Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's Christmas C4 speech

[alferret]

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

I think a certain someone on here is just on a massive wind up constantly making provocative threads and responses and the best thing we can do is simply not reply to them.

You gotta love that ignore button (when I remember that I do have 1)

[chaos23]

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

I think a certain someone on here is just on a massive wind up constantly making provocative threads and responses and the best thing we can do is simply not reply to them.

Its no wind up. Many people have the same view from the comments i have been seeing on the news. Because someone has a view that you dont agree with you want to try and get everyone to ignore them.Is it that youy dont like the truth? What exactly is it that you dont like?

I'm going to reiterate what I asked chaos23 in post #36 and received no answer thus far.

I'm just wondering what YOU think of his mental capacity?

[demented]

I am glad that his christmas message was on. We badly need a different image of Iran over here. We need to talk to them properly, deal with them and with Barack Obama before he appointed Clinton as Sec of State I hoped the Henry Kissinger school of diplomacy was going out of the window wrt Iran. I don't particularly understand the outrage, it's not the first time he's said one thing to one group of people and one to another, when he was touring some US universities he was giving out a completely different message to at home. He's just a politician, he has to say stuff to appease the conservatives in Iran, the clerics, some of his message will be to bits of the Arab world.

Originally Posted by demented

I am glad that his christmas message was on. We badly need a different image of Iran over here. We need to talk to them properly, deal with them and with Barack Obama before he appointed Clinton as Sec of State I hoped the Henry Kissinger school of diplomacy was going out of the window wrt Iran. I don't particularly understand the outrage, it's not the first time he's said one thing to one group of people and one to another, when he was touring some US universities he was giving out a completely different message to at home. He's just a politician, he has to say stuff to appease the conservatives in Iran, the clerics, some of his message will be to bits of the Arab world.

The problem with Iran is it depends which faction you are talking to..In the end they all end up contradicting each other and you can never be really sure if the face you are talking to has any real power to do anything.This makes the country seem like it is suffering from a multiple personality disorder.

[demented]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

The problem with Iran is it depends which faction you are talking to..In the end they all end up contradicting each other and you can never be really sure if the face you are talking to has any real power to do anything.This makes the country seem like it is suffering from a multiple personality disorder.

Indeed and that's always been true. In a sense it is suffering from very contradictory forces. I think there's a lot more to work with though than there was say in the 1980s and even then Reagan's cronies managed to have an acceptable enough relationship to bribe these fundamentalists. The problem is the media has very short memories and spends a great deal of time painting people as (a) stupid (b) dictators rather than thinking about the real issues a country may have.

My point is that the US has never had a grown up relationship with Iran. In the early days before the coup it was just bothered about the Brits and oil. When the Shah's puppets were in charge it ignored things which would today be regarded as essential such as human rights and not selling loads of weapons without any consideration. Then after the Shah got deposed I think there was shock for a long time afterwards and some guilt about how infantile the relationship had been. We've virtually never spoken to Iran since even though Iran's changed. I'd rather the school of school yard diplomacy were left behind even though it'll be a long and hard road, we've got decades of work to make up for it that could start in January.

Originally Posted by demented

I am glad that his christmas message was on. We badly need a different image of Iran over here. We need to talk to them properly, deal with them and with Barack Obama before he appointed Clinton as Sec of State I hoped the Henry Kissinger school of diplomacy was going out of the window wrt Iran. I don't particularly understand the outrage, it's not the first time he's said one thing to one group of people and one to another, when he was touring some US universities he was giving out a completely different message to at home. He's just a politician, he has to say stuff to appease the conservatives in Iran, the clerics, some of his message will be to bits of the Arab world.

Clinton will be ok in that role, Her and her husband have understood the power of international diplomacy quite well. She will also be working with Obama and not against so his willingness to talk will win though and she would be well-equipped to deliver.

Really getting uneasy about the expectation level of what obama is going to achieve with so many groups feeling he is the solution to every problem i hope their right but i am not convinced. As for Iran it is hard to have a grown up relationship when they themselves can't decide half the time who and what they are. What we do know is the regime they have and how that regime works and while at some point diplomacy should be started Iran has to make some moves first to show good will as much as the west.

Originally Posted by RizzyKing

Really getting uneasy about the expectation level of what obama is going to achieve with so many groups feeling he is the solution to every problem i hope their right but i am not convinced. As for Iran it is hard to have a grown up relationship when they themselves can't decide half the time who and what they are. What we do know is the regime they have and how that regime works and while at some point diplomacy should be started Iran has to make some moves first to show good will as much as the west.

There is a growing concern (or so I am told) in Iran regarding their strained relations with the West. Allegedly, the country feels it is in a position to be a major player on the world stage, or at least a respected one, but their hostility to the outside world is holding this back.

So I think, with a more moderate 'face' of the West in Obama as opposed to the rather reactionary attitude of the soon-to-be previous incumbent will help dull the nutters in Iran. I think the actions of the last 8 years have fuelled the anti-Western feeling in the world. Obama would be great if he simply reverses that trend. I think he already is.

[chaos23]

Originally Posted by Maggy J

I'm going to reiterate what I asked chaos23 in post #36 and received no answer thus far.

Well as i am no psychiatrist and no assessment of his mental state has been undertaken, i would not know. From a laymans point of view, i would say there has been nothing to suggest that Ahmadinejad is not of a sound mind, quite the opposite actually. It was George Bush who said that he god told him to invade Iraq dont forget. If your looking to question someones mental capacity, maybe it should be his.

---------- Post added at 19:49 ---------- Previous post was at 19:44 ----------

Originally Posted by Damien

There is a growing concern (or so I am told) in Iran regarding their strained relations with the West. Allegedly, the country feels it is in a position to be a major player on the world stage, or at least a respected one, but their hostility to the outside world is holding this back.

So I think, with a more moderate 'face' of the West in Obama as opposed to the rather reactionary attitude of the soon-to-be previous incumbent will help dull the nutters in Iran. I think the actions of the last 8 years have fuelled the anti-Western feeling in the world. Obama would be great if he simply reverses that trend. I think he already is.

or at least a respected one, but their hostility to the outside world is holding this back.

Was it not Israel and the US that have threatend to attack Iran? Lets not forget the Iranians have not started a war in over 400 years, or barely changed their country border in over 4000 years

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by chaos23

Well as i am no psychiatrist and no assessment of his mental state has been undertaken, i would not know. From a laymans point of view, i would say there has been nothing to suggest that Ahmadinejad is not of a sound mind, quite the opposite actually. It was George Bush who said that he god told him to invade Iraq dont forget. If your looking to question someones mental capacity, maybe it should be his.

Are you saying those who talk with god are insane?

Was it not Israel and the US that have threatend to attack Iran? Lets not forget the Iranians have not started a war in over 400 years, or barely changed their country border in over 4000 years

Caveats dear boy, you really shouldn't exclude them you know, it does diminish the point you're making, although including them would also diminish it too I suppose.

Originally Posted by chaos23

Well as i am no psychiatrist and no assessment of his mental state has been undertaken, i would not know. From a laymans point of view, i would say there has been nothing to suggest that Ahmadinejad is not of a sound mind, quite the opposite actually. It was George Bush who said that he god told him to invade Iraq dont forget. If your looking to question someones mental capacity, maybe it should be his.

Actually, a Palestinian official, Nabil Shaath, said Bush said that to him - the White House denied this had actually happened; and another Palestinian leader, Mamhoud Abbas, said this wasn't what happened Link
"President Bush said that God guided him in what he should do, and this guidance led him to go to Afghanistan to rid it of terrorism after 9/11 and led him to Iraq to fight tyranny," he said.
"We understood that he was illustrating [in his comments] his strong faith and his belief that this is what God wanted." "

Which is a bit different from "God told him to invade Iraq".

I can't believe this - this is twice I have had to defend GWB, who I find politically and ethically abhorrent.

[Xaccers]

Originally Posted by foreverwar

I can't believe this - this is twice I have had to defend GWB, who I find politically and ethically abhorrent.

Can you understand now why I think Chaos is actually a Dubya lover?
Look at the number of threads he's started which has forced those who value the truth to actually defend Bush?
I still feel unclean from the last time!

[chaos23]

Originally Posted by foreverwar

Actually, a Palestinian official, Nabil Shaath, said Bush said that to him - the White House denied this had actually happened; and another Palestinian leader, Mamhoud Abbas, said this wasn't what happened Link
"President Bush said that God guided him in what he should do, and this guidance led him to go to Afghanistan to rid it of terrorism after 9/11 and led him to Iraq to fight tyranny," he said.
"We understood that he was illustrating [in his comments] his strong faith and his belief that this is what God wanted." "

Which is a bit different from "God told him to invade Iraq".

I can't believe this - this is twice I have had to defend GWB, who I find politically and ethically abhorrent.

LOL, you have really blown it: Please stop spouting your bile...........

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pre.../06/bush.shtml

"I feel like God wants me to run for President. I can't explain it, but I sense my country is going to need me. Something is going to happen... I know it won't be easy on me or my family, but God wants me to do it."
--George W. Bush commenting to Texas evangelist James Robinson in the run-up to his presidential campaign

"God told me to strike at al Qaeda and I struck them, and then he instructed me to strike at Saddam [Hussein], which I did, and now I am determined to solve the problem in the Middle East. If you help me I will act, and if not, the elections will come and I will have to focus on them."
--Palestinian Authority Prime Minister Abu Mazen quoting Bush when they met in Aqaba; reported in The Haaretz Reporter by Arnon Regula

[Xaccers]

So hang on, lets make sure I've got this straight.
If a quote says something you agree with, it's 100% accurate and unquestionable, but if it says something disproving your view, it's wrong, it's "bile" and twisting events and should be ignored?