Aussies give us our rubbish back

[budwieser]

Originally Posted by andyl

Seems to be for a death penalty thread topic being pursued here whereas this thread.......

Besides I'm sure you don't really think I need to explain my views, not least because I have already stated them.

"Bleeding Hearts" etc etc!

That's me cut to the quick then.

[budwieser]

Not at all Andy, We all have our own views.

What does bleeding hearts mean?Its a stupid phrase.

This is what a posted a couple of months back, this is why i dont like the death penality:

I am against capital punishement.

In the states capital punishment has been shown to be a weak deterrent. The risk of death has no effect on the person who is about to commit the crime. Here is some evidence of that:

States with Capital punishment VS those without
This graph shows the murder rate in states with the death penality and without. Those with it actually have HIGHER rates of murder (link)

Nations with Capital punishment (United states) VS those without
Again, America has the death penality but still they have much higher rates of murder (remember this is based on average not on the amount of people). While i dont think capital punishment increase crime i dont think it reduces it either. This graphs shows it has no effect.

Moving on....The sort of mind-set you would need to be in, to commit the serious and appalling crimes that capital punishment could be used for, would mean they are not going to think of their punishment logically. These are crimes were the person is either mentally unbalanced, emotional, or desperate. Even if they were perfectly sane then they would think they could get away with it anyway. So capital punishment is not effective in reducing crime.

As for prisons being too full then capital punishment is not effective. Very few people are in prison for this type of crime. Serial killers and the worst murders do not make up a large number of the prison population. Most of it is made up of other crimes such as robbery, assault, and crimes linked to drugs etc. So the death penalty will not reduce overcrowding (even if it did, killing people to make space is a stupid idea anyway!!)

Thatââ‚ ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢s before we even get into the difficulties involved with deciding what should be considered a death penalty. Murder? Well murder isnââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t always clear cut, its not a case of someone kills someone in cold blood and thatââ‚ ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢s that! There was one case where a man had come home to his wife and she told him she was cheating on him. She then continued to boost about this and tell him that she never loved him, and that he was a joke. She continues bragging, insulting him and saying it had gone on since before they were married. He lashed out and the resultant blow was enough to kill her. He didnââ‚ ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢t get manslaughter and got charged with murder instead. Should that be enough?

What about someone whose need for drugs has over-powered any sort of logical thinking and he steals to get money for drugs? The victim attempts to stop him and he attacks the victim. Leading to that personââ‚Ã⠀šÃ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢s death? Should that be enough?

Hit and run? Murder out of anger, emotion or desperation? Quite young? Mentally unbalanced? Where do you draw the line?

Capital punishment does not act as a way to reduce crime, reduce prison levels, or keep the public safer. There will always be a case of one or two wrong convictions so it doesnââ‚ƚ¬Ã¢â€žÂ¢t do much for justice either.

Is this nothing more than satisfying the human urge for revenge? And if it is, isnââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t that an awful way to deal with justice? Justice should always been fair and balanced and never should the emotion of a case get in the way

Finally it is far better to let that person sit in a cell for the rest of his life and live with his own conscience than to put him out of his misery quickly

[carlingman]

Seems to me the death penalty is tood good for this little ****.

Arrested 4 times since 1965 and then paroled 3 times and re offended on every occasion and raped a 9 year old boy ffs.

In 2002 they recommended he should be imprisoned indefintely and then the parole board backed down in 2002 and planned his release now due to ill health and age.

I hope he has a painful and terminal ill health.

Australia refuse to have him on their doorstep to reoffend but because he has lived there since the age of 10 and never taken citizenship so yet again it looks as if we will end up being the refuse dump for a scrote like him.

Stick him in cold dark cell and throw away the key and never let him see the light of day again.

Failing that one for PC and doo gooders - stick him on a desert Island with families of children who have been abused and see how long he lasts.

He is nothing more than a sick and still dangerous pervert yet no doubt instead of jailing him for the rest of his days we will end up with our hands in our pockets shelling out to house him, give him anonymity etc etc.

Jailed 4 times paroled 3 times and reoffended 3 times which proves this animal cannot live in the community.

Its about time this goverment reached into their pockets and felt those lumps yes they are called balls and started to use them and actually have the balls on backbone to stand up for themselves.

Rant mode off.

I will calm down, I will calm down, I will calm down.

[Stuart]

Errm, as stated earlier, Australia is perfectly within it's rights to extradite this guy back here. He IS a UK citizen.

Several people appear to be criticising Australia for doing that (including some people who are all for us extraditing criminals that don't have UK citizenship).


As for the death penalty. I'll admit, if a person abused a child of mine, I probably would want to kill the ******* as slowly and painfully as possible, but, the death penalty itself clearly does not work (look at the US for evidence of that)

We need to find a way to stop these people abusing in the first place, not to kill them after they have done it. Killing the abuser will not correct the damage done to the abusee. Preventing them being abused would ensure the damage was never done though.

[allieyoung666]

Yes but it does work in Arab states and it is an effective crime fighting tool. The US are just gun toting manics with nothing else better to do. I remember when Paul had to go over there, he said there was gun shop on every corner, but what do we have peados!! I do not know which is worse!!!

[goldoni]

Well it looks like they are keeping him a little while longer

The deportation of a British-born paedophile from Australia to the UK has been postponed after fresh allegations that he raped a teenage inmate in prison.

Robert Excell, 66, who was due to be put on a flight to London within days, will now stay behind bars for a further three months while the allegations are investigated.

The news was welcomed by a British victim support group which had condemned the decision to deport Excell, branding him a "danger to young boys".

Just proves he is a danger and he just canââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t help himself. Till the day he dies he will see nothing wrong with his sexual behaviour. This man is just evil.

Lawyer John Hammond, who lodged the complaint, said his client claimed he was raped by Excell in a prison in the state capital, Perth, in 1992 and 1998.

The alleged victim was an 18-year-old inmate the first time and the second time, three other prisoners held him down while Excell raped him, Mr Hammond said.

So lets hope he is kept in prison and away from young men.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by allieyoung666

Yes but it does work in Arab states and it is an effective crime fighting tool. The US are just gun toting manics with nothing else better to do. I remember when Paul had to go over there, he said there was gun shop on every corner, but what do we have peados!! I do not know which is worse!!!

They have as big a peado problem over there. We just don't hear about it.

[goldoni]

Originally Posted by scastle

snip: We need to find a way to stop these people abusing in the first place, not to kill them after they have done it. Killing the abuser will not correct the damage done to the abusee. Preventing them being abused would ensure the damage was never done though.

I have a nice pipe cutter that would sort the problem, but that would go against his human rights.

[Stuart]

Originally Posted by goldoni

I have a nice pipe cutter that would sort the problem, but that would go against his human rights.

I mean to solve the problem BEFORE IT OCCURS. I am not advocating protecting Peado's rights, but I don't think smacking seven bells out of somebody solves the problem. It may satisfy an urge for revenge, but that is it.

[goldoni]

Originally Posted by scastle

snip: I mean to solve the problem BEFORE IT OCCURS. I am not advocating protecting Peado's rights, but I don't think smacking seven bells out of somebody solves the problem. It may satisfy an urge for revenge, but that is it.

I would not advocate hitting them with my pipe cutter, far from it. Smacking seven bells out of somebody is reserved for people that break into my house. For serial paedophiles the snip is the only answer, if they donââ‚Âà ‚¬ÃƒÂ¢Ã¢â‚¬Å¾Ã‚¢t have the tackle.

But living in the real world I know this is not the answer, but it would be nice if the problem could be sorted before it happens.

[Paul K]

Originally Posted by scastle

Errm, as stated earlier, Australia is perfectly within it's rights to extradite this guy back here. He IS a UK citizen.

Exactly, we can complain about it all we like but as I put in my thread title we are getting our rubbish back. He is a UK citizen unfortunately and since he never took Australian citizenship we have no choice but to allow him back into the country.

Originally Posted by scastle

Several people appear to be criticising Australia for doing that (including some people who are all for us extraditing criminals that don't have UK citizenship).

Again a good point, we would do exactly the same in their case.. well we would if the EU or the Court of Human Rights would allow us to. Some people seem to forget just how this country got rid of it's criminals a long time ago Didn't we send them somewhere??

Originally Posted by scastle

As for the death penalty. I'll admit, if a person abused a child of mine, I probably would want to kill the ******* as slowly and painfully as possible, but, the death penalty itself clearly does not work (look at the US for evidence of that)

The death penalty may look like the ultimate deterrent to some but as the stats show, it doesn't always work. This has a lot to do with criminals still believing that they can escape detection and therefor they won't have to face the penalty for their crimes. If the detection rate for all crimes were around the 90% mark a lot less people would risk commiting a crime in the first place.

Originally Posted by scastle

We need to find a way to stop these people abusing in the first place, not to kill them after they have done it. Killing the abuser will not correct the damage done to the abusee. Preventing them being abused would ensure the damage was never done though.

Prevention is the best cure as they say but how would you prevent someone from becoming a paedophile or a rapist? We are a long way from that moment in time I fear

[allieyoung666]

So why the hell would we would want, if he has done that while he is inside!!! See I told you once a peado always a peado. And I still stick by the death penalty and I would bloody murder an intruder if I caught them in my house!!!

[Paul K]

Originally Posted by allieyoung666

So why the hell would we would want, if he has done that while he is inside!!! See I told you once a peado always a peado. And I still stick by the death penalty and I would bloody murder an intruder if I caught them in my house!!!

You seem to be missing the point, we don't want him but he's being deported from Australia and since he's still a British citizen he gets sent back to us. Return to sender if you like. I can't see many people (including the paedophile involved) being overly happy about this but there isn't a lot we can do about it.