2010 General Election: The Cable Forum Exit Poll - Page 38

Xaccers · 07-05-2010, 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

The Lib Dem support is scattered across the nation isn't it? That's the problem, where as Labour have strongholds in urban areas and the Tories in rural area, the Lib Dem support is spread thingly over a whole bunch of places never reaching enough to overcome the incumbent party. Which is why they need a very high swing to every get near government.

Anyway I am not saying it wasn't "easy to understand", I am saying that only 7% more people voted Labour yet the seat distribution is unevenly favors them.

It may be fine if you voted for the winner, but it's pretty demoralizing if your voted for the Liberal Democrats and your vote just never bloody matters

Surely it's voter distribution which favors the two main parties.
Hmm, didn't someone recently say they lost out because more voters from a different party turned out, now, who was that?

Personally, I'd prefer the Tory idea of equal population constituencies and keep FPTP.
Why should people be forced to vote for candidates they don't want?

Incidently, for the prior 3 elections, the Tories haven't won, yet I, and them, are not calling for PR.

**Damien** · 07-05-2010, 16:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Surely it's voter distribution which favors the two main parties.
Hmm, didn't someone recently say they lost out because more voters from a different party turned out, now, who was that?

Personally, I'd prefer the Tory idea of equal population constituencies and keep FPTP.
Why should people be forced to vote for candidates they don't want?

Incidently, for the prior 3 elections, the Tories haven't won, yet I, and them, are not calling for PR.

It's not about winning the election, it's about having a majority and total control with 38% of the vote. The Tories do form governments so your views do eventually get represented, you may well have a Tory government soon.

Changing the voting system would mean that more of the electorate gets represented.

Ignitionnet · 07-05-2010, 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by devilincarnate

Trust it to be from SKY ( Daves buddy ) ?

A news outlet reporting the news, a politician discussing events with the news channel he is talking to at the time. This is most unusual, new and interesting.

Didn't realise Tories weren't allowed to talk to Sky News.

John Major has been happily talking with the BBC if it helps with balance, he just wasn't privvy to the above information so couldn't discuss it at the time.

**Hugh** · 07-05-2010, 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyboy

What proportion of the population went to public school?

What proportion of the population are Union Reps or Political Assistants?

devilincarnate · 07-05-2010, 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

A news outlet reporting the news, a politician discussing events with the news channel he is talking to at the time. This is most unusual, new and interesting.

Didn't realise Tories weren't allowed to talk to Sky News.

John Major has been happily talking with the BBC if it helps with balance, he just wasn't privvy to the above information so couldn't discuss it at the time.

Did not mean that , as i am watching the BBC and they say that they have not talked yet so it seems that it is like inside info ?

Xaccers · 07-05-2010, 16:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien

It's not about winning the election, it's about having a majority and total control with 38% of the vote. The Tories do form governments so your views do eventually get represented, you may well have a Tory government soon.

Changing the voting system would mean that more of the electorate gets represented.

The Liberals have formed governments too, and they can again if they work harder. FPTP does not prevent that.

Stuart · 07-05-2010, 16:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyboy

I don't think not liking Thatcher would make her a Labour supporter. I have never heard the rumour that she is, to be honest, but I cannot see her siding with Labour, in opposition to a party made up of old Etonians.

I never said it did. It's apparently on record that she did not like Thatcher. All I said is that I have read rumours that the Queen is actually a Labour supporter. Remember class and upbringing does not necessarily control a person's political belief. I was bought up as a Conservative. I am not. Why? Because I saw what they did, and didn't like it.

Maybe the Queen has done the same?

Angua · 07-05-2010, 17:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaccers

The Liberals have formed governments too, and they can again if they work harder. FPTP does not prevent that.

FPTP actually favours Labour first & Tory second. There are insufficient LibDem/Tory or LibDem/Labour marginals at the present time to gain enough seats to form the government. What this election has shown is that BOTH Labour & Tory no longer have things their own way on the government see-saw.

Ignitionnet · 07-05-2010, 17:10

My only major concern over PR is that I kinda like being able to vote for my MP rather than having to vote purely on national issues. Having an MP assigned to my constituency based on other people's votes isn't a great thought.

They have to be careful. I would be more interested in balancing the constituencies properly for now, along with some other reforms to make things somewhat fairer overall.

Going pure PR doesn't appeal though. A hybrid FPTP / PR would be ideal though I've no idea how that'd work

Angua · 07-05-2010, 17:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

My only major concern over PR is that I kinda like being able to vote for my MP rather than having to vote purely on national issues. Having an MP assigned to my constituency based on other people's votes isn't a great thought.

They have to be careful. I would be more interested in balancing the constituencies properly for now, along with some other reforms to make things somewhat fairer overall.

Going pure PR doesn't appeal though. A hybrid FPTP / PR would be ideal though I've no idea how that'd work

Think how those of us feel in safe seats who haven't voted for the sitting MP ever.

Xaccers · 07-05-2010, 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angua

Think how those of us feel in safe seats who haven't voted for the sitting MP ever.

Imagine if you were forced to either not vote or vote for a candidate you neither knew, wanted, or supported.

punky · 07-05-2010, 17:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angua

Think how those of us feel in safe seats who haven't voted for the sitting MP ever.

Everyone in a consitutency can't get their own way.

If it meant that much to you to have a Lib Dem MP you could always move to a Lib Dem area.

Ignitionnet · 07-05-2010, 17:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angua

Think how those of us feel in safe seats who haven't voted for the sitting MP ever.

That's democracy for you I'm afraid. You can't expect to get your way if the majority in whatever area is covered by the election disagree. In every election some of those who vote will be disappointed.

danielf · 07-05-2010, 17:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xaccers

Imagine if you were forced to either not vote or vote for a candidate you neither knew, wanted, or supported.

Under PR there can be options for voting for specific people. Candidates for a party are generally ranked on the ballot paper, and candidates are assigned to parliament according to that order. Voters can however vote for a specific person and if this person gets enough votes they can leapfrog candidates that are ahead of them in the queue. Thus, number 15 on the list could get into parliament at the expense of #10 for a party that wins 10 seats.

Also, under PR you tend to have more parties, thus further increasing the choice.

---------- Post added at 17:45 ---------- Previous post was at 17:42 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet

That's democracy for you I'm afraid. You can't expect to get your way if the majority in whatever area is covered by the election disagree. In every election up to 49.9% of those who vote will be disappointed.

Not if you have a coalition. The combined parties can have 60% of the vote, which means that only 40% of those who voted did not vote for one of the parties in government. Under FPTP that number can be higher than 60.

Angua · 07-05-2010, 17:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by punky

Everyone in a consitutency can't get their own way.

If it meant that much to you to have a Lib Dem MP you could always move to a Lib Dem area.

The current system effectively disenfranchises a huge number of voters who live in "safe" seats of whichever party. Only those in marginal seats actually have a vote truly worth casting. This is what is wrong with the current system. The FPTP creates "safe" seats which can lead to complacent MP's who just ride the gravy train knowing as long as they don't stick their noses over the parapet they have a job for life.