledge might be unintentionally lulled into believing that one product or another is all they need. It's a nice comforting thought after all. I have no 'allegiance' to any product, if someone could give me a better, simpler, all in one solution tomorrow I'd take it. Given that there are so many people out there whose main purpose in life is to come up with ways to exploit, undermine or negate security software I don't see that happening any time soon.

[qasdfdsaq]

Originally Posted by Osem

The trouble with this area is that for ordinary people like me, it's really quite confusing. Of course I'd love a simple, all encompassing security product but there clearly isn't one.

Nail. Head. Hit.

And we've only got the hackers malicious security crackers to blame for that. It's not much different to home security. Thanks to the ingenuity stupidity of criminals, there's no one-size-fits-all solution to all problems.